General MG Lifter break-in

[SwamperCa]

When replacing lifters with new ones is there a need to use a break in oil. The new lifters where coated with a cam assembly lube on the surface which contacts the cam lobe. I run Valvoline 20-50 oil, VR1.

 

[Boggsy64]

I am no expert and am rebuilding my engine now. The "Dr. Doolin" DVD on rebuilding the engine only says to generously lube all the parts at assembly. I would think a good oil would be sufficient.

 

[SwamperCa]

I think so too. I ask as I just watched a TV show where a newly rebuilt motor went bad because they didn't use break in oil.

 

[LarryK]

If have not rebuilt entire engine, good oil with cam lube is all that is necessary. Reason for break-in oil is to seat rings faster and protect new cam, and crankshaft bearings. Engines rebuilt today by reliable machine shops, build to a closer tolerance than the did years back. When firing up new rebuilds they are run at 2500rpm to 3000rpm for 20-30mins. then break-in oil is dropped and fresh oil added then engine is ready for the street.

 

[Boggsy64]

I think I know what Swamper is talking about. I recently saw an episode of "Fast and Loud". They had a newly rebuilt Mustang Cobra engine that failed immediately. They blamed the failure of the cam on "not using break in oil". I thought this was a bit of a stretch and more likely something else was wrong. I thought "break in oil" was like going the store for a can of compression!!:excitement:

 

[SwamperCa]

Bingo- I'm not a big fan of those type of shows but being Thanksgiving week-end visiting at my sons saw it on TV. That show seems very staged. I also saw a Chip Foose show where they reconfigured a little lotus, it was amazing to watch him modify it.

 

[blueosprey90]

Well, I think they were saying high ZDDP content oil. And it was the lifter and cam shaft interface where they had their failure. They added a ZDDP additive to their regular motor oil and concluded that it didn't blend well. I've heard that ZDDP additive is generally useless for that same reason - I think from a previous oil engineer.

On the second go-around, they used Joe Gibbs BR oil https://www.saferacer.com/joe-gibbs...gclid=COXTjLG5mrsCFWLNOgodOEYASA#!prettyPhoto. I'm not sure what the weight of that is, but I see a BR 30 as well. I mostly run Valvoline VR-1 racing oil - the "not street legal" if I can find it. https://www.valvoline.com/faqs/motor-oil/racing-oil/.

My 2 cents: Even with the cam lube, is it worth the risk of ruining the camshaft and lifters to save $40 in break in oil cost?

 

[Boggsy64]

Good information. I am going to be breaking my new rebuild in soon. Hope to get done in Jan or Feb. Is there an oil available at the auto store, is something like Valvoline synthetic or Mobil 1 OK, or should you get a specific high content oil (content of what I am not sure)?

 

[blueosprey90]

I have to watch "Dr. Doolin" again, but I think he says that a good 30 weight oil can be used during assembly instead of a special engine lube. But breaking in an engine is different, and I think you should use a break in oil. I edited my post above. That Joe Gibbs BR oil is only $9 a quart. Order 5 quarts and you will have it when needed. There is a definite break in procedure. You will want to change oil and filter after about a 30 minute run.

I've never done it myself, but I'm sort of in the same boat as you. I'm building an engine in the basement and have a second one being built professionally in South Carolina. At the rate I'm going, the one being built in South Carolina should be finished first!

The oil oil that I am running now (in the third, perfectly fine engine) is Valvoline VR-1 Racing Oil, since it is the only oil available in the auto parts store that I'm sure has a high ZDDP content. My friend used to run diesel oil for the same reason, but recently the ZDDP levels in diesel motor oil have been reduced. Abingdon Spares carries a high ZDDP content motor oil. It is made/formulated by a specialty oil company in my town, but Abingdon Spares does not market very aggressively. The guy who is in charge of the formulation/manufacture tells me it is good stuff with a high ZDDP content that was specially formulated for flat tappet, push rod engines.

Check out the Joe Gibbs oils. I think the "Hot Rod" oil is the one with the high ZDDP content that is suitable for our cars.

 

[Roger]

Bingo- I'm not a big fan of those type of shows but being Thanksgiving week-end visiting at my sons saw it on TV. That show seems very staged. I also saw a Chip Foose show where they reconfigured a little lotus, it was amazing to watch him modify it.

So amazing in fact, that the car still isn't running yet! Bit off more than they could chew, I'm guessing.


I may be old-fashioned (old anyway) but I don't like to run in with synthetic oils. I add ZDDP nowadays, and assemble using Graphogen.

 

[SwamperCa]

I've heard that about a few other of his projects on that show.

 

[PAUL161]

If you installed a new cam and lifters there is a fairly set way you need to fire up the engine when ready.
1. Make sure all bearings plus cam and lifters are lubed with the cam and bearing manufactures recommendation pre-lube.
2. Make sure the engine will fire up with very little cranking and has predetermined oil pressure.
3. Make sure the radiator is hooked up and the cooling system is operable.
4. When the engine is fired up, immediately take it to 2000 to 2500 RPMs, Don't linger, and keep it there for at least 30 minutes, don't idle it down during this period!
5. If the cylinders were bored, you have new rings and probably new pistons, USE A BREAK IN OIL!
6. After the break in period, drain the oil and replace with the appropriate oil for your engine.
It is a good policy to screen the oil through some cheese cloth, or better have it analyzed. The second oil change in a shorter period than normal is also a good idea to test.
Built a lot of flat head Fords over the years and never destroyed a cam yet using this policy and for those that don't know, the old Ford flat heads had flat tappet cams the same as an MG. PJ

Oh yeah,
When you watch TV, keep one thing in mind, they'll usually pick the worst scenario for the show, because it makes the show more exciting to watch. You want good advise on building an MG engine, talk to Hap Waldrup, he will not steer you wrong! The mans a genius with MG engines.

 

[Charley]

When I was a kid, new cars here in the States came with with their engines full of "break-in oil". The new owner was supposed to baby the car around for 1,000 miles and then return it to the dealer for its 'thousand mile check." They refilled the engine with the same 30 wt oil and you went away. Obviously, they got to check the car over, see if the oil was full of chips and pass it on to the customer as "OK."

Break-in oil forsooth? What a rip! If one uses the correct assy lube, the usual oil will do. Run it for a couple of K, change it and the filter and go cautiously on.

CR

 

[LarryK]

Charley, years ago the machinists and engine builders did not have the technology of the engine builders of today. Last car/truck I broke in was in 86. Now days everything is built with computers and measuring instruments of a lesser error. Even the at home restorer has measuring equipment that would surpass even 10 yr. old. technology. All engines today are broke-in on dynos and oil changed before they even are inserted in the new car, which eliminated the break-in, hence the 10-15K oil changes. Yes, today use break-in oil and change after initial fire up and idle time. Then, change oil and do your usual changes. Even the oils today are specific for the closer tolerances not like the non-detergent and detergent of even 10 yrs. ago. Better to be safe than sorry. If you just do a slam rebuild, run it, refix later. Been doing this for 49 yrs. and have followed the new technology and have carried daily driven cars thru 200K and up to 15 yrs. ownership. Sure dealers loose money that way, but people have there cars longer and can use their money elsewhere. It's expensive enough to do a valve job, cam job, or rebuild on the LBCs, might as well do it right the first time, that way 40yrs. from now the next owner would appreciate seeing a job well done.

 

[PAUL161]

Charley, About break in oil. Break in oil is not, in laymans terms, as slimey/slippery as regular oils. Break in oil allows the new rings to seat in the newly bored cylinders faster than regular oils. If you install chrome rings, it's very important to use a break in oil and initially run the engine for approximately 60 minutes giving those super hard chrome rings a chance to seat, not quite that long with standard rings. If you remember years ago, there were different automatic transmission oils. You couldn't use a GM oil in a Ford transmission. Reason was the Fords needed an oil with,(more grip), for the bands, GM oil was more slippery and designed just for their transmissions. Some oils have more grip, as break in oil does. Modern technology has redesigned transmissions to the point that they all, (for the most part), take the same type oils. As Larry said, new modern engines are broke in on a dyno before they are installed in the cars and there is no break in period, just get in it and drive the heck out of it. PJ