How low is too low? [spring question]

[warwick-steve]

Hi all
Another question please to those long term owners.
I am thinking about having new rear springs fitted to my BT7. I think it sits a bit too low but does it matter? - How low is too low?
Fitted with new Veredstein 165 x 15 Sprint Classic tyres the dimension from ground to wheel arch apex is 67cm on nearside and 65cm on offside.
???
Thanks for your help
Steve

 

[steveg]

The tires are pretty small.

 

[John Turney]

Hi all
.... I think it sits a bit too low but does it matter? - How low is too low?
....
Steve

It's too low when it doesn't look right to you.
It's too low when you scrape coming out of your driveway.
It's too low when you can't drive to the pub without scraping.
It may be too low when you get high-centered (stuck and can't move) on a dead squirrel.

 

[Keoke]

IT is too low when you bottom out going over small bumps

 

[warwick-steve]

Ok, Ok --- got the message. Seems I have got some way to go before I am anywhere near grounding so I'll live with it for now. I quickly developed my technique for avoiding rocks, speed bumps, road kill etc and so far have had no problems.
Steve

 

[DerekJ]

Post a picture so we can see what it looks like. Rather have it a bit low than a bit high, which doesn't look right. You are always going to bottom out on something with a Healey.

 

[vette]

A 165/80-15 tire has a diameter of 25.4 inches. I believe 65 cm is about 25 inches. If that is the height of your wheel arch I would be a little concerned. Here is a pic of my BJ7. It has 165/15 tires on it. I would not want it any lower. Bumps, squirrels and other such road kill. I often think that I will just make sure I avoid road kill, but one day I was motoring down a 2 lane road and I was approaching a road kill right in the middle of my lane. All of a sudden I realized that I could not move out to the other lane because of approaching traffic, I got on the binders and had to come to almost a complete stop with nothing in front of me but the small dead animal, the car behind me almost eat my back end.

 

[warwick-steve]

Hi Derek and vette
Thanks for your replies.
I will attempt to attach a picture of the drivers side (offside) of my car.
I just measured the ground clearance of the chassis. Taken midway along the chassis the lowest dimension, ignoring the centre seam is approx 4in - 3 7/8 in on the offside and approx 4 1/16 in on the nearside. (I note the ground clearance in the workshop manual is 4 5/8in but I don't know if this is under the box section or under the seam.) The clearance under the exhaust box is 3in.
The car looks fine, not obviously low but I am aware that it is lower than what it ideally should be. It rides fine, no bottoming out and no lower than some other I have seen etc. Just a thought that maybe i should consider new springs at some point.
( I selected the image, hopefully it will be attached!!)

Thanks for your help
Steve

 

[John Turney]

Here's a comparison side view of mine. The rear springs were new and the front was lowered about 19mm. The tires are 195/65-15, with a diameter of ~24.5 " (622mm).

 

[CLEAH]

Steve, for reference, my car has 185/70-15 tires. The rear wheel arch is 25 1/2 inches (65cm) to the apex. Ground clearance below the silencers is 3 1/4 inches (83mm). I don't bottom on anything in normal driving.

 

[bob hughes]

Could not lower mine if a wanted to - exhaust is already grounding getting out of my drive - nightmare.!

Looking for a nice side exit exhaust system and a flash pair of ear defenders to go with it



Bob

 

[warwick-steve]

Hi Bob, Hugh and John
Thanks for the latest info. All useful and reassuring.
Cheers
Steve

 

[vette]

Steve, I think if it is not causing you any trouble, don't worry about it.

 

[warwick-steve]

Thanks, yes, doesn't seem so bad, haven't had any problems so will live with it
Cheers
Steve

 

[CLEAH]

Thanks, yes, doesn't seem so bad, haven't had any problems so will live with it
Cheers
Steve

Steve, your car looks sharp! That's all that matters, and isn't that why we drive these beautiful cars?

 

[RAC68]

Hi Steve,

As I have found and observed, the proper height of a Big Healey's rear suspension is based more on owner preference and needed ground clearance then official specification. However, keep in mind that my height observations are made within the context and limits of the specific suspension design and components available for application (i.e. spring type, wheels and tire selection, etc.).

Attached. is a driver's side picture of my BJ8 Phase 1 which incorporates the same rear suspension and frame as your BT7. As tiy cab seem. my measurements were made with 165x15 Vredesteins on wires. However, my original springs were reinforced with an extra second leaf to improve stiffness.



It should also be noted that, due to many operational stresses, left and right side measurements may differ slightly and it is not uncommon to see the left side of a left hand drive Healey standing a little lower then the right. Also, since most outer panels are fitted for best match to adjacent panels, it is very possible that one fender may be slightly higher then its opposite when taking measurements relative to the ground.

From what I have experienced, raising the rear height of a Healey is more a matter of component change rather then adjustment. with the axel above the frame and spring attached below the axel, the common way of adding spacers between axel and spring will lower, rather then lift the body. As a result, the only way to raise body height is to either increase spring tension, raise its front mounting point, or increase tire/wheel diameter. Of these, the easiest is mount new tires with spring replacement coming in second. However, all approaches are limited in the amount of additional height they can apply.



My suggestion, enjoy your Healey now. You will find plenty you will want or need to do soon enough.

Hope this helps,
Ray(64BJ8P1)

 

[EV2239]

Springs don't just sage but tend to lose temper as well. Two things happen as a result:

1. As the back drops so you tip the king pins back, make the steering heavier and lose a little directional stability.

2. Because they're a bit weaker as well, the back is more prone to swing out. If your sway bar bushes are below par this gets worse.

New springs make a bigger improvement than you'll expect, but use standard ones.

 

[RAC68]

Springs don't just sage but tend to lose temper as well. Two things happen as a result:

1. As the back drops so you tip the king pins back, make the steering heavier and lose a little directional stability.

2. Because they're a bit weaker as well, the back is more prone to swing out. If your sway bar bushes are below par this gets worse.

New springs make a bigger improvement than you'll expect, but use standard ones.

Although I don't think Steve's springs are at the stage of causing noticeable difficulty, you make good points and changing rear springs is not that difficult. However, finding proper replacements or someone to re-arch/temper originals has become almost impossible. Yes, new springs are available from a number of parts houses (i.e. Moss, etc.), however, it has become common to hear that these new and/or re-arched sets of springs have initially place the rear high into the air before they settle/sag over the year to below the height of those replaced. When considering your points, they also would apply when new springs push the body high into the air and tip the suspension in the opposite direction.

If I want to replace rear leaf springs on my car today, I would call or email Martin at Jule Enterprises for guidance. Although Jule many not be as convenient from the U.K, I would bet others could provide the name of a reputable spring suppliers and/or servicers that is more reasonably local.

Sorry to say, this is not an unfamiliar issue on this forum and often provoked extensive discussion.

Ray(64BJ8P1)

 

[EV2239]

Steve is lucky because he's close to experts.

https://www.jones-springs.co.uk/

 

[warwick-steve]

Thanks guys for taking time to post the information. All very interesting.
Away from home so not able to do more checking. I think all is ok for the moment but will check out for future reference, sourcing and fitting new standard springs. Have been directed to a local supplier of good replacement springs
Cheers
Steve