Silicone Brake Fluid Warning???

[angelfj1]

Hey guys. I took advantage of CR's deal on brake components. Just received my new master for the 250. Is this something new? SILICONE BRAKE FLUID VOIDS THE WARRANTY??? So then how does this sit with everyone who feels that silicone is the best thing since sliced bread.

Confused!!!

 

[Guest]

My master cylinder cap seal tends to leak. My paint under it says "Thank You" for only using silicone fluid. Your paint may feel differently.

.

 

[Brosky]

There was no warning on any of the new parts that I got from TRF last fall when I replaced the entire system.

So far, so good.

 

[DougF]

I'm not aware of that either. I have never experienced a problem with TRF components and silicone in the 15 years or so since I've been using the product.
Hydraulic components are much easier and cheaper to replace than paint.

 

[TR3driver]

It's nothing new, Girling and assigns have been saying that for some time; so has Apple Hydraulics. I see several explanations, take your pick :

1) They (well, someone) originally put a lot of time and money into researching performance with glycol. They have no motivation to repeat the process with silicone.

2) Any excuse to reduce their legal liability and/or return rate.

3) Using silicone means you won't be buying any parts from them in the future. They would much rather you ran glycol, and had to repair your brakes every few years.

At any rate, I feel that the benefits of using silicone far outweigh the benefits of their "warranty" (which cost more, that MC or your paint job ?) so for me the decision is a no-brainer. You have to make your own decision.

But I might be tempted to return any unit so marked, saying it was not suitable for the advertised application

(I also don't deal with AH, for that very reason.)

 

[RobT]

I have been running Silicone in my hydraulics for the last couple of years - against Apples's advice.

No problem with the brake M/C, but did have trouble with the clutch M/C.

The piston would start sticking after a while, and when I pulled it apart, the bore was scored. This happend twice, so I had it resleved in stainless steel. My guess was that the rubber seals were expanding and causing the piston to stick, and run out of true, scoring the bore. Unlike the brake M/C, the clutch M/C is alloy, and quite softy, so I figured using stainless would prevent the scoring. Stainless is also suposed to wear the rubber seals faster - so if the seals did expand, use would "wear" them in. Two years later and all is still good.

Kind of reminds me of the Brit TV show -- "Are You Being Served". "The sleves always ride up with wear".

Rob.

 

[Don Elliott]

I've used silicone fluid in the brake and clutch systems in my 1958 TR3A for 18 years (98,000 miles) and never had any problems.

 

[RonMacPherson]

silicone with modern rubbers components will cause no problem.

Some clutch rubbers are not made with "modern" compounds and can cause problems.

I put a McLeod Hydraulic TO bearing in my 6 back in 88. It leaked. Red at McLeod told me that their seals were not compatible with silicone. So I took the seal(which was just a rubber o-ring type seal) to an aircraft supply store(actually it was the surplus store down in the Huntington Beach area) and got one that matched the sizing of the rubber, but was compatible with silicone. Installed it, and it worked great.

 

[Tosh]

My experience (somewhere back in the '90's) on my BGT was thus;

1) Drained existing glycol based fluid.
2) R/R Master cylinder.
3) Bled system with silicone based fluid.
4) Experienced leaks in rear wheel cylinders which had original glycol conditioned seals.
5) Replaced rear wheel cylinders.
6) Left original seals in front calipers. No leaks.
7) Clutch hydraulic system seals are original and have not failed.
8) 10-15 years use and have no complaints.

Keep on.

 

[angelfj1]

Tosh: You say that you replaced the rear wheel cylinders. Did you order them with special silicone compatable seals or just the standard run of the mill?

thanks

 

[Got_All_4]

I bought my first Triumph "Spitfire" in 1974 and my experience with Triumph brake and hydraulic clutch systems was to always use DOT 5 which is silicon. They have natural rubber components and would soon fail if you used glycol based fluids. Now there was some exceptions and as I remember when I was restoring my 1960 TR3A that Girling and Lockheed brake systems were used. The Girling must used the DOT 5. Don't remember for sure but the Lockheed could use ether. Girling had natural rubber components. TR3B's had lots of brake failures because as they recalled many parts from across the world they were installing mixed sets. Fronts would be Girling and the rears would be Lockheed and vise versa. The glycol would eat the Girling seals and the Lockheed would be fine.

I would think it would be best to know what rubber was used to manufacture of the seals before I would make a decision. These modern seals are probably a synthetic rubber. My seals for the TR3 (Girling) probably cam from TRF or Start Your Engines. (That's a blast from the past.) . It was finished in 1983 and no problems since. So far my TR250 on the road 3 years now no problems and I know those are TRF seals. I use all DOT 5. By the way DOT 4 & 5 mix like oil and water. So don't.

A little while back someone recorded a message on this subject about VB seals were not recommended to use DOT 5. I never saw a reply as to what to use. I have a 69 TR6 on the restoration stage and purchased my seals from them. They did have an odd feel to them. Any one know what to use?

 

[PAUL161]

My 72 has silicone in it. The rubbers and seals are of standard stock, nothing special. Prior to putting in the silicone, the entire system was flushed and air dried. Then installed all new rubbers and seals front and back and rebuilt the master cylinders and clutch slave. I have perfect brakes and clutch.

Sorry, I thought I was on the MG forum. Oh well, their all British.

 

[Got_All_4]

Will forgive you this time!!

 

[rchakr]

I bought a TRW brake MC a year ago, and it did not have the warning sticker you have. My silicone brake fluid has been performing just fine in this unit.

 

[Tosh]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:]Tosh: You say that you replaced the rear wheel cylinders. Did you order them with special silicone compatable seals or just the standard run of the mill?
[/QUOTE]

These were run 'o' the mill pieces.

Keep on.

 

[davester]

My 72 has silicone in it. The rubbers and seals are of standard stock, nothing special. Prior to putting in the silicone, the entire system was flushed and air dried. Then installed all new rubbers and seals front and back and rebuilt the master cylinders and clutch slave. I have perfect brakes and clutch.

What do you mean flushed and dried? I'm replacing the master, both calipers and both rear cylinders on my MGBGT to silicone, so I'm taking the opportunity to switch to silicone. Therefore, the only currently "wet" components are the brake lines. What did you use for flushing, and how did you do the drying?

 

[PAUL161]

My 72 has silicone in it. The rubbers and seals are of standard stock, nothing special. Prior to putting in the silicone, the entire system was flushed and air dried. Then installed all new rubbers and seals front and back and rebuilt the master cylinders and clutch slave. I have perfect brakes and clutch.

What do you mean flushed and dried? I'm replacing the master, both calipers and both rear cylinders on my MGBGT to silicone, so I'm taking the opportunity to switch to silicone. Therefore, the only currently "wet" components are the brake lines. What did you use for flushing, and how did you do the drying?

I pumped alcohol through the lines to flush out any old fluid. No, I didn't use Jack Daniels! I'm not that crazy! I dried the lines by first blowing them out and then setting them in the sun. Oh, I forgot to mention, the lines were not on the car at the time, neither was anything else!

 

[TR3driver]

I pumped alcohol through the lines to flush out any old fluid. No, I didn't use Jack Daniels!

Supposedly, if you do this, you should use methyl alcohol (aka methanol) (aka wood alcohol). I was able to find some at my local drugstore, by asking the pharmacist for it and explaining why I wanted it. (It's kept behind the counter because it's quite poisonous and can be mistaken for drinking or rubbing alcohol.)

 

[PAUL161]

I pumped alcohol through the lines to flush out any old fluid. No, I didn't use Jack Daniels!

Supposedly, if you do this, you should use methyl alcohol (aka methanol) (aka wood alcohol). I was able to find some at my local drugstore, by asking the pharmacist for it and explaining why I wanted it. (It's kept behind the counter because it's quite poisonous and can be mistaken for drinking or rubbing alcohol.)

Yup!

 

[Brosky]

The good thing about flushing with alcohol is that it cleans very well evaporates rather quickly to aid in the drying process.