TR6 Headlight size

[poolboy]

You explored this, right ?

Headlight Assemblies

Headlight Shields, Visors, Fender Guides for all Cars and Trucks

www.taillightking.com

 

[Healey Nut]

You explored this, right ?

Headlight Assemblies

Headlight Shields, Visors, Fender Guides for all Cars and Trucks

www.taillightking.com

Sent them an email , Tks .

 

[Tybalt]

That's a Lucas catalog that I do not have. I saw some lamp models and specific lamp part numbers that used the same headlamp door as others but that 552822 looks to be unique application for the Model FFT575 part number 55052F (s/s by 55090) only and fitted only to the Austin A90 from 1949 to 1952 as original equipment. Given that Austin A90 application and the BMC family thing, it looks like they raided the parts bin for lamps when they were preparing the rally cars and pulled those to use.

 

[Healey Nut]

I found this using the part number on google

http://www.brightsparkmagnetos.com/library/Parts%20lists/Lucas%20motor%20cycle%20parts%201936-57/H04-39%20Headlamps.pdf

the pic attached shows the one Im looking for

 

[Tybalt]

This is getting odd. Going to page H15 under lamp Model F575P and part number 51044A, it lists the 552822 headlamp door and that is the only listing that I see offhand showing that headlamp door. Heading back toward the front on page H4, there is only one listing for Model F575P headlamps indicating that the ordering number is 51044. Dropping down to page H35, there is no application listing for the 51044 or 51044A, it jumps from 50952 to 51106. Having to jump around to different sections of a Lucas catalog is something I learned about 50+ years ago, so no big surprises there but they are also pretty good about providing application information for the different part numbers and here it is lacking. Makes me wonder if this motorcycle specific headlamp is a generic aftermarket fitment as opposed to a part number that Lucas supplied in production type quantities to specific manufacturers

 

[Healey Nut]

Hi Tybalt .
You seem to have quite a bit of knowledge in regard to the Lucas parts .
The part number I was given came from Holden in the UK but it refers to a pinch ring type trim ring ,..is that what you mean by headlamp door ?
Also if you check the pic of the rally car it doesn’t look like the add-on lights have pinch ring type trim rings .
Anyways what Im looking for is a chrome trim ring that would fit a 5 3/4” headlight unit with recessed bucket .7 1/4” back edge diameter so it needs to have some taper across its width .
Do you have any further insight as to alternate part numbers of such a trim ring ?
tks .

on page H5 they show model F575 , that looks like the exact set up I need depending on the measurements but I can’t find any product specific details .

 

[Healey Nut]

Looking back and forth and deciphering how they list parts it appears that the 534343 may also work for me ?
I have found them readily available but don’t know the back edge diameter .
Any ideas ?

 

[Tybalt]

Unfortunately, the Lucas catalogs do not provide much, if anything, in the way of lamp component dimensional information, just the basic lamp size which is typically deciphered from the model number (x575y = 5 3/4", x700y = 7") for headlamps. As far as headlamp door, that is the terminology used in the Lucas catalog for the outer trim ring on headlamp assemblies. Since I started playing around with these things at rather early age and to a large extent grew up in the parts and service departments even before I was born (my mother served as the parts department inventory clerk at her father's dealership early in my parent's marriage). I got used to using the UK terminology in the various parts and service manuals, enough background, back to the issue at hand.

On the 552822, I was surprised to see it was a pinch clamp piece since the pictures of the rally car/rally car replica do not show that. By the same token do we necessarily know with certainty that the lamp assemblies supplied now are the same as what was fitted to the rally car? That might explain the difference. My experience is that most of the headlamp doors were held in place by clips attached to the headlamp backshell/bucket. Having a pinch clamp says to me that there is something on that backshell, a small lip perhaps, that the door grips when the pinch clamp is tightened

The 534343 is for a 5 3/4" lamp assembly so we know that it would fit on the front side but I have no idea of dimensions for the back side of that headlamp door. If you have a line on someone with those in stock, I would suggest calling them up and getting them to check that rear dimension for you. I would also ask if it is held on with screws (some Lucas units did that) or if it looks like it is held in place with clip(s) on the bucket.

Other than that, I am pretty much at a loss for the time being. If I think of something later, I'll either post back or send you private message you ( I assume we can still do that with the new site, haven't tried that yet)

 

[Hamish Racing]

I still can’t believe that a man making these pods - and I bet not cheaply- is doing so regardless of the fact that the light fittings needed for a proper job are not readily available- in fact rare as hens teeth. !
poor service in my book.

 

[Healey Nut]

More research has found that the trim rings Im looking for were used on the Austin A90 on the centre headlight as shown in this pic . You can see it’s a pinch ring type . They probably used these on the works rally cars as they were readily available .
I found a supplier in the UK that sells parts for these old girls so fingers crossed he may have a source for me .

 

[Tybalt]

More research has found that the trim rings Im looking for were used on the Austin A90 on the centre headlight as shown in this pic . You can see it’s a pinch ring type . They probably used these on the works rally cars as they were readily available .
I found a supplier in the UK that sells parts for these old girls so fingers crossed he may have a source for me .

That's the application I mentioned in post #23 and speculated "Given that Austin A90 application and the BMC family thing, it looks like they raided the parts bin for lamps when they were preparing the rally cars and pulled those to use."

 

[Tybalt]

I was killing time looking at odds and ends and ran across this:

Austin A-90 Atlantic convertible parts

Remains of a rusty 1950 Atlantic parts car for sale, including fenders, doors, hood, trunk lid, top mechanism, instruments, steering box, brakes, drive train, title. Text or call me 2zero5306193eight. Located near Roanoke VA.

www.britishcarforum.com

Don't know if you've seen this or not or have any idea if he might be able to supply that headlamp door, but it's the right model Austin and in the right year range where that lamp and headlamp door were listed as OEM equippment. If you haven't contacted the guy already, it might be worth a try. The worst he could do would be to say he can't help you.

 

[Tybalt]

It's been about a month, any luck on those headlamp doors?

 

[Healey Nut]

Despite numerous emails to various suppliers and Austin A90 specialists (most of which they don’t even seem to have the common decency to answer) Im still looking .
I have ordered the headlight buckets and sealed beam units from a supplier in the UK along with two black plastic trim rings which dimensionally are very close to what Im looking for .
The order for these items has been processed and the company says they are waiting for there supplier to supply them but they are stuck in some container somewhere (Suez Canal issue) .
If the black plastic trim rings fit then I know of a chrome plater that can chrome plate plastic and there’s also a fancy paint process that looks very much like chrome .
I took an old chrome trim ring to my metal guy for him to play with .
They are in fact made of very thin brass so reducing them is easy after cutting with a zip wheel however Re welding is very difficult due to the very thin material .
Im going to have a another go at this myself using silver solder and possibly some 95/5 solder to see if my refrigeration tech welding/brazing skills can manage it . All the old chrome has to be removed and a squeaky clean joint prepped for this to work .
I haven’t given up on this yet .
Tks .

 

[Tybalt]

Given my experience with various heat exchangers and the thickness of the metal of the headlamp doors, I think your idea of brazing is the way to go since it doesn't involve making a pool that includes the base metal. Since the parts are non-structural, the strength of the joint is not as critical so brazing works from that perspective as well. There's just not enough stock to start melting the base metal in a welding process and not expect it to lead to tears.

 

[Frank Canale]

soldering is the way to go weather it be silver, bronze alloy , or brass. There are also some low temperature alloys but I believe the silver solder will give you the best results. Frank

 

[Healey Nut]

soldering is the way to go weather it be silver, bronze alloy , or brass. There are also some low temperature alloys but I believe the silver solder will give you the best results. Frank

My thoughts exactly . Im Old school so will use the pure silver solder wire with the white add on flux and I will do a lap joint for strength . A Butt joint on something so thin would be impossible .

 

[Frank Canale]

I used to work with an old man that could stick weld with the best mig welder and silver solder like it was jewelry. nothing wrong with old school, I never did figure out new math. Frank

 

[Healey Nut]

So I had some shop time today and fooled around with an old 7” Healey headlight trim ring and it’s now a 5 3/4” trim ring .
needs some more fettling but I impressed myself for a first attempt .
I have a couple more so I can play and perfect the process a bit more then let my chrome guy have a look and see if he thinks they are rechromeable .

 

[Frank Canale]

WOW!!! Awesome job, great to see someone give it a go. I always say It's broke so I can't make it any worse or it doesn't look right so lets make it look right. I just love it when others enjoy success from their own efforts. Frank