Remanufactured Laygear with welded 1st gear

[AUSMHLY]

BJ8 and other laygears; when the worn 1st gear is replaced is it heat treated for hardness like the originals were?

I've installed a new one piece reproduction from AHSpares (photo of the one with the spacer) 4 times (about 10 total miles on it) makes noise in 2nd gear. However there's been no wear to any of the gears, not even 1st.

I just installed a welded 1st gear unit. After about 1 mile, no signs of wear on 4,3,2. 1st shows wear, chipping. I've made sure to baby it when going into 1st and reverse. Haven't heard any grinding noise.

1st photo, AHS.
2nd AHS close up of 1st. (10 miles)
3rd welded next to AHS. (close up, dust shown on 1st gear sides, not damaged)
4th welded close up of 1st, (1 mile, chipping already.

 

[Bob_Spidell]

I think every manual gearbox I've ever owned--including two late-model Mustangs--makes some noise in 1st, 2nd and 3rd (4+ speed). I always assumed it's the nature of the beast. My BJ8 is particularly noisy in 2nd, but it's the original and showed no appreciable wear at 205K miles.

 

[AUSMHLY]

I think every manual gearbox I've ever owned--including two late-model Mustangs--makes some noise in 1st, 2nd and 3rd (4+ speed). I always assumed it's the nature of the beast. My BJ8 is particularly noisy in 2nd, but it's the original and showed no appreciable wear at 205K miles.

Hey Bob, the noise I'm referring to in 2nd is louder than 3,4 when acceleration and deceleration. It's the deceleration noise that's got me wondering why.

Why is your 2nd particularly noisy... yet shows no appreciable wear?
Congrats on 205K miles.

 

[Bob_Spidell]

...

Why is your 2nd particularly noisy... yet shows no appreciable wear?

No idea, except that straight-cut gears, note your laygear has one, are known to be noisy. I've heard the Sebring and Tulip gearsets, which I think are straight-cut, are particularly noisy. By 'particularly noisy,' I just meant it's louder than the others, but I don't spend a lot of time in second anyway (it's too low, IMO, and I shift to 3rd as quickly as I can). The shift lever also jumps around a little in 2nd, which should be worrisome, but the only gear I've had jump out is fourth.

Even a perfectly-running Big Healey is a cacophony of noises; it's part of the appeal to me. I think we'll miss some of the noises in our quiet, soulless electric future (fake engine and exhaust noises piped-in will be no substitute).

 

[Keoke]

(fake engine and exhaust noises piped-in will be no substitute).:

Better make a CD NOW!!-LOL

 

[AUSMHLY]

(fake engine and exhaust noises piped-in will be no substitute).

I believe that is an option one can purchase on some new vehicles now… not kidding.

 

[Bob_Spidell]

I believe that is an option one can purchase on some new vehicles now… not kidding.

I hear some of the Dodge Bros 'muscle' cars will have it.

 

[Editor_Reid]

I believe that is an option one can purchase on some new vehicles now… not kidding.

One of the exhaust pipes on the BMW i8 is a speaker. BMW loaned one to Sports Car Market magazine when I worked there, and we were amused no end! By the way, it sounded great. It was also very fun to drive, and with its styling and
“swan doors” (similar to gullwing doors), it was not a good choice for shy people.

 

[AUSMHLY]

Fake engine and exhaust noises piped-in...

The SoundRacer V8

 

[AUSMHLY]

Getting back to my original question...
BJ8 and other laygears; when the worn 1st gear is replaced is it heat treated for hardness like the originals were?

 

[bobhustead]

All transmission gears have to be heat treated or they rapidly fail.
Bob

 

[AUSMHLY]

All transmission gears have to be heat treated or they rapidly fail.
Bob

Bob, are there different degrees of heat treating? What's your take on the AHSpares wear on 1st with 30 miles vs the welded with hardly any miles?

 

[bobhustead]

I don't know anything about the specifics of heat treating, like degrees of hardness. There are no doubt engineering standards for degrees of hardness. Resistance to abrasion and resistance to shear are 2 different things. I am pretty sure you can't heat treat the welded repair. You have no idea of the composition of the weld metal versus the original metal.
If you have a welded gear in your transmission that is being driven tooth by tooth, you will soon have damage everywhere from the chips and chunks, no matter how much babying you think you are doing.

 

[Scot]

My BJ8 is living proof that these welded 1st gears do not last. I was obviously not aware it was welded on when I bought the car in 2001. The car was not driven many miles since its restoration a few years prior. It lasted about 10 years before the weld broke free. No idea about the heat treatment. I suppose it was fortunate there were no bits if any that did any damage since I was stopped at low engine speed when it gave way. New laygear installed and all has been good since.

 

[AUSMHLY]

New laygear installed and all has been good since.

New laygear as in not a welded 1st gear? Who makes it, where did you get it from?

 

[Scot]

I looked back on the invoice from 10 years ago and the work done on it. The part was an AEC3649R reman laygear. The cost was $425 and not sure where it came from but I recall the shop searched for a long time before they found this one!

 

[AUSMHLY]

If it was NOS you're lucky. If one is available now, it'd be over 1k

 

[Keoke]

Well TH I have an OEM one I found in Germany a long time ago along with a second gear never needed to replace them.

 

[Keoke]

My BJ8 is living proof that these welded 1st gears do not last. I was obviously not aware it was welded on when I bought the car in 2001. The car was not driven many miles since its restoration a few years prior. It lasted about 10 years before the weld broke free. No idea about the heat treatment. I suppose it was fortunate there were no bits if any that did any damage since I was stopped at low engine speed when it gave way. New laygear installed and all has been good since.

Well considering that the added gear is constantly under a slip load I think
You were very lucky it lasted so long,

 

[bobhustead]

Scot
In regard to post 14, I was going to say that the life of a welded gear being 10 years is unbelievably good. But does post 116 suggest that the reman might have not been a weld?
Bob