TR2/3/3A TR3 Hard Steering Question

[mountainman]

It's been almost 35 years since I last drove a TR3.The one I have now steers really hard. No steering it with one hand. I know that TR's are known for their stiff steering, but mine seems to be harder than it should. The front suspension and steering box have been completely rebuilt -all new bushing etc. I checked for binding as I was rebuilding everything. The way I lined up the wheels was by measuring the front of the tire tread and compared that measurment to the rear of the front tire tread? The car drives down the road straight with no pulling to either side. Can any alignment shop align the front and would that help the steering stiffness?
Thanks
Greg

 

[TR3driver]

Any alignment shop can do the alignment. Only toe-in is adjustable, but I recommend having them measure and report caster & camber as a large error in either measurement may indicate damage or even imminent failure.

An important part of rebuilding the box is getting it properly adjusted; making a mistake here can also make the car steer hard.

Were the cam & peg replaced (at least the peg should always be replaced, IMO) ?

Did you have them install one of those spring-loaded top covers that practically guarantees hard steering?

Another good test is to support the car with stands under the spring pans (so the front suspension is compressed but the tires are off the ground) and try turning the wheel. It should turn dead easy with no sign of binding.

Inflation of your front tires can make a significant difference too. The 24 psi given in the handbook is much too low, IMO.

 

[Twosheds]

I forget the change point for the one- to two- piece steering column, but if you have a two-piece column, make sure that the upper and lower shafts are aligned. Loosen the steering unit bolts and slide the upper shaft/wheel in and out of the coupler whilst watching for side movement of the shafts. If side movement is observed, fiddle with the unit position until there is no side movement. Tighten the steering unit bolts and check again.

If you have the one-piece column, disregard this post.

 

[JohnnyMead]

Randall,
Good point. What front/rear tire pressure do you run?
John

 

[TR3driver]

What front/rear tire pressure do you run?

I'm still fiddling around, finding out what the car likes. At the moment, I've got 32/35; but I might back off a bit more to cut down on vibration at freeway speeds.

But my car isn't exactly stock (for one thing, I'm running 205/55 tires) so YMMV.

 

[TR3driver]

If you have the one-piece column, disregard this post.

Even the one-piece column can bind, if the clamps aren't lined up. In addition to the clamp at the base of the box (which allows for left/right alignment of the column), there is also room for up/down adjustment where the box is clamped to the frame. And the idler arm should match the steering box.

In one case, I found that the nearly-new idler arm had bound up; apparently from excess paint inside the bracket. Had to use a hammer to unscrew it, but cleaning and lubrication solved the problem.

Also, I feel that using a high quality synthetic gear oil in the steering box helps. I use Valvoline full synthetic GL5 in mine.

 

[mountainman]

Randall, Yes I replaced the peg in the steering box and filled it with Redline 90 gear oil. It does not have the spring loaded top. I will do as you guys suggest and check the alignment of the column. Can any TR3 be driven with one hand?
Thanks
Greg

 

[Twosheds]

My TR3 can be steered with one hand, yes.

 

[Mickey Richaud]

Inflation of your front tires can make a significant difference too. The 24 psi given in the handbook is much too low, IMO.

Wasn't that figure for bias-ply tires back in the day?

HUGE difference!

 

[TR3driver]

Wasn't that figure for bias-ply tires back in the day?

The factory number for bias-ply was even lower!

And I rarely use two hands to steer my TR3, except for hard cornering or tight parallel parking.

 

[mountainman]

Hey Guys,
Checked the column alignment and it was ok. greased all fittings and set the car down on stands under the spring pans. Now when I turned the steering wheel it binds when the steering wheel is at center. I know it s suppose to get harder at center but mine seems excessive. By adjusting the steering box screw and nut and will it loosen the steering?
Thanks
Greg

 

[startech47]

Yes. Your adjustment is too tight. Adjust for little play in the center.

 

[TR3driver]

IMO, Correct adjustment is when you can just feel that it gets tight in the center, turning the shaft with your fingers (not with the steering wheel).

But if that adjustment is wrong, there is a good chance that the other adjustment (shims under the end plate) is wrong as well. And it should be done first, with the adjusting screw backed out.

 

[eschneider]

IMO, Correct adjustment is when you can just feel that it gets tight in the center, turning the shaft with your fingers (not with the steering wheel).

and the steering linkage removed, right?

But if that adjustment is wrong, there is a good chance that the other adjustment (shims under the end plate) is wrong as well. And it should be done first, with the adjusting screw backed out.

since you bring it up, I generally do this with the box out of the car, and use plastigage to measure ~0.04" clearance. Always wondered how the rest of the world does it? Dial indicator?

 

[TR3driver]

IMO, Correct adjustment is when you can just feel that it gets tight in the center, turning the shaft with your fingers (not with the steering wheel).

and the steering linkage removed, right?

Right, forgot to mention that part.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:]

But if that adjustment is wrong, there is a good chance that the other adjustment (shims under the end plate) is wrong as well. And it should be done first, with the adjusting screw backed out.

since you bring it up, I generally do this with the box out of the car, and use plastigage to measure ~0.04" clearance. Always wondered how the rest of the world does it? Dial indicator?
[/QUOTE]
I've only done it with the box out of the car; but I don't see any reason it couldn't be done in the car.

.040" is huge, IMO, and even .004" is too much. I use a dial indicator, and shoot for .000" +.000" -.002"
Or, as the book puts it "While a slight amount of preload is permissible, in no circumstances must there be <span style="font-weight: bold">any </span>end float." (emphasis mine)

Basically, I put in an extra shim, measure the end float (dial indicator riding on the end of the shaft), then remove shims to equal or slightly exceed the measured end float.

FWIW, ENCO frequently has a "import" dial indicator and magnetic base set on sale for $20-25. But I don't see it in the current sale flyer, so you might have to pay full price:
https://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INPDFF?PMPAGE=366&PARTPG=INLMK3&PMITEM=605-4604

While I won't claim it's the same quality as tools selling for 5x the price, mine has performed adequately for many years now. Here's a shot of the last time I had it out, trying to find some decent front hubs

 

[eschneider]

.040" is huge, IMO, and even .004" is too much. I use a dial indicator, and shoot for .000" +.000" -.002" Or, as the book puts it "While a slight amount of preload is permissible, in no circumstances must there be any end float." (emphasis mine)

Ack. My mistake - I did mean 0.004". Sounds like I need to reconsider that spec anyway.....

Since we're on the subject, what do recommend for a replacement felt bushing at the stering wheel end of the tube? All the replacements I've tried are way too tight - at the very least making it near impossible to adjust the worm/peg correctly.

Sorry if my questions are hijacking the original thread....

 

[TR3driver]

Since we're on the subject, what do recommend for a replacement felt bushing at the stering wheel end of the tube? All the replacements I've tried are way too tight - at the very least making it near impossible to adjust the worm/peg correctly.

What I did was to adjust the box first, and then stuff in the new felt from TRF. It was kind of tight at first; I seriously considered turning up a piece of Delrin to replace it. But it quickly loosened up after I drove the car a bit.

Oh, I also coated it generously with powdered MoS2 rather than graphite. Don't know that it's any better in this instance, but it was what I had handy.