TR2/3/3A Frame differences in a TR3??

[Jerry]

Took the axle out today and found baby blue behind the shock towers. this makes me think the frame is from another car. Could happen in the last 52 years. Is there any differences in the frames that I should look for in case I need to order parts? The one thing is that it has an older style rear axle, but that has yellow writing on it which implied it came from a wrecking yard.

So any changes??

Jerry

 

[Andrew Mace]

There have been numerous reports over the years of "known" original cars having, say, a green frame under a red body or a yellow frame under a powder blue body, etc., so this might well be the case with your car!

 

[mallard]

My car had a green frame under a blue car. I believe all the frames were the same over the years.

 

[Jerry]

Could be. The body looks to be black originally. It had a red carpet, and I assume a red interior. The frame is in ok shape, a few bends that can be straighten out, but not a lot of rust.

Jerry

 

[vivdownunder]

Some of the more well known frame changes were -

(1) A bolt-in lower radiator protection cross member was added in Sept 1954.
(2) Stiffening infill plates added to the cruciform in Nov 1954. Rear shock mounts strengthened.
(3) Brackets for front brake pipes changed with the introduction of front disc brakes in Sept 1956.
(4) U shaped brackets added to the front spring towers with the introduction of the split steering column in late 1958, These were fitted both sides for either RHD or LHD.

Changes were noted by a change of Z number on top of the front cross member, put there by Sankeys the frame makers for S-T.

Frames were mainly matte black, but for unknown reasons (perhaps ran out of black or special order) other colours are recorded. I've seen an all red and an all white original frame, but no other colours as Australia's sample is small.

Boxed frame rails rust from the inside out and can become dangerously weak. Look for pin holes or tap lightly along and any weak spots will show as indents.

Viv.

 

[Marvin Gruber]

I recently took a TR2 tub off the frame. Car according to the BHMC was white, I found red on the frame, I wondered about that but didn't think anymore it until now.

Marv

 

[Jerry]

I found the Z tag, but can't read it yet. Since the car is a 1960, do you have any ranges for the what it should look like?
The removable radiator protection is there. I will look for the rest of your changes. I especially want to know about how they reinforced the shock tower as that is usually the first thing to go in old cars.

As we pulled the axle yesterday, we noted that NONE of the lock tabs were used to hold the bolts in place. They were not tight either. The PO mechanic skills are now in question. The sign by the brakes that said they don't work was a hint, followed by signs that the wheel cylinders and pads had been changed.

Having fun but 50 year old grease is thick.

Jerry

 

[Don Elliott]

When I bought my black TR3A brand new in May, 1958, I paid the S-T dealer to spray the underside with a tar-like coating for corrosion protection. In 1987 I started my 3-year total body-off restoration and found, after removing the tarry remnants from the frame that it had been sprayed primrose yellow. And it was not till a year later that primrose yellow became a sidescreen TR colour.

I have heard that the frames were constructed by a sub-conrtact body builder and if the paint remaining in the gun after painting another body (not necessarily S-T) would be sprayed onto any of the bare frames lying about.

You can see the yellow on the front angle struts of my TR3A in the photo from 1987.

 

[CJD]

I don't think I ever bought a car where the PO or PM skills were not in question!! The grease on my car was so thick I had to hammer the socket onto every bolt. Look at the bright side, at least someone loved it enough to keep it greased, and it is a good rust inhibiter !?!

John

 

[Jerry]

We got all the parts off the frame and I told my wife that we were going to take it to a media blasting company in town to clean it to bare metal. She was all for that. She did ask what it costs. I said about $85 per hour. Then she decided to start scraping all the dirt and grease off the frame so they could just blast the rust. She said I don't have to pay her!

This picture shows what we ended up with. About 1.5 foot in diameter and 5 inches high. Amazing what they collect in 60 years. It also gave me a chance to see the rails everywhere but where the substructure covers. Pretty solid, no rust holes yet.

Jerry

 

[Tr3aguy]

Right there with you....Still uncovering my dirt. Looks like powder blue and I just found the original bill of sale today/

OK so uncovering more color combinations....Blue frame.

 

[Brinkerhoff]

My TR3 was black originally and had its original paint mostly. The chassis frame was white in the engine bay under the grease. Odd. I think someone was cleaning out their spray equipment at the factory.

 

[PatGalvin]

Hi Jerry

Two things. American Stripping won't charge extra for removal of grunge on frame. They actually strip frames outdoors in the back and use beach sand rather than their secret blend of sand/media that they use on fragile panels. Nonetheless, that is an amazing pile of waste.

I found that my frame flash rusted very fast so recommend getting a coat of primer on it right away.

Also, they didn't do a good job of shaking all the sand out of my frame. You haven't seen a weld pop in your face until you've included silica sand in the weld. No fun at all.

pat

 

[Jerry]

Hey it was my wife's idea, and I never discourge her from working on the car. She cleaned out the side garage and prepped up the bead blaster box for all the parts we took off. I am lucky, she claims that blaster box.

Our Lemon's race group brought their Cortina over for some work and it is plugging my lift right now. I have to get the steering issue fixed so it is mobile. So the TR3a is going to sit for a few days.

Jerry

 

[vivdownunder]

Jerry, before you paint the frame have a good look around the steering box mount area for any cracks, also the inner lower suspension brackets. Cracks usually show beside the welds to the frame.

Check that the lower fulcrum pins are parallel to each other, or the car won't track straight.

Check the spring tower alignment because if poorly repaired, front wheel camber can be wrong. Camber is non adjustable, other then fitting special upper fulcrums.

It could be that the powder blue has been sprayed on during a body repair. Underneath the cross brace end bracket looks to be original black.

Viv

 

[Jerry]

thanks for the advice, and I was going to ask about reinforcement of the rear shock tower? I heard it should be done.

jerry

 

[vivdownunder]

Jerry, the rear shock mounts are usually OK as they were reinforced early in production, but they can be further improved. The main problem is the shocker fixing bolts. They are difficult to access without a thinwall socket, but need to be kept very tight or the shockers rattle around and elongate the mount holes.

Allen key bolts can be substituted, or use longer hex bolts packed out with a ferrule or machine washers.

One headache you could face is removing the leaf spring front pins. They are often completely frozen into the frame. An option is to leave them in place, as the springs are usually refitted before the body goes back on. If later on a leaf breaks, the rear corner of the body can be released and jacked up to sneak the spring out past the rocker. All depends how frozen they are.

Viv.

 

[PeterK]

Gee I don't think I would want my frame blasted with beach sand. I think that it would be covered in salt and push the salt into the wounds so-to-speak. No wonder yours flashed so quickly.

I used Black Beauty on my 4A frame.