Speedi Sleeve required for this application - Need advise!

[Jim_Gruber]

Getting ready to reassembly the rear end and was taking apart my other LR Wheel Bearing from the Hub. The inner seal had totally disintegrated with what appears to be a whole lot of wire mesh on the inside of the seal. In looking at the LR Axle with AM I see two grooves worn all of the way around the axle right by the threads and I assume right where the bearing seal would touch. So now I see why this hub was leaking and leaking badly. And Wheel Bearing kooks like it was missing at least one ball from the races, could have disintegrated and that's what I saw in the wheel seal.

So now the question arises. Going to a sealed 207FF Bearing as well as new axle seals and Gently Used EN17 axles along with 3.9 diff which is gently used as well. Am I going to be able to get a seal here by changing out components or is that a place where a Speedi Sleeve is needs. If so what size. Or do I put in all back together with Permatex Gear Oil Gasket Maker. Hylomar is no longer sold locally. Package Seay this is RTV Formulated to resist Friction Modifiers from Diff Oils. This stuff says apply a bead to one side and around all bolt holes. No gasket needed. 1/16 to 1/4" bead around bolt holes and one side of Pumpkin. Assemble immediately and finger tighten bolts, wait an hour and then torque to specs. Wait 24 hours before adding diff oil. So my Questions.

1) So I have paper diff gasket soaking in oil right now. Do I use gasket with this Gear Oil Gasket Maker Y/N
2) Speedi Sleeve - Needed Y/n and if yes what size and where do I get one?
3) or just put in the new sealed bearings knowing that I will be changing to rear discs in the new future.
4) 2077FF Wheel Bearings do not appear to be handed that look like that can be installed / turned either way.

One more thing the pumpkin can only be installed one way I think. Or Can it go either way and if so what is the correct way?

View attachment 48553View attachment 48552

 

[Rhodyspit75]

1. Good luck with the gasket. I wrecked two before I made my own. I used a thin smear of gear oil gasket maker.

2. Info here. https://www.mgexp.com/article/midget-rear-axle-knowledge.html

The pumpkin appears to be correct. To be sure, the flange with the hole for the brake line splitter should be up. I'm not sure if it could go in either way. I don't remember. It has been a month since I did it.

 

[Jim_Gruber]

I have one soaking in oil but directions for permatex differential gasket maker call for a clean oil free surface. So that's gasket is toast. Time to get out Xacto blade and gasket hole punch set along with roll of gasket material and make one tomorrow night. Time to find a speedi sleeve. You had one groove I have two. Other side is fine. Thanks for the help.

Springs got assembled and installed today. Found the correct 1/26 threaded screws from British Fastener for the 1/4 elliptic spring clamps. Ordered 4 nuts as well installed as a locking nut. Thanks.

 

[Jim_Gruber]

So did not gat an answer on the Permatex Differential Sealers designed to work for Rear Ends versus using the paper gasket or getting out roll of gasket material and making my own. Paper gasket is tissue thin not sure HTH that would plug a leak. it's old and dried out, has been soaking in oil overnight but should I use that with the Permatex Sealer which says to apply to dry, clean, non oily surfaces. I'm "cornfused"!

 

[John Kuzman]

Hi Jim -

If you look in the Workshop Manual, there is a reference somewhere to the bearing with paper gasket standing "proud" by something like .002-.004" so that the bearing is clamped when you install the axle. The paper gaskets from the usual suppliers are way too thick to get the right proudness. Just go to your local Meijer and get some paper shopping bags. Use that for the perfect gasket material. Add a slight smear of Hylomar (a Cincinnati company bought the Hylomar name and product) to both sides of the gasket, install a new o-ring and done. I did mine this way when I installed the 3:90 over three years ago. No leaks.

 

[Jim_Gruber]

John I did that before with wheel bearing Gaskets but how about the rear end gasket. Way too flimsy. I read soak in oil to toughen it up for 24 h. I need to find a local Hylomar Source. I've used before with good results. But not on the pumpkin seal before.

 

[John Kuzman]

Sorry Jim. Guess I was focused on the hub gasket. For the rear diff. gasket, I just used a dry gasket from Moss with again, Hylomar on both sides. No leaks. The hylomar I now use is made by Valco. Bought two tubes through Amazon.

 

[Jim_Gruber]

Thanks John, Will need to make a gasket as the one I have is already soaked in Motor Oil. Sure could have used for a Template. OK found where I can order the genuine stuff on Amazon. I'll trace out a gasket and make a Template from a Shopping Bag in the meantime. Have Exacto and Hole Punch I can get it done, Cardboard File Folder will serve to make a template and then I can copy to a paper bag. Same for Wheel hub gaskets. They do appear to be too thick.

 

[Rhodyspit75]

When I made mine I held the gasket material over the studs. I started with studs 180 degrees apart. After I cut those holes I put the gasket over them and put nuts on a couple of threads. Then I went around and lightly tapped on each one with a hammer. Then I cut the holes out and put it in place. I then went around the inside and outside and cut it by tapping with a hammer. Came out perfect.

 

[nomad]

Well, I've heard mention that the gaskets were too thick for some time and thought that that would be no big deal. Never considered that the axle has to clamp on the bearing. Just did two cars and now I think I had better redo them with home made gaskets. Bummer!!

Kurt.

 

[Jim_Gruber]

Hylomar ordered, here Friday. Will make gasket in the meantime for pumpkin. Like the technique as described. Will do hub gaskets from brown paper bag and Hylomar. Technique was good for 13 years and no recurring leaks.

 

[Joe Schlosser]

Just my two cents from pulling the rear ends apart a lot for a bunch of years.
Regardless of a sealed bearing or not lube will spill over into the axle housing from the diff when cornering. The sealed bearing will minimize this as the oil will need to come up and over the bearing to get to the outer part of the Hub assy.
Also when properly filled the lube level is above the bottom of the bottom of the axle tube so if the inner seal is NG the assy will leak.
Therefore both the inner seal and the seal between the hub and the axle are important. Look at the location of the hub seal and the axle tube. If the groove is where the seal will ride you will need the speedi sleves. Winners Circle has them. I will look but I think the part numbers went with the spec book for my FP car. I needed the sleeves to fit double bearing hubs. They are also available directly from the manufacturer. Google speedi sleeve

Re the hub to axle seal, I never had an issue with the available paper seals although many people do not use them due to the clearance between the bearing and the axle flange.
I coat both sides of the paper with grey silicone sealer and assemble. The black also works.
I made up spacers to go over the studs so I can use the wheel lugs to tighten everything together. Usually overnight to let silicone cure.
Lastly, I never used anything but a thin smear of grey silicone on the diff to banjo with no leaks

 

[Jim_Gruber]

Thanks Joe, I ordered a Speedi Sleeve from Amazon this AM. Here Thursday. $34.95 Delivered with Shipping. I'll add that into the mix and hope I can get the hub back on without an issue. Paper Gaskets for Hub to Axle from a Kroger Bag using Hylomar. Pumpkin Seal will be a typical Gasket material. Hylomar both sides, Now to get this thing assembled so I can work out extending the E-Brake Rods for the new Backing Plates.

A small victory today. I was worried that my new 8 Spoke Wheels from JBW would not clear the TRE with Lead Weights mounted on the Inner Rim. Just tried it a few minutes ago. No Problem with clearance once tightened down. Thought I'd need to go back and get some Flat Stick On Weights. But it Fits!!! Yeah a small victory for Bugsy IV. One more thing off of the list so I can get driving.