brass or steel synchro rings

[19_again]

While the car is being painted this winter, I'm bringing the tranny into the tranny shop for repair of the 2nd gear synchro and whatever else, how can I tell whether I have brass or steel synchro rings in the 67B? I ask because there;s a couple on ebay, also would anyone buy used ones with new ones so inexpensive. I believe the original equip is generally better than the newer stuff, but this is a moving part and subject to wear, hence the question.

 

[DrEntropy]

mmmm.... there's these things called "magnets"...

The sintered iron second gear ring is the one ya want, BTW.

 

[19_again]

Magnets, man oh man what'll they think of next?
I really can't put a magnet on it til I can touch it.and that won't be until the engine is out, meanwhile the ebay rings are gone as of tonight. I was hoping someone would be able to tell me that cars before a certain production number had steel etc.
I have read that you can't replace a brass unit with a steel one, otherwise I would just buy the steel.

 

[bob67bgt]

If you have a steel one in there now its probably not going to be giving you a problem. I have seen later full syncro boxes with steel syncros crack but not wear out. You probably have a brass one. If you drive your car on a regular basis and do not speed shift or drive with the trans used as a brake a brass one will last a long time. Brakes are used to slow the car down and the trans is used to accellerate. Downshifting to accellerate is ok. Most of the bearings are pretty stout in a early box. You will probably need a layshaft, layshaft bearings,2nd gear syncro,seals and gaskets. look at 3 and 4 syncro and replace sa needed and i would guess 1st gear is quiet enough or replace as needed also. Its not a horrable job. Bob

 

[19_again]

Bob, the problem that I do have is with shifting into 2nd, I need to either "slip" it in when upshifting or double clutch when down shifting. 3 and 4 seem fine, I get a little rumble in 1st that sounds like the whole main shaft is spinning against the side wall of the housing but 1st is fine. Plenty of lubrication all around. It will pop out of reverse 10% of the time, and if it won't hold the gear I have to drive forward a few feet and then it works fine. My main intent is to take advantage of any ebay deals that may present themselves before knowing positively what parts the ship will ultimately need.
Mike

 

[bob67bgt]

That rumble sound could be some minor chipped teeth on first and maybe on the laygear.??? When the layshaft wears it makes first noisy also but i would say mostly a whine. When you get it out and apart it will be easy to see what the problems are. Even with new parts a little whine in first is ok. If you are going to do this operation yourself let me know and i will try to email you a basic outline of the steps and what to watch for. Are you anywhere near South Lee, Mass.? We are going there next week in 2 pull handle MGBs. bob

 

[DrEntropy]

Bob's parts list is spot-on. Laygear/layshaft in those older boxes are usually the first things to wear. The needle bearings start chewin' up shaft and gear I.D.

There was a sintered iron replacement for the brass second gear balk ring in about 1968, when BMC realized they were replacing a LOT of the brass ones. The newer replacement layshaft/laygear has a caged bearing setup (with another row of bearings added) which seems to be a bit more stout, too. You really will need to disassemble it for an inspection before you can be certain what you'll need to replace.
After the first one, it gets to be <span style="font-style: italic">almost</span> fun. :wink:

 

[19_again]

I'll be bringing it into the local specialty tranny shop, my brother won't use anyone else. I wouldn't mess with the tranny myself, I don't know what I don't know and would miss something . It comes off the road Monday, so it won't be long. I've got a family work day at my mother's house next weekend so I can't make it to Lee next week, Bob. I wish I could, it would be different to have an actual destination. As a rule we just start driving and get home 6 hours later.I'll post back with results of the operation. Thanks guys.
Magnets, huh?