BJ7 dip stick length

Hi guys

It is time for an oil change so I visited Bill Rawles for a supply of Mr. Penright's finest Classic 20-50. He was out of the stuff but we then had a discussion about how much should go in. OK we all know that something like 12.5 pints - 13 pints should do the trick and indeed it did when I had a steel sump. I upgraded to a DW normal Ali sump (they do a flatter type as well apparently) and put just 8 pints that came up to the mark - very strange. Bill thought that it may be the wrong dipstick for the car, I do not believe so, I have put some measurements to it and wondered if you BJ7 ers can verify that I have the correct unit or not.

All I can say is that it was correct with a steel sump so I am maintaining that the DW sump is thicker and that the meat of the metal is on the inside of the sump - ergo 8 pints up to the top mark - I have shown the positions of the low and full marks with dots.






Bob

The only thing that has changed is presumably the sump. So the new one must have a smaller internal volume , 4 to 41/2 punts is a big difference though. Can the dip tube conceivably have slid into the block ?

Bob, I measured my BJ7 dip stick and came up with essentially the same dimensions as you show above. As to Haasad's question, the dip stick tube protrudes from the engine block 4.25 inches or 108 mm.

Griz

Thanks guys

I will measure it and see what's going on but I think that haasad may be correct regarding the internal volume.



Bob

I believe the DW AL sump has less "height" than the standard one so that it is protected by the frame rails. I don't know whether it is wider and/or what effect this has upon capacity but it must certainly throw the dipstick level off.

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I reread the original post and see now that Bob used a sump with standard dimensions. Sorry, I did not realize that there was an option.

Mine takes exactly 5 litres +/- a very small amount. That equals 8.8 pints. (those are real pints, not the funny US ones )

Derek of topic but can the DW sump be fitted while the motor is in the car. Reason I ask is I'm keen to drive my car this year and although I have a gearbox to od leak that needs fixing I don't want to take the motor out till the winter. My sump is sat in the garage waiting now though?


Andy

Bob Hughes said:

Hi guys

It is time for an oil change so I visited Bill Rawles for a supply of Mr. Penright's finest Classic 20-50. He was out of the stuff but we then had a discussion about how much should go in. OK we all know that something like 12.5 pints - 13 pints should do the trick and indeed it did when I had a steel sump. I upgraded to a DW normal Ali sump (they do a flatter type as well apparently) and put just 8 pints that came up to the mark - very strange. Bill thought that it may be the wrong dipstick for the car, I do not believe so, I have put some measurements to it and wondered if you BJ7 ers can verify that I have the correct unit or not.

All I can say is that it was correct with a steel sump so I am maintaining that the DW sump is thicker and that the meat of the metal is on the inside of the sump - ergo 8 pints up to the top mark - I have shown the positions of the low and full marks with dots.






Bob

Click to expand...

Can't you ask Dennis Welch how much their sump changes the oil capacity? They must have experienced this issue or factored this in with the design?

Jeepster

That was the first thing I did in 2014 - not sure if I confused them - they started telling me that I had to trim the bottom of the dip stick - I'm afraid a gave up with them - after that. For a specialist, and a manufacturer, a pretty poor response I thought. I may try again after I have calmed down a bit more.

I have measured the tube projection and it was around 4.25 inches ish - OK.

So despite everything it would appear that the wall thickness seems to account for the variation. I have run the car with the full 12 Imperial pints (DerekJ I have taken note!) and on the suggestion of a club member, have run it on 8+ pints. Bill says he races his with around 18 pints in so putting 12 in should not harm the engine - I guess, I just have visions of the crank shaft smashing the oil all around the place.



Bob

Bob,

I was just looking at some notes I made. Seems mine takes 5.5 litres which is 10.2 pints. I'm not going to argue with Bill but 18 pints is a lot! But thats in a flat out race car and he'll have an oil cooler and windage tray installed. Still, its hard to imagine. I agree with your comments on the responses from DWR. Depends on who you get on the phone, you really have to speak directly to Jeremy. My car has a BJ8 engine and if you are not careful the dip stick can deviate from its correct route into the DWR sump. Mine did and became jammed, I could hear it tinkling when being hit by the crank. Probably why he mentioned trimming them. The mark of course stays in the same position so the trimming doesn't affect the reading.

Andy

My sump was already installed when I got the car - installed by DWR when they built the engine. I imagine you can do it in situ but you are going to need a lift and some help.

The sump is quite easily accessed in the Healey (6-cyl at least) and I expect I could pull mine off in under five (<5) minutes, once the oil had been drained (in fact, draining the oil WOULD take longer than dropping the pan). I do have a lift to work under (2 actually) but I'd done the job in my younger years while laying on my back (too risky these days__I'd be napping before I had 1/3rd of the bolts out).

If an aluminum sump decreases the oil capacity 1) with the option of shallower reservoir__and I fully understand the desire for increased ground clearance__and 2) by nature of the thicker walls required of a cast piece, then doesn't that defeat the whole purpose?

The concept is to provide greater heat dissipation via the added fins creating more surface area, but by reducing the capacity, there's less oil to carry the engine'e heat to the air passing over the fins. Aluminum provides faster heat transfer than steel, making that a plus as well.

Honestly though, considering all the dented__some severely so__stock Healey oil pans that I've seen (and own a few myself) I could never in good conscious put one on a road car without some sort of skid-plate to protect it; once again, defeating the advantage of an aluminum pan, by blocking moving air from reaching it.

Of course if the aluminum pan is fitted just for looks, and they are pretty, then it's all good!

Now HERE'S AN OIL PAN! This was a picture I'd grabbed when one of the Healey's raced at Sebring was being sold/auctioned quite some years ago (it was a BRG 3000 2-seater, RHD, but I don't recall its registration number. Just guessing, but I'd bet the original contours of the forward portion of the stock pan were left intact, providing some windage relief for the crankshaft from that vast ocean's worth of oil beneath it.

The considerable access to swap out the pan can be seen here too.



And just for the sake of anyone looking for dip-stick dimensions in the future, here's a couple of 100/6 versions. I'm thinking I have some comparison shots of the BJ8 too, but their location is alluding me at the moment...