Looks like I'll get some more engine removal experience

Hope y'all don't mind my Minor stories, I figure it's close enough to Spridgets. :grin:

Spent some time last night investigating some vibration I've been getting in the new Morris. Pulled the transmission tunnel cover off (a nice difference from a Spridget) and it's quite clear that the 5-speed wasn't relieved enough to fully clear the steering rack -- the rack sits above the transmission in a Morris. Spridgets need some clearance there on the 5-speed (or a bit of hammering on the heater box for room) but the Minor needs even more.

So I'll be pulling the engine and transmission out this weekend (if all goes well) so I can address that and get things sorted out. It's essentially the same conversion you use in a Spridget so it'll be good practice for the Bugeye's conversion later on.

I'm having a lot of trouble visualizing how the steering rack can sit above the transmission. In fact, I'm having a lot of trouble visualizing how the steering rack and transmission can even be close to one another in a rear wheel drive car.

I think we need a picture or two.

Steering rack on a Minor is right at the firewall, so the steering column is quite short and doesn't intrude on the engine bay. Bit strange, but it helps with the packaging I believe.

The black bar right above the bell housing is the steering rack

Yeah...it's a rear-steer setup like an A35 (as opposed to a Spridget with "front steer").

You can see a photo of the setup ~HERE~

My engine is currently hanging on a chain as I type this (and only have a few days to get ready for PVGP so I am doing The Hustle)

aeronca65t said:

My engine is currently hanging on a chain as I type this (and only have a few days to get ready for PVGP so I am doing The Hustle)

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Good luck!

I usually try and avoid The Hustle -- as I rarely need to be anywhere with these cars that urgently -- but I bought this one to drive so I'm going to get focused and get it done.

how weird is that - the steering - so do you have to cut more out of the transmission?

Yes, I'll need to trim a bit more from the bell housing for it all to work (standard for the Morris conversion). I've been emailing with Gerard for some advice (very helpful) and a few bits I need to sort things out correctly.

Not really what I wanted to do right now, but it's necessary so off I go. If all goes well I'll have the car in my garage Saturday morning and get the engine pulled.

Love that "racer's tape" bell housing modification!

Kurt.

aeronca65t said:

Yeah...it's a rear-steer setup like an A35 (as opposed to a Spridget with "front steer").

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I get it now---the rack is behind the front wheels instead of in front. I guess that would at least move it closer to the transmission.

Here's a Traveller I have been restoring. In this picture, you can see the rack just under the horizontal beam. The rack is same used on early Sprites and Midgets. The horizontal beam is structural and you can see where the shocks would mount to the left and right ends.To give you an idea of the relationship between the rack and gearbox, if you've ever noticed the rubber bung that fits in the oval hole at the back of the bell housing, in a Morris, the rack sits right behind and about that location, by about 3/4"- 1/2". There steering arms come off the back of the king pins, instead of in front. There steering arms come off the back of the king pins, instead of in front.

Made good progress today. About 5 hours of work, and I'm just about ready for the engine to come out. Just need to pull the clutch hydraulics and double check I've got everything, and I should be ready to go. Other than dealing with some Whitworth nuts and bolts (I need to get a few new tools) it's been pretty straightforward to get things ready. Hopefully I'll get it out on Sunday.

I do have to say, it is a little roomier than the Spridget engine bay.

drooartz said:

Made good progress today. About 5 hours of work, and I'm just about ready for the engine to come out. Just need to pull the clutch hydraulics and double check I've got everything, and I should be ready to go. Other than dealing with some Whitworth nuts and bolts (I need to get a few new tools) it's been pretty straightforward to get things ready. Hopefully I'll get it out on Sunday.

I do have to say, it is a little roomier than the Spridget engine bay.

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It looks pretty clean and straight in there at least. I suggest you leave the entire motors mounts connected to the engine. (Just remove the 4 bolts from the frame). If you'll be setting it on the ground, a 2x4 running under both should give you just about the right height to support itself without tipping over. Put one under the rear of the gearbox until you get it unbolted.

Gerard said:

It looks pretty clean and straight in there at least. I suggest you leave the entire motors mounts connected to the engine. (Just remove the 4 bolts from the frame). If you'll be setting it on the ground, a 2x4 running under both should give you just about the right height to support itself without tipping over. Put one under the rear of the gearbox until you get it unbolted.

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Thanks -- I was wondering about doing it that way. Seemed to be the easiest method. Heading out to tackle the last bits and the final pull right now. And I just ordered some basic Whitworth tools (Morris uses some Whitworth in various body bolts). Just nicer to use the right tool for the job.

So far the car seems clean and straight, even with these issues. Mechanical I'm willing to tackle, so I'd rather it this than hidden rust.

Engine is out and separated from the transmission. Now to get the engine on my stand and the transmission on the bench -- finally can start fixing things!

Was another long, very hot day but the engine is safely on my engine stand and the transmission is on my bench. Transmission will need at least new bearings and a bit more trimming to fit in the Morris correctly. New clutch as well while the whole thing is apart, and a few other bits as well.

Never been into a transmission before, it'll be a learning experience for sure.

Get a book on the Datsun transmission. Its a good and simple trans but disassembly and reassembly can be tricky. I would bet the only bearing needing replacement would be the main bearing on the input shaft and seal's of course. Plenty of folks with more experience than me with that trans but I would say that if you need to go farther you might as well go with sycros and the works.

Kurt.

nomad said:

Get a book on the Datsun transmission. Its a good and simple trans but disassembly and reassembly can be tricky. I would bet the only bearing needing replacement would be the main bearing on the input shaft and seal's of course. Plenty of folks with more experience than me with that trans but I would say that if you need to go farther you might as well go with sycros and the works.

Kurt.

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Kurt,

You are correct about the complexity of disassembly/assembly. There are several specific tools needed and many small parts that need to go back together in the right, not necessarily logical order. I would disagree with you on necessity of replacing only the mainshaft bearing. There are only 4 ball bearings and numerous needle bearings. All the ball bearing are available, but only a couple of the needle bearings are. I think out of 9 different part numbers, only 3 of 4 are attainable. The issue with the ball bearings is that the cage that separates the balls have a tendency to disintegrate. I have experienced this on all but the output shaft bearing, so 3 out of the four. If one has come apart, which one of Drew's has, then I think it's a false economy to replace only one. How far behind will one of the other's be? Also, getting to the mainshaft bearing requires complete disassembly, as it's buried the most deep, whereas the input, output and countershaft bearing only require partial disassembly.

As far as the synchros are concerned, OEM replacements are no longer available, but there are aftermarket kits available if you can find them. However, synchro condition can be measured, and frequently well within tolerance, so I would keep the OEM synchros if they still have plenty of life. None of the thrust washers are available, so you just have to live with what you have.

Gerard, you know far more about these transmission's than I do. My suggestion to just change the main shaft bearing was because I've had trouble with that and scuttle butt is that that is not uncommon. My transmission, though worn, still had usable synchro's and I thought that I would be better off living with mine than screwing it up!!

Kurt.

nomad said:

Gerard, you know far more about these transmission's than I do. My suggestion to just change the main shaft bearing was because I've had trouble with that and scuttle butt is that that is not uncommon. My transmission, though worn, still had usable synchro's and I thought that I would be better off living with mine than screwing it up!!

Kurt.

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Probably a good decision. I just happen to know that Drew's gearbox has one of those disintegrated bearings, possibly due to a marginal quality adapter plate. It's not yet know which one has gone south yet.

Gerard said:

Probably a good decision. I just happen to know that Drew's gearbox has one of those disintegrated bearings, possibly due to a marginal quality adapter plate. It's not yet know which one has gone south yet.

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Yup, found fairly large bits in the oil from the gearbox. Going to have to get in there and have a looksie, one way or another -- whether I do it or farm it out to an expert. We'll see.