Wheel bearing grease seal blues - they continue

[PatGalvin]

Hey all

I am really frustrated with these too-thick front hub grease seals. The felt seals (from BP Northwest)are just too darn thick and won't compress properly. I've installed hub on bearings without seals, torqued to 10 ft lbs, backed off one flat plus enough to fit cotter pin, and hub spins freely and feels great. Install fat felt seal and it hardly spins at all. I've had it on and off five times....

If you look at the metal backed felt seal and the inner bearing, you can see the inner ring of the inner bearing sits proud of the outer ring of the bearing. So, it pushes on the seal and causes the metal seal backing to deform and press on the outer bearing ring. See photo of grease seal on stub axle (shown this way, just to illustrate point) where inner ring of bearing pushes on inner portion of grease seal - allowing outer portion of metal seal retainer ring to contact outer bearing ring. Basically, it tightens up and won't spin without a lot of apparent drag on the hub.

In a fit of frustration, I cut the felt seal (I can always buy another) and that was ugly. The felt doesn't trim very neatly, to say the least. So now I can load the bearing properly and the hub spins properly. But the seal is mangled in there, I'm sure.

Thoughts on this? I can buy another seal from another provider if that is the answer. See several photos to show my challenge.

This is the kit manu'd by PowerTune, in case anyone cares. Thanks for any ideas

Pat

 

[martx-5]

I cut down my seals with a new single edge razor. You'll have to cut about half of it away. Mine wasn't perfect, but the felt does compress and conform. It really just needs to seal on it's inner diameter around the raised section of the axle and the cup in the hub.

 

[PeterK]

Pat - Use a nice new sharp blade. Start with a sawing action and it should cut nicely. Also soak the felt seal in some oil before installing it. I just put mine (also trimmed to ~1/2 thickness) into a jar lid with oil then squeeze oiut the excess.

 

[CinneaghTR]

Hachi Machi, how do you guys know how to do this stuff? (I ask this without looking at the manual...)

These are photos of two wheel seals offered by Rock Auto. The first being the traditional type and the second the "other" Timken type (#480991). What do you guys think of that one?

 

[TRDejaVu]

+1 on the new razor blade. With a bit of care mine came out OK.

 

[PeterK]

I set the metal part in the back of the hub and install the hub w/seal. I find it easier to install this way.

 

[pjsmetana]

...the second the "other" Timken type (#480991). What do you guys think of that one?

The worked out perfectly on the last boat trailer I fixed.

 

[PatGalvin]

I am going to order a set of these Timken rubber (or rubber type material) seals and see how they work or if they work. Won't cost much to try!

Pat

 

[CinneaghTR]

My local NAPA had the equivalent rubber seal (#14864) in stock @ $7 each. You might find it locally.

 

[davidk]

I bought the Timken that were listed for the TR-6, but they did not fit correctly. Put the old felt ones back in. YMMV.

 

[TR3driver]

The felt seals I got from TRF fit perfectly without modification.

And I wouldn't worry too much about the drag from too-thick felts. They will wear quickly until the drag is just right. As long as you've got the bearing clearance set right, just drive it.

 

[PatGalvin]

Thanks Randall

If rubber seals don't work out (I just have to try them...), I'll order from TRF. All the other suspension components they've supplied have been perfect.

Pat

 

[CinneaghTR]

Pat,

How are your wheel bearing seal blues going? I "attempted" to install my hub yesterday and started with the Beck Arnley/Rock Auto felt seal. I cut it down, probably too much because it was not longer pushing against the bearing race, and the hub still would not move in enough to clear the cotter pin hole before locking up. The Timken-spec'd seal did the same thing. I inserted it with the cup-side toward the car.

I also retried the old seal and retainer and the hub still would not move in far enough.

I am thinking that I did not seat the races enough and will be looking into that.

Finally, I am using a different vertical link than from before.

The moral of the story is that I should have repacked the old bearings and left it at that.

Thanks!

 

[PatGalvin]

Hi Jeremy
I feel for you on this one.

I ordered the rubber Timken seals. They did not fit and I will return them. Just had to try them.

TRF said to soak the seal in 90 wt oil overnight and cut it in about half or press it between a couple blocks on a vice. They also measured their seal which appears to be much thinner. I ordered two and they should be here today or tomorrow so I'll let you know on that.

Make sure the bearings races are seated. Try installing without seals and see if you can get your bearings preloaded properly without seals. That's what I do now. Install without seal, mark preload on nut, and then reinstall with seal to same nut position.

Pat

 

[CinneaghTR]

I just ordered a pair from TRF, too. Thanks, Pat. I'll try your advice.

 

[tomshobby]

Also soak the felt seal in some oil before installing it. I just put mine (also trimmed to ~1/2 thickness) into a jar lid with oil then squeeze out the excess.

I haven't installed a new seal since my TR4 in the late 60's. But I remember soaking in oil was recommended then. They would not compress and form to the needed shape when dry. Not sure how the thickness compares to the new seals of today.