Grinding into first

[Sportsdoc]

Got her running today and have run into the latest problem. After the car is warmed up, it will not shift into first. I'm at a complete stop, clutch in, grinds when I try to shift into first. Will go into 2nd, 3rd, 4th, reverse just fine. Also, will go into first after I shut the car off and can restart with it in first and the clutch in without problem.

Any ideas? Thanks.

 

[Billm]

On a car with a non-syncro first ALWAYS shift into second to stop the transmission motion and THEN quickly shift into first. Will make your trans last a lot longer.
Bill

 

[ThomP]

It may also mean that your clutch hydraulics are not working as expected. This could be as simple as bleeding them or the master or slave may need to be rebuilt or all of the pivot points are worn and you need some new clevis pins and levers.

 

[bugimike]

I also would suggest checking the hydraulics and maybe even the TO bearing and pivot points for excessive wear!

 

[Sportsdoc]

I suspected the clutch hydraulics, but why would it shift into the other gears?

Plus I can shut the car off, shift into first and restart the car with the clutch engaged and no movement. This is why it is puzzling me.

 

[brownsgolf]

Haven't driven a sprite, but in my dads car with a non-syncro transmission, you have to double clutch it in order to not grind. Just an idea to try.

 

[piman]

Hello Richard,

too high an idling speed can be a cause, the other question is can you select reverse quietly? If you can this probably eliminates a clutch problem.

Alec

 

[PeterC]

Richard, Get a small mirror and a flashlight. Try to look into the top inspection cover plug under the battery tray. It's not easy. With engine idling in neutral, the input shaft should not be turning. If it is, then suspect pilot bushing is tight.

But, bleeding the hydraulics is the first step.


Peter C.

 

[Sportsdoc]

Thanks for the help. My master has been rebuilt and I have a new slave cylinder, push rod and clevis pin. I had a bear of a time bleeding the slave cylinder but thought I accomplished that as I got the clutch to activate.

I don't have this problem when the engine is cold, either, only after I've driven it a while. It will go into reverse, 2,3, & 4 with no problem.

Idle speed could be an issue as I've been dealing with carb tuning, etc.

Peter, thanks for the tip. I imagine that will be tough as I recently welded in a new battery/heater plate for my old one which had a huge rust hole in it.

I plead ignorance; what is a pilot bushing?

 

[Bugeye58]

A bushing, ususally sintered bronze, pressed into the rear of the crank. The snout of the transmission input shaft runs in it, keeping the shaft concentric with the axis of the crankshaft.
Jeff

 

[john_j]

I suspected the clutch hydraulics, but why would it shift into the other gears?

Because first doen't have synchromesh.

As said above, always go 2..1 and it'll go in fine.

This does mean you have to avoid getting in the habit of doing 2..1 on your modern car though!

 

[john_j]

I suspected the clutch hydraulics, but why would it shift into the other gears?

Because first doesn't have synchromesh.

As said above, always go 2..1 and it'll go in fine.

This does mean you have to avoid getting in the habit of doing 2..1 on your modern car though!

 

[piman]

Hello Richard,

I missed the point about the engine being warm brings on the problem. Is it a Triumph engined car and does it have a plastic clutch pipe. If so this sometimes give a problem as they 'balloon' and reduce the clutch travel, However it normally affects reverse also.

The advice about the input shaft only applies if the clutch is depressed, if not the input shaft turns at engine speed.

Alec

 

[Sportsdoc]

It's a 1098 sprite. I do have a steel braided flexible clutch line, but I wouldn't think that should balloon.

I'm going to take it out again soon and check it out as I've been busy at work and it's gotten too dang cold here!

 

[piman]

Hello Richard,

OK, it was just a thought, but as I said it normally is teh same trying to get reverse also.

You did mention you had a high idle?, 700 or so is a figure to aim for.

Alec

 

[regularman]

First is a straight cut gear. The higher gears are syncromesh. Sounds like you got some thick oil in that transmission. I would suggest adding a little ATF and then drive it for a bit and then drain and refill with gear oil. Sound like that laygear (cluster gear) is being carried along when in neutral.

 

[Bugeye58]

No gear oil in the Sprite box!! Just regular 20W50, same as the engine.
Jeff

 

[bugimike]

What Jeff said!!!!!!!!! /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/thumbsup.gif

 

[Sportsdoc]

I do have Castrol 20w-50 in the gearbox thanks to this board in the past steering me the right way as usual!

 

[Jim_Gruber]

So what happens when you shift into second and then to first. Does the grinding stop? Same procedure for going into reverse since they use essentially the same gear. Curious minds want to know.