TR2/3/3A TR3/4 Oil Pan Gasket

[Geo Hahn]

As I recall, the oil pan gasket from the usual suppliers is of the thick gasket material kind (sorta thickish balck or gray paper). Is there any reason why one should not make this gasket out of cork -- say 1/16" or 1/8"?

Seems like cork would be a bit more forgiving of any imperfections on the pan lip, giving a better chance of a leak-free seal.

I am aware of the need to flatten any dimpling around the holes (does not appear necessary on mine) and sealing the gasket to the pan whilst it is lying updside down on a sheet of glass (to assure a really flat surface is presented to the block.

Any other tricks?

What is best for sealing the gasket to the pan -- RTV? Aviation Form-a-Gasket?

Thanks!

 

[mrv8q]

Hey, Geo, I put the thick paper one from TRF last year on my '3, and used Hylomar. Very happy w/ the results; it cured most of the oil leaks from the car. The old gasket was so thin and brittle, it didn't provide much "gasketing".

 

[Darrell_Walker]

Not a direct answer to your question, but I have a silicone gasket from Justin Wagner.

However, I don't seem them on his web site, but it also doesn't look like he's updated it in a very long time. Anyway, I've been very happy with it, though I'm using it with an alloy sump.

 

[TR3driver]

I believe Justin deliberately removed the pan gasket from the market and no longer supplies them. He said he planned to do some more development, but as far as I know it's not happened yet.

Cork should do fine, although I suspect you'll find it actually cheaper to buy a ready-made gasket than that much gasket cork. And as usual, I prefer Hylomar for gasket dressing.

Had mine pretty well sealed, until doing the gearbox R&R again. Looks like supporting the engine under the pan is a Bad Idea.

 

[Member 10617]

I don't see an oil pan gasket listed in the TRF catalogs for the TR3 (only for the TR4). Can someone give me the part number for the gasket for the TR3 in the TRF catalog? Many thanks.

Is a good cork gasket available? .... from Moss?

Also, I have read that replacing the oil pan gasket is "messy and difficult." "Messy," yes; but "difficult"? Except for perhaps having to flatten out the rim where the holes may have been bent by over tightening, I don't see what would be difficult, unless it's the matter of crawling under the car to get at the bolts. Am I missing something?

 

[TR3driver]

As I've mentioned many times before (to the point I've been accused of being a shill for them), TRF does not publish a "full" catalog for the TR3. That is a real shame, as I think it frustrates (and intimidates) many of their potential customers. But the only complete listing on the website is the "parts database", which covers all the parts they carry (and some they don't).
https://secure.zeni.net/trf/

So, you need a copy of the factory Spare Parts Catalogue. TRF sells reprints, or there is a PDF version that can be downloaded from https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B2H2NJt...Y4&hl=en_US

Original P/N (from the SPC) is 56646, which TRF has cross-referenced to 211123. (The note in the PDF is a typo, which I'll fix in a moment.) It is fiber, fairly thick, and preferable to cork (IMO).

I would call the job reasonably straightforward; the main difficulty is that you are laying under the car, looking more or less straight up into the dirt that falls in your eyes. But it can be a little tricky to maneuver the pan around in the limited space (unless you have a service pit or rack), without banging it against the oil pickup screen (which is kind of easy to damage). It's also best (IMO) to loosen the support rod for the clutch slave before removing (or installing) it's pan bolt. Then afterwards you have to readjust the support rod.

Watch the bolt length, there are 3 oddball bolts (of two different lengths) that go in specific locations. I would also suggest new lockwashers all around, as the originals tend to lose their tension.

 

[Geo Hahn]

Ed -- The cork option would have been homemade, maybe I was just looking for something to do indoors (air conditioned) while I waited for the bearings to arrive. Now that I have it all cleaned up the surfaces look so nice I will probably go with the ready-made version.

...Watch the bolt length, there are 3 longer bolts (of two different lengths) that go in specific locations...

Okay -- I can see that the bolts for the slave bracket and the bolt for the road draft tube need to be longer -- do you recall where the third one would be?

Of course most of the bolt holes go straight thru, only a couple are in danger of bottoming out.

 

[TR3driver]

Oops, my bad. I knew there there 3 oddballs and 3 different lengths, but the third odd-length bolt is shorter than the others, and goes into the alloy sealing block at the front.

 

[Geo Hahn]

Thanks -- yes, upon carefully measuring I can see that the hole in the front alloy block is not quite as deep.

 

[Member 10617]

Randall. In fact, I started this process by looking up the part number in my copy of the Spare Parts Catalog, and then entered the number (56646) in TRF's parts database... and came up with nothing. I didn't know that TRF had cross-referenced this to 211123.

I had the gasket on my oil pan replaced and new screws put in about a year ago, but there is still some leaking going on. I thought I'd try it again myself, but what Randall says about the danger of damaging the oil pickup screen leads me to think that I'd better leave it alone.

One thing, however. The screws holding the pan, before I had the gasket replaced, all had lock washers. The shop that did the work did not install lock washers, with one exception (!). At the very least, I might remove the screws one by one and add lock washers, and then tighten to the recommended torque of 14 to 16 ft. lbs. I would also clean the screws carefully and treat them just under the lock washer with a little gasket sealant, not enough to get into the oil pan itself. Perhaps that will help.

 

[sail]

Just checked the shed. Two or three year old part #211123 from TRF is cork or a cork composite? as it seems to have some black mixed between the usual light cork color. It is not paper. Quick measure appears slightly over 1/16".

 

[TR3driver]

In fact, I started this process by looking up the part number in my copy of the Spare Parts Catalog, and then entered the number (56646) in TRF's parts database... and came up with nothing.

Hmm, well, I can't explain that. I'm pretty sure the listing was there last year when I dropped the pan, but I bought a "conversion" gasket set instead of just the single gasket, so I'm not positive. But it's certainly there now:

 

[TRMark]

I am replacing the pan gasket on my TR4 also. I called around to find hylomar, none of the parts stored carry it, not even NAPA. I gave the NAPA counterman the Permatex number, he said it was a great product but they haven't carried it in over a year, he did not know why it was dropped.

Wudda ya think is next best?

 

[DNK]

Gt it from HF, you'll have to order it.
I ordered mine from someone.
In fact need another tube for the Wedge assembly

 

[TR3driver]

Gt it from HF, you'll have to order it.

HF seems to have stopped carrying it as well. My impression was that they bought one huge lot of it as abandoned freight or whatever (which after all, is how they got started in business) and now it's gone. But it was "Racing Formula" anyway, which I don't like as well as "Universal Blue". For one thing, at least the tubes I got from HF, it tends to separate in the tube so the consistency is inconsistent.

 

[DNK]

Universal Blue is what I have. It's not on their web site anymore?

 

[Darrell_Walker]

A FLAPS (Baxter's) here has the racing formula. The main difference is that the racing formula has acetone, which quickly evaporates to make it thicker (and more sticky). I've not yet disassembled anything put together with the racing formula, but it doesn't seem as it would come apart as easily.

Moss carries the Hylomar M. I have a tube I haven't opened, so I don't know how it compares to the racing formula or the universal blue. The description sounds more like the universal blue.

PS Be careful in searching, the racing formula is often packaged as "Hylomar Universal Blue Racing Formula".

 

[Geo Hahn]

Of course Hylomar is available from Moss (2 formulas):

https://www.mossmotors.com/Shop/ViewProducts.aspx?PlateIndexID=98660&SortOrder=2

When HF had it my wife bought all they had less one -- she is so considerate -- she left one there so the next guy could find it. Never saw it again. So far haven't noticed the separation issue so perhaps I have a life time supply.

Ed - you definitely want good lockwasher under those bolts and doing them one at a time will work. I always do the final tightening back & forth working from the center of the pan outward (sorta like a head) though perhaps that's anal.

Randall's warning about the oil pickup screen is more of a good reminder than a reason not to attempt this. If you look at how the baffle (or whatever it is called) on the pan interacts to fit around the oil pickup you can visualize what you need to be aware of as you remove the pan. I can send a photo if need be.

 

[DNK]

Flaps??

 

[Darrell_Walker]

OK, the "M" seems the same as the racing formula (has acetone), the "advanced formula" is perhaps the same as the non-racing.

It gets confusing because I think Moss gets theirs from the UK, vs. the licensed/repackages/whatever versions from Permatex.