okay, ANOTHER question for British owners of MKII

[Deleted member 8987]

Getting the "tag" sorted out.

But, got a new dilemna.
Seems the JCNA Judging Guide states the Boot Lid shall have:

Jaguar
2.4L
and in the lower right, MK2.

Mine has the "MK2", inspection of the underside of the boot lid shows no holes for the rest (they were mounted above the license light/backup light).

My gen-u-wine Jaguar 2.4L MK2 Parts Book shows ONLY the "MK2" as a bit on the lid proper.

Anybody confirm this for me on a 2.4L in England?

Thanks!

 

[Steve]

I don't think that they had the badges advertising displacement in the UK. The MK2 certainly, but I can't recall seeing any displacement badges back there. I have plenty of reference photos, I'll have to take a look.

 

[Deleted member 8987]

Thanks!
The "book" shows ONLY the MK2 tag.
Careful inspection of the underside of the boot lid shows there are cutouts in the inner bracing, but no holes in the lid proper, nor repaired holes, filled holes, or any such thing, in the area above the backup light/license light chrome piece.

Boy, is this fun.

Maybe I'm just "different", but I don't go drilling holes and changing things because some book written 40+ years after the manufacture of this vehicle says it needs to be there.

I remember many years ago, someone wrote "the difinitive book" on 1949-1951 Fords, in which they stated all (low line) DeLuxe vehicles had "sand" painted interior trim (dash, window surrounds), and ALL (high-line) Customs had metallic gray.

DeLuxe had no chrome arrows at the end of the dash, while Customs did.
I have (still) a "DeLuxe" dash, no holes for the chrome, in metallic gray.

Seems the writer ONLY had experience with east-coast vehicles (primarily Atlanta-built), while mine was Richmond, California.

Was that a fight, or what?

If you have something, that would be helpful.

On the "Made in England" tag, IF the vehicle was sold in the UK, or shipped to a "small" Commonwealth area, no tag, especially if sold and licensed in the UK and shipped afterwards by the dealer/manufacturer.

Is that a sticky wicket, or what?

Now I have to await the "Heritage Certificate" to confirm.

 

[DrEntropy]

Maybe I'm just "different", but I don't go drilling holes and changing things because some book written 40+ years after the manufacture of this vehicle says it needs to be there.

Nope! There would be very few who'd attack the boot lid with a drill-bit here for no justified reason. If there's no evidence they (the holes) weren't there to begin with there's certainly no reason to introduce 'em! I've a "Factory Workshop Manual" for that car and it has no illustration of the boot lid. Wish it were diff'rent, but that's all I can contribute.

 

[Jack64nm]

The bootlid should have JAGUAR and 3.8, 3.4 or 2.4 badge, but I have seen a number of cars here with only the MK 2 badge.

I can recommend "Original Jaguar MkI/MkII" by Nigel Thorley as a good guide to originality.

 

[Deleted member 8987]

Been doing some checking.
240's had the tags, but even show winning 2.4L cars do NOT have the "Jaguar" or the "2.4L" tags.

The 2.4L ARE different!

I am in communication with Nigel, so we'll see.

 

[Deleted member 8987]

Nigel tells me cars sold in and for the UK did NOT have the "Made in England" tag.
His book also states that the 2.4L did NOT have the displacement tag on the boot lid.

I am awaiting a reply on the "Jaguar" tag, as he does not mention it one way or the other.

I know of at least one 2.4L show-winner, where the owner was convinced he had those tags, and went and looked, and he does not!
Original paint, no holes.

So, my drill motor stays put!

 

[Steve]

Good for you! I know Nigel Thorley from the inception of the Jaguar Enthusiasts Club in the UK. He's a good guy, and has a wealth of knowledge with Jaguars, MK2's in particular.

 

[Jack64nm]

If you have any specific questions, I will be meeting Nigel on Tuesday, as he shall be a guest at our local "ride and drive" (chance to have a go in everyone elses Jag!)

 

[Deleted member 8987]

I have e-mailed him and am waiting for a reply on the "Jaguar" boot tag.
It is NOT listed in the 2.4L official parts manual, original cars with original paint inspected do not have such.

Got a new one, too.

On MK2's, the "Guide" states that the stoplight switch is screwed into the brake slave cylinder.

Not on my 2.4L. And, according to the 2.4L Parts Book, the switch screws into a special 4-way fitting which is bolted to the innder right wing.

Boy, is this fun, or what?

 

[fncycat]

Hello Jack,

I have anothe question that you ,might ask Nigel.
In his book Original Jaguar Mark 1/11 he states that that 3.4 Litre Mark 1's were fitted with a speedometer calibrated to 140 MPH from the factory.
I have never seen a Mark 1 with a 140 MPH speedometer, all of the ones that I have seen for UK or US distribution go to 120 MPH.

Could you possibly ask if he might be mistaken?

 

[LarryK]

Just looked at mine, built just after the great fire. 120MPH speedo. It'll only do 99mph with the 4:27 rear. I'm changing it to a MKII axle with 3:08, guess I'd better put in the MKII speedo or XKE as well.

 

[Deleted member 8987]

Will the MKII axle fit under the MKI?
I thought the body tapered down narrower on a MKI, hence the narrower axle.

 

[LarryK]

Combs substitute, bolts right in, then the front and rear have same track therefore, you would then have to use Combs skirts. Was a period update in the 60s. No spacers needed to widen the stance. I have 2 MK2 axles and figure I can change ratios at same time. Parted to different MK2 and have a 3:08 (4 speed) and a 3:27? (4 speed) , the MK1 is a 4:28 (auto). The MK1 body tapers but the undercarriage is the same.

 

[Deleted member 8987]

I did discover yesterday that if said 2.4L MKII had an automatic transmission, there would have been a tag saying "Automatic" about where the "Jaguar" went.

Another bit of information I came across last night:

This from one of Nigel Thorley's books:
MKII Production Data:

2.4L, RHD 21,768, LHD 3,405.
3.4L, RHD 22,095, LHD 6,571.
3.8L, RHD 15,383, LHD 14,758.

Looks like RHD was 59,246 units, LHD was 24,734.
The focus on LHD cars I have seen elsewhere certainly does not correspond to the totals.
And, when dealing with 2.4L and 3.4L only, it's far greater.

43,863 RHD units, 9976 LHD units.

Add up ALL the LHD MKII's built, 24,734, compare to JUST the RHD 2.4L of 21,768, in all three versions were only 2,966 more!

Ain't numbers grand?

 

[Jack64nm]

TOC, I will ask about the badges and the speedo. The brake switch should be attached to the four way block (pretty standard stuff for cars of the period). I haven't ever seen a sensor on a slave cylinder (master cylinder perhaps?) Sounds like a misprint as the wiring would have to go to the suspension (like ABS).

Last weekend I was at the Jaguar Northern Day here in UK. Lots of 2.4, 3.4 and Mk2 cars to see.

 

[Deleted member 8987]

Thanks, Jack.
Not sure if a mis-print or not.
My questions on these items has certainly ruffled some feathers.
With the people who have been following this, some who own RHD 2.4L MK2's, the next meeting or two may be highly entertaining.

 

[Jack64nm]

Talked with Nigel Thorley yesterday, nice chap.

He confirmed that there was no 2.4 badge fitted to the Mk2, but the Jaguar badge (and Automatic if appropriate) was fitted.

He also confirmed that the 3.4 (Mk1) was fitted with the 140 mph speedo.

 

[Deleted member 8987]

Except.......all photos of 2.4L MKII's show NO Jaguar badge, original paint cars have no holes, repaired or otherwise, and the J.33 Jaguar Spare Parts Catalog dated April 1964 shows ONLY the "MK2" tag or the additional "Automatic" tag if so equipped.

That's not to say someone didn't think they were supposed to have said tag, and dug out the Makita, kind of like the 1953 Ford with US Federal side marker lights installed.

Can someone show me in their 2.4L parts catalog where the Jaguar tag is found?
The reason I ask that is one never knows, it seems.
I found the choke cable in the "electrical" section, and the "dynamo adjusting link" in the timing chain section!

You want a good one?

The information out there is that ALL MKII's got the "Jockey Pulley" in 1961.
So, I and others were quite confused when we saw no such thing on out vehicles.
The 1964 Parts Catalog shows the "dynamo adjusting link" EXACTLY as on our cars, flat plate, slotted at each end, one end slotted longer than the other, with a spacer.
Not a lot of room on a 2.4L with the shorter deck height.

Nobody with an original 2.4L MKII so far has the "Jaguar" tag, nor holes for same.
The presence of said tag is not proof, as anyone can drill holes and mount one.
The lack of holes on original paint is a stronger case to support the Factory Parts Catalog!

 

[fncycat]

I have spoken with Nigel as well, and agree he is a nice fellow, and the certainly one of the world authorities on Jaguar.

However, on this point, I can find absolutely no corroborating information.
For example, at www.saloondata.com, there are photos of many 3.4 litre Mark 1's.
All, where the speedos are marked in MPH, scale to 120.

I attended the 50th anniversary in Coventry, and reviewed dozens of very original 3.4 Litre cars which attended. With one exception the MPH cars went to 120.
The exception was the Hawthorne replica, which was fitted with one which went to 160 mph, as Mike had done.

I took a poll of owners on the Jag-lovers forum, no one owned or could remember seeing a 3.4 Litre with anything nut a 120 MPH speedo.

In Nigel's own book, the 3.4 Litre shows with a 120 MPH speedo!

When Nigel's says the Mark 1 was fitted with 140 MPH speedo, I wonder which car he is referring to?