TR6 Newbie with a TR6 engine problem

[vettedog72]

Don't use a volt meter on the spark plug wires. These wires cary very high voltage, 15,000 to 40,000 volts. If any voltage was out there you may not have a working volt meter any more.

 

[Bruno_69z28]

Your coil has three wires. One to ingnition, one to the distributor and one large one to the distributor cap (center). With the ignition on, put your voltmeter from a ground source to the ignition wire and give us your reading.

 

[skikir]

I still think the condenser. You may have re wired it wrong or the condenser is bad. Pull the condenser and put an Ohm meter across it. If the meter (has a needle) the resistance should be low then go high. Reverse the leads and the resistance will go low to high again. If the resistance stays low then the condenser is shorted. If the resistance stays high then it is open. Think of it as the ohm meter filling a can with air, as the air first goes in there is low pressure as the can gets full the pressure goes high until the pressure equallizes to the applied pressure. A short is like a hole in the can so the pressure stays low, an open is like the can being full of water, the pressure is high to start. It is not uncommon to get a new bad condensor.

 

[renindy]

tr6ster,

A diagram for your tr6 is available for free download at:
https://www.advanceautowire.com
Although a Haynes manual or some other comprehensive manual will (though they are not perfect!) be a helpful reference.
Either should help you nagivate your way around the coil.

Good luck, & keep us posted!
Don
79 MGB

 

[BobSands]

Hey tr6ster... How did it turn out? I sorta felt like we must have led you astray. Was the problem carb based or electrical, or some of both?
Take care Bob

 

[piman]

Hello TR6ster,

"Another dumb one- is 1 at the front or rear of the engine?
"

In the case of most cars, yes but it is a convention. Jaguar Cars, for many years, used the opposite and number one was the rear cylinder.

Alec

 

[tr6ster]

Well- after changing the points, condenser, dist cap, spark wires, ignition coil, spark plugs and battery it still won't start.

In fact, it is digressing. 1 week ago the starter would turn the engine, it just wouldn't fire.

Now I get nothing, no click, no engine turn.

Question to throw out there- where is the starter relay. I need to start there and work my way through powering the starter.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Brosky]

Did you get the wiring diagram yet? You will need it. Is the battery up to a full charge and will it take a load test and still hold voltage? You need to start with a known good source of power before you try to determine the problem with the "no turn over".

 

[tr6ster]

Yes-

I have been trying to follow the diagram. If someone could explain the sequence I would appreciate it- Ignition switch to starter relay to starter solenoid to ign coil, etc.

And where is that bloody starter relay?

I have a brand new battery, plenty of amps.

 

[vettedog72]

There is no starter relay; the high current supplied to the starter is done with the solenoid, which is mounted, directly to the starter.

I suspect you have a more fundamental problem (and much less expensive) like bad connections, possibly at the ignition switch? I don't have any schematics at hand, so I cannot give you a step by step list to check; however, I would check the physical connections on the starter to be sure they are secure.

 

[martx-5]

[ QUOTE ]
There is no starter relay; the high current supplied to the starter is done with the solenoid, which is mounted, directly to the starter.


[/ QUOTE ]

This wiring diagram (scroll down to '74) shows a starter relay seperate and distinct from the starter. It first shows up in '74. It also has a solenoid relay for the high current mounted on the starter.

I don't know where that other starter relay is located.

 

[tr6ster]

Mines a 74.

So when the key is turned, a current path opens for high current to the starter solenoid, and then a secondary current goes through the starter relay to the ignition coil?

I have been reading 5 volts across the ignition coil terminals, it never gets to 12. I'm not sure that means anything.

 

[martx-5]

Just looking at the wiring diagram, it appears as if the current goes from the ignition switch to the starter relay, then down to the starter solenoid. The starter relay (at the "C4") connection also supplies the 12V to the ignition coil for starting. The best that I can see here is that the the "start" circuit from the ignition switch leaves on the WR (white/red) wire to some connector where it exits as a WO (white/orange) wire, and that runs up to the coil in the starter relay (NOT the ignition coil)as "W1" connector. The coil then grounds at "W2" and activates the starter relay. The contacts close and send current to terminals "C1" to the starter solenoid and "C4" to the ignition coil.

I've got a gut feeling that you are losing it in that connector where the WR and WO wires meet. Either way, you are going to have to find this starter relay to take some voltage readings and find out where you are losing it. After looking at this diagram for awhile, I'm pretty sure how everything works, so once you find this relay, diagnosis shouldn't be too difficult. I'm sure me or someone else can walk you through it.

 

[bash]

My'75 has the starter relay on the driver's side inner wing, to the rear of the fusebox and below the horn relay (assuming you have two relays there, the one with most wires is the starter relay).

Hope that helps
Alistair

 

[vettedog72]

matrix-5
You are correct, there is a starter relay. Guess I was thinking of the '76. Since my TR6 is a '74, it will be worth knowing where this device is located. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

[tr6ster]

Found it! It appears that a previous owner has done a bit of rewiring.

The wire from the starter relay to the ign coil appears to be cut, perhaps the relay went bad and is being bypassed and not used. The seat belt stuff (also connected to the relay) has never worked and this might explain it.

The smaller wire from the starter solenoid goes into the dashboard, as well as an insulated wire from the positive terminal of the ignition coil. I guess I need to track those wires down inside the dash.

The previous owner also repainted the car, whomever painted it dusted the engine compartment and covered most of the wires, so tracking wire colors has been very difficult.

Thanks for the help so far.

 

[vettedog72]

Did you ever resolve the "dead starter" problem and figure out what the relay does?

 

[tr6ster]

I still think the starter relay and seat belt module has been jumpered, and it has been wired like an older TR6. I still can't trace the starter solenoid "trigger" wire back into the dash. I imagine it's wired directly to the ignition switch. That's where I am going to look next.

There are a lot of new splices, and the person who repainted the car painted the engine compartment and sprayed the wires. So the color wires are all painted over, making it even more difficult.

I am getting no click at all when I turn the ignition. Can someone explain how the numbers on the wire diagram correspond to the 1,2,3, start positions on the switch?

Thanks.

 

[tr6ster]

Going back to an old post...

I was coming off a freeway last year and when I tried to accelerate I couldn't get it to go over 10-15 MPH. The engine wouldn't get over 1800 RPM.

Turns out it was a couple of torn diaphrams in the Strombergs.

Also a previous owner had put the choke assembly back together backwards so it wasn't choking correctly.

Getting it fixed also led to a new master brake cylinder, clutch cylinder. Oh the horror.

 

[achtungeveryone]

tr6ster,
I'm with the others suspecting a loose connection or bad ign. component because you stated it was running great and you had not previously been experiencing engine problems. That's your biggest clue right there. I can see how you may suspect that the engine has jumped time but you need to get spark out of you distributor for the thing to run. Now i wonder if your starter not turning over is from the normal drain from working this problem out or a loose starter connection...these big wires need to be tight and secure. Have you checked the point gap? (if you are running point, that is). Be sure to review the posts you've recieved on this thread as I don't think you could get better advice.

Keep us posted!

Achtung