adding a second fuel pump

[IanIrving]

It's a while since I posted because my BJ8 is running so well, I've had no problems to ask about. I followed a thread on this forum maybe two years ago about adding a facet pump in series with the SU pump switched as a standby pump but can't now find the thread. I did it on both my Healey and my E Type and it has saved me a couple of times. Can someone point me to it please.
Thanks

Ian Irving

 

[Legal Bill]

This thread?

https://www.britishcarforum.com/bcf...ack-up/page2&highlight=Facet+fuel+pump+Healey

 

[IanIrving]

Thanks Bill
That'll do.
Ian

 

[andrea]

https://picasaweb.google.com/112770...dMayJune2013?noredirect=1#5618900936475943682
Here a photo of my installation - very simple the oldest steel fuel pipe was cut and the system integrated by a FACET pump with a BIG FORD filter that can be ommited if your fuel tank is new or less deposit problems
some shorts rubber fuel pipes are necessary to complete the modification- advise me if more help is needed

 

[RAC68]

Hi Ian,

I have followed a number of threads addressing the addition of a backup fuel pump and the creation and/or acquisition of a more reliable pump and have always been left wondering if and why my Healey's pump is that much less reliable then my daily driver. First, over the many decades I have owned and driven my Healey, I have never had a pump failure. Should I be concerned...with all the concerns voiced on the forum. I use my family car every day and don't give that a second thought so why are we so concerned that our Healey's pump will fail and leave us stranded?

At one point, the replacement electronic Lucas fuel pump seemed also susceptible to high voltage as the imbedded coil induces over 200 volts. However, with todays electronic versions or the installation of a Transient-Voltage Suppression (TVS) diode across my points-triggered Lucas pump that will shunt to ground excess power over a limit (I chose 25 volts), power is better regulated and or under $! US will allow the points to last for almost ever.

I do carry a separate Lucas full pump trigger head so I can replace the top coil and trigger portion of the pump (without disconnecting the fuel lines or body. However, although the replacement has been tested, it has never been required.

Although I can appreciate the experiences of others and don't want the challenge my luck, I wonder how many times others have found it necessary to switch to their alternate pump.

All the best,
Ray (64BJ8P1)

 

[andrea]

Hi Ray
I have experienced on a MG TF of my friend the LUCAS PUMP issue just few meter from his mechanic -BUT on a UP hill- the TF have the pump down near the RH wheel on one position that the (worthless) hammer was knead with difficulty,lying down
On my MG TD the oldest LUCAS pump (in a most intelligent position , in the engine bay)haven't any problem in 8 years, but some time ago I have added the transient Diode (better the prevention, that the up hill exercise) BUT a squared FACET pump are on my travel bag
LUCAS pump I admit- haven't one good nomination - FACET PUMP are considered very reliable in the time, near the perfect affordability- I have observed some PUMP trouble on modern VW cars- but this are one other story
in the restoration of my AH I have preferred -the double pump system - my LUCAS PUMP are new and with the transient Diode MOD- but I have a FACET Silver Type,as daily PUMP (i have opted for the cylindrical type for more fuel capacity)
Probably my choice are founded on my intention to mount in the next future 3XWEBER 45- not for mistrust on LUCAS....or may be for the position of the PUMP???

 

[Legal Bill]

FWIW, the diodes are nothing new. We used to replace original pumps with diode pumps in the late 70s and early 80s. They would fail as well. Maybe they are better now.

My experience comes form the days that these cars were used as transportation and not entertainment. Not only would the pumps fail, but they would be quite difficult to replace. fittings often seized up and the bolts would sometimes break. It also was not uncommon for the steel lines to break during replacement. Again, these were cars that were driven regularly in the northeast and rust was always a big problem. So having been stranded myself in the full line of BMC/British Leyland offerings I think it makes sense to have an alternate pump on board to get you home.

And with all that said, I still have not installed mine. I look under the hood and think of places to put it that will not require new holes in the chassis or any cuts in my nice new stainless steel fuel lines. I think I have something figured out, but it will take some work.

 

[Bob_Spidell]

... I use my family car every day and don't give that a second thought so why are we so concerned that our Healey's pump will fail and leave us stranded?

'Modern' fuel pumps--the high-pressure kind for FI that are usually located in the tank and are a bear to get to--also fail, and not uncommonly (the pumps rely on fuel for cooling; that's why it's not a good idea to run an FI car too low on fuel).

 

[andrea]

'Modern' fuel pumps--the high-pressure kind for FI that are usually located in the tank and are a bear to get to--also fail, and not uncommonly (the pumps rely on fuel for cooling; that's why it's not a good idea to run an FI car too low on fuel).

Tanks BOB
I asked me why the VW PASSAT have this complicate solution - and heavy work for substitution - of fuel pump immersed in the fuel tank
I don't like to have a hot pump inside my fuel tank!

 

[Dandare]

I keep reading on these forums about Lucas pumps. Never seen onelayful:

Danny

 

[Rob Glasgow]

:fatanny, don't you know that every problem with a British Car can always be blamed on Lucas, the Prince of Darkness? Even if the parts were made by SU, Dunlop or MOWOG!!

 

[RAC68]

Hi All,

Wow, I appreciate where all are coming from and had no intention of diminishing the potential for a pump failure. However, I personally have had little issue with the Lucas pump. Since owning my Healey since new, its first 15 years was as my/our everyday family car and was only augmented when the family grew too large.

Bill, the Transient Voltage Suppression (TVS) diode is a relatively new development and, differs from a standard diode that only maintains electrical directional flow. This diode maintains directional flow as well as shunts to ground voltage that exceeds a max (my selected TVS grounds all voltage exceeding 25V). Yes, diodes were used on some Lucas models and this use placed them into the single polarity category. However, pumps using only a standard diode are still susceptible to the voltage build-up (as much as 200V) as a result of the coil's affect (not too dissimilar to the way the ignition coil functions).

There are many things I have changed to give greater reliability and serviceability to my Healey (all but the added fuses can be reversed), but my fuel pump only became a concern when reading the concerns, experiences and proposals of others. Yes, modern cars do have pump failures but it is not something that comes to mind as a point of vulnerability or to be addressed with the addition of a parallel pump.

Again, I see the convenience of electrically switching to a second pump during a failure and would definitely install one if I had some of the experiences of others or decided to take a extended trip far from home. However, I am much more confident with the modifications I have made to my points-triggered pump and a long trip in my Healey is not presently planned, so I will probably not go any further.

All the best to all,
Ray (64BJ8P1)

 

[Dandare]

:fatanny, don't you know that every problem with a British Car can always be blamed on Lucas, the Prince of Darkness? Even if the parts were made by SU, Dunlop or MOWOG!!

Thanks Rob, my knowledge is now complete:friendly_wink:

Danny

 

[Rob Glasgow]

Lucas fuel pumps were only used on the 100-4. All other Healeys got SU fuel pumps.:tennis:

 

[RAC68]

Rob, thanks for the correction. My comments were meant to refer to SU fuel pumps and not those produced by Lucas.

All the best,
Ray(64BJ8P1)

 

[Dandare]

Lucas fuel pumps were only used on the 100-4

Can someone explain/describe this Lucas fuel pump to me please.

Danny

 

[Rob Glasgow]

Danny, sorry for the confusion. It was just my attempt at humor. Just as there is no Healey called a 100-4, to the best of my knowledge, no regular Healey ever used a Lucas Fuel pump. The four cylinder Healeys were just called 100 (not 100-4)and all fuel pumps used were manufactured by SU, not Lucas. Lucas certainly did make most of the electrical components of our cars, but not the fuel pumps.