TR4/4A TR4A Assembly by a rookie (me!)

[sp53]

I am impressed that you could seal up the oil pan. I seem to always get a leak. I see you used new bolts, perhaps I should try that on this engine I am building now. This time I am going to used Geo's method with a cork gaskets set up on some glass first and then let that set up and then install the oil pan with some sealer on the other side. I thought I used some brake clean in the holes prior to installing the pan but perhaps some WD40 adhered to the threads and the oil leaked past the bolts.
How did you seal the oil pan.

thanks Steve

 

[Popeye]

Hi Steve,

I used the “gasket plus thin RTV on a glass table” method. And I cannot say that I have no leaks - only that I do not have major leaks.

The motor side of the oil pan is a machined surface, and I assumed it to be flat. I smeared some RTV on the gasket and put it on the “non-flat” formed oil pan, and set the assembly, gasket side down, on a coffee table overnight, putting weight on the pan

 

[Popeye]

Post #22 shows some photos of how I installed the gasket.

edit: post #32, sorry!

 

[KVH]

Plinthing:

To replace the plinth, I used a combination of old and new. The new plinth from TRF has an aluminum plate inside. The original has a steel plate. I ripped the foam off the old and glued the new foam aluminum to the cleaned up steel backing plate.
I wish I took more photographs, but the steel has more reinforcement at the edges, as well as an additional bolted connection to the dashboard near the scuttle vent cover. (Visible in bottom of lower photo.)

Unfortunately, the two metal plates meant the switches do not fit - the assembly is too thick. Using a Dremel I enlarged the holes in the steel plate and installed switches. See photo for reference. View attachment 84227View attachment 84229

I did exactly what you did here when I replaced the dash in one of my 4As about ten years ago. That steel backing with the side bolt is particularly comforting when the choke is hard to pull. I didn't follow that routine in my latest rebuild, and when I yank the choke I can hear the dash being jolted a bit. I do have another steel spare plinth backing with that side bolt but I'm not seeing a receiving threaded fitting for it to mate. I wonder--did Triumph change the dash design, or am I just not looking closely enough.

 

[Popeye]

I did exactly what you did here when I replaced the dash in one of my 4As about ten years ago. That steel backing with the side bolt is particularly comforting when the choke is hard to pull. I didn't follow that routine in my latest rebuild, and when I yank the choke I can hear the dash being jolted a bit. I do have another steel spare plinth backing with that side bolt but I'm not seeing a receiving threaded fitting for it to mate. I wonder--did Triumph change the dash design, or am I just not looking closely enough.

Let me see if I can take a photo. I agree, the extra stabilizing power of the side bolt is great for a somewhat stiff choke!

 

[mctriumph]

Nobody talked about replacement rods.There are now good forged steel rods on the market for under 400$
IMHO every one should have these installed in ANY re-build The reduced loads on the crankshaft
can add many years to the old iron chunk which was prone to cracking.This saves having the old iron rods
reconditioned(not cheap)

 

[Popeye]

Nobody talked about replacement rods.There are now good forged steel rods on the market for under 400$
IMHO every one should have these installed in ANY re-build The reduced loads on the crankshaft
can add many years to the old iron chunk which was prone to cracking.This saves having the old iron rods
reconditioned(not cheap)

Good points! Ultimately I got the engine back half-rebuilt, and I’m not sure what parts were used, other than the work looked to be well executed. I’m not sure if “cheap” rods are even available? Did quick searches at the usual suspects show only the better rods.

 

[Popeye]

Not too many updates. I have slowly made electrical progress: I have headlights (and high beams), instrument lights, heater blower, and an almost working horn. (The horns work if I ground the relay using a jumper, so the fault is with the grounding via horn button. The steering wheel is only temporarily attached, it still needs paint. I’ll debug the horn during final install.)

I added a protective diode and fuse to the overdrive relay, per Geo and Randall’s instructions.

TR2/3/3A - Overdrive Wiring

This is primarily for Geo or Barry, but anyone can chime in! Several years ago, Randall Young (RIP) suggested adding two things to the overdrive circuit: 1) A in-line fuse (AGC 10 or 5) in the brown/white feed from the ammeter and 2) a diode to prevent to help absorb the inductive kickback from...

www.britishcarforum.com

I grounded the heater, as well as the o/d diode, on the ground connecting the instrument lights. It seems to be a decent sized ground, and conveniently located - not to mention it should be a reliable connection. Happy to change this if folks think there is a better way.

The remainder of the electric will be finished after I mount the doors and quarter panels - and can install the rest of the lights.

Next step is the convertible top… I figure this is easier without the body panels installed / less risk of scratching paint.

 

[Popeye]

Slight change of plans: I will install the doors before the top, to make sure the windshield is properly aligned before stretching the top to it. And installing the doors means the quarter panels to make sure everything is aligned

I’ve reassembled the passenger door; the drivers door was completed a while ago. Happy to say, I had very little trouble with the waist seal install, other than dropping a clip and losing it in the door (I found it after some good swears). I used a modified Home Depot tool plus a dab of grease to hold the clips to the tool.

I installed a new window regulator from Rimmers, and the windows rolls up and down very smoothly. Given this experience, I will replace the drivers side regulator with new, as it requires pulling up on the windows to raise. (Original regulator seems straight…not sure where the difficulty?)

I will attach a plastic barrier to the inside of the door, not hang it from the windows as originally.

The door check straps are new and installed without any extra effort. I’m not sure why mine went in easily, as I read several other folks who had great difficulty - removing material inside the a-pillar and bending the straps to fit. Maybe I did something wrong… but they work exactly as intended. (The original retaining clip is still in place in the door, I did not have to replace this. Also I installed the check strap with the front fender removed, this was able to open the door 90 degrees - maybe this helped??)

The door seals require a bit of muscle to close the doors; but even after one night the doors close much easier. Hopefully after a few months the doors will close “normally”. (TRF seals.) I cleaned the various door latch bits; they had quite a bit of gunk accumulated inside them!!

And this weekend I attached the first fender plus trim strip. Yay - staring to look like a car again!! (Still have some alignment to complete; two of the fasteners won’t go in. I am working slowly, I don’t want to scratch anything.)

 

[sp53]

that car looks very solid and that is very important

 

[mrv8q]

Well documented and -told! One of these years I want to tackle my ‘3s engine.

 

[Popeye]

Well documented and -told! One of these years I want to tackle my ‘3s engine.

that car looks very solid and that is very important

Thanks both! Sometimes the car seems more solid than I…

Even took it for a spin this weekend (very short; we had to shuffle some cars in the garage - nice that the triumph can move on its own power!)

 

[DrEntropy]

Rookie no more!!

 

[Popeye]

Rookie no more!!

Still in my “rookie season”

 

[DrEntropy]

Still in my “rookie season”

AFAIC, you have your Journeyman's papers. Meticulous work, thoughtfully researched and accomplished. No mean feat, sir. The "finish line" is well in sight. I think you've created a family heirloom in the bargain.

 

[sp53]

looking good. yes having them under their own power makes the work worth it---- and of course they often need a massage.

steve

 

[Popeye]

Baby steps…

I have installed all four fenders. It was tricky to figure out the forward mounting points of the front fender. There are five bolts at the front.
From the tub to the fender: One at the “tip” into a spire nut, two just behind the grill into welded nuts on the fender.
And from the fender to the tub: one under the grille into a captive nut, and the bottom one is a nut and bolt. To further add to the complexity there is a machine screw at the very tip. I may omit this screw: it is directly adjacent to a bolt, and seems more like more like a rust spot. See small hole in photo.

Next step to install is the bonnet (maybe this weekend?). Then panel alignment. I will start from the front: the front fenders do not have much room for adjustment. The first step will be to align the fenders and bonnet. Second to align the front of the door with the front fenders, then see what the back of the door looks like. The rear fender can be moved a little. (It seems the doors want to sit forward…?)

With a little extra time in the evenings, I installed the trunk seal and boot lid. I used the “original” seal from TRF, unmodified. Some recommend using the TR6 style seal: my trunk closes a bit tight (needs a small push to latch), and the boot lid sits a high (photo shows highest spot; maybe 1/8”). But hopefully the seal compresses with a time. Otherwise I’ll put on the TR6 seal (sold in the correct length by TRF).

 

[Popeye]

Note: the chrome strips between fenders and tubs are only loosely in place; not anchored, nor is the fender hardware tightened.

 

[Popeye]

Update: after a week or so, the boot closes well. It is tight, but no extra pushing required; it is a one-handed operation. (TRF TR4a seals.)

The doors, on the other hand… still need a stout push to close. Which brings me to panel alignment:

I installed the bonnet. I removed the two headlight buckets, mounted the hinges on the tub, and lowered the bonnet into place. Then I moved the bonnet into its final position, and attached the hinges to the bonnet itself. The fit is good, but not “perfect”; if I center the bonnet left/right at the windshield, the passenger side of the bonnet sticks out past the fender, maybe 1/8” - enough to notice when close up. I assume the the fender cannot move forward; it’s pretty constrained by its many fasteners. Furthermore, the gap at the back of the bonnet is tight at the drivers side, open at the passenger side. (I do not have good photos, but will post some soon.)

It almost seems like the front of the tub is crooked - I need to take some measurements across the two diagonals to check. I might be able to loosen the attachments and tweak the tub it a little. On the other hand, it’s a Triumph, not known for precision panel gaps!

One the bonnet is in place, I aligned the front fenders. The only real effort here was to push the panel inward while tightening the A-pillar attachments (three bolts in the A-pillar and the on the bottom of the panel. This helps match the panel to the door.

Then the doors… a mighty struggle! That is until I figured out the new (oversized) seals (TRF) prevented me from moving the door into position. The door needed to go forward, but I could only compress the seals do much, and the door stubbornly refused to go where I wanted it.

My “trick”: remove one bolt, top and bottom, and I could see where the door was located by looking at the threads relative to the hole in the A-post. Loosen the top bolts slightly, the bottom completely, then move the bottom hinge while looking at the threaded hole relative to the A-pillar. (I.e. if the lower gap needs to close and move up, move the door such that the threads move forward and up.) Then tighten everything and check. Rinse and repeat. And repeat. And… you get the idea!

The front gap on the passenger door is a consistent 3/16”; any closer and the door rubs on the front fender. Any less, and the door hits the rear fender! I have not yet completed the driver’s side door.

The rear door gap is tight at the bottom, and big at the top (I didn’t measure- sorry to be vague!) I may lift the rear of the tub a little to close the top gap. But not until the driver’s door front gap is finalized.

I still need to figure out how to affix the medallion on the bonnet; the fasteners provided are too big. I might use a die and cut 4-40 threads into the posts and simply use a nut. However, the “mouse durex” rubber pieces (I love the British description!!) hold the letters nicely, and probably provide a modicum of moisture sealing.

It’s staring to look like a car!

 

[sp53]

That car is going to be very nice. Sometimes on my projects I find getting away from the car helps, but on the other hand I need to push onward also. Your balance on the work is good, you keep moving forward like a trooper and soon there will be a drivable beautiful car. nice work.

Steve