General Tech More Engine Rebuild Questions

[KVH]

I have several questions with regard to the reassembly of my engine, etc.

1) the new timing chain tensioner pin that I bought would require a lock washer behind it in order for the rear face to be flush with the engine block--and the threading seems to demand a washer. None of the manuals or parts catalogs appear to show a lockwasher there, however, despite that, I feel I must use one and also some Loctite. Any feeling in that regard?

2) I have a new aluminum front engine plate. My old steel one has some “hole distortion” where the generator pedestal fitting goes. So, I intend to use the aluminum plate absent reports they are problematic?

3) I intend to install the front damper extension and torque it to spec while the engine is still on the stand. If I do that am I creating any problem when I drop the completed engine and transmission into the engine compartment?

4) I am once again curious about opinions for the front engine plate gasket sealer. I can use Permatex Aviation, Permatex High Tack, or Permatex Ultra Black. Any of those seem acceptable to me.

5) Same question for sealing the engine oil pan. I’m inclined to go with High Tack.

6) Finally, is there any thought as to how high off the garage floor my car frame should be when I’m reinstalling the engine and transmission. I’m about 12 inches off the floor and a transmission jack will slide under. Does that sound about right? I seem to recall pushing the tail of the transmission up by hand last time I did this, then shoving that rear support piece into place.

Thank you all.

(Sorry for the tome)

 

[CJD]

Wow...let's see how I can do:

1) The tensioner vibrates in use, and will wear pretty much anything that it touches. I would do whatever is required to keep it centered and off either the plate or the cover. You should be able to bend it slightly if needed to ensure it remains centered.

2) No experience.

3) If you plan to install the radiator and apron after the engine goes in...then installing the extension now is fine. If you already have the radiator in place, I would leave the extension off until the engine is in.

4-5) The only sealant I have moved away from is the silicone (ultra black for one). It works great...it's just a pain to remove later. I have used many sealants and can't say any are bad. The plate is one of those items that likely did not need sealant when new, but they are old and warped now, so a sealant is a great idea.

6) 12" will be fine. You need at least 6" as the tranny goes in from the front with the motor. More than 12" and you have trouble using the floor jack, in case you need it.

Take some pics for us!

 

[KVH]

Okay great. I'll take some pics.

 

[mezy]

for fitting an engine i use one of these on the hoist, you can adjust the angle of attack when dropping it in and then level the engine and box when you get near to the mounts, save stuggling and all the pulling and pushing

 

[KVH]

I’m glad you posted that picture, because I already have a decent load leveler, but I am out searching for a better one. What I don’t understand is what those L-brackets are for. I have a lifting bracket on the rear of the engine and a lifting eye on the front of the engine. I’d like to use those lifting points, as they were intended in manufacture, and those L brackets seem like they might get in the way. Your thoughts?

 

[mezy]

See where your coming from,
The one I have has hooks on the end not the L brackets. And goes straight onto the lifting eyes.

 

[charlie74]

They’re probably there for other engine layouts (V 6’s or 8’s). When I used one of these to install my engine a few weeks ago I took them off and ran a length of chain through the clevises to the lifting eyes on the engine.

 

[Popeye]

1) the new timing chain tensioner pin that I bought would require a lock washer behind it in order for the rear face to be flush with the engine block--and the threading seems to demand a washer. None of the manuals or parts catalogs appear to show a lockwasher there, however, despite that, I feel I must use one and also some Loctite. Any feeling in that regard?

I reused the original pin - even though I purchased a new one. If memory serves me, the replacement threads were too long, and the original pin was in excellent shape. )I’ll have to confirm this when at home.)

I used only a washer on top, per the parts manual.

 

[CJD]

I would think the 4-point would keep the engine level side to side, no matter what you adjust with the fore and aft angle. With the traditional 2-point lift, as you adjust the fore and aft angle, it will also tilt the engine slightly side to side, as one side picks up more lift than the other. I don't think the side to side change on this engine will be a problem. Of note...the way shown in Charlie's pic could be problematic. If you adjust the fore and aft, the chain will slide through the rings, which could cause the whole engine to end up vertical. If you do a 2-point lift with a chain through the eyes like that, be sure to lock the chain into at least one eye to prevent slipping.

All the engines I have pulled...it sure would have been nice to have an adjuster like that!

 

[mezy]

It worked great on my mx5 engine and box with just two chains corner to corner. Amazing how much you can get the R's end down and front up.
Slips in like a banana.

 

[Popeye]

2) I have a new aluminum front engine plate.

3) I intend to install the front damper extension and torque it to spec while the engine is still on the stand.

4) front engine plate gasket sealer.

5) sealing the engine oil pan.

6) how high off the garage floor my car frame should be when I’m reinstalling the engine and transmission.

2 - no experience, but suspect it would be good quality. If I recall correctly, the only challenge in fabrication is the plate is not flat; I think it has a crease in it -??

3 - ok to do, and IMO preferred because you can put a block of wood blocking the crank, and access to the bolt is better without other bits in the way. As John said above, install the radiator after the engine (a good idea also to avoid accidental damage to the fragile radiator).

4 - I used Indian Head shellac gasket sealer, as John said, I suspect it does not matter too much, as long as oil, gas, and coolant resistant.

5 - I used Permatex aviation gasket sealer as (1) imperfections are larger, and (2) shellac gasket sealer is hard to remove. Before installing the pan, it helps to hammer the bolt area as flat as possible - ie around the bolt holes, to reduce leakage paths.

6 - is your body on the frame? I lifted the body off, and left the frame on the wheels /suspension (ie no lifting). I think it was reasonably straightforward - other than my nerves - but keeping things level was difficult. Level both front/back, with an engine leveler, but I also tied a cone-along for left/right leveling. I found this helped with aligning engine mounts. I did not install the carburetors, distributor, manifolds, or cooling piping prior to install to give me the most room.

As always, I’m sharing my experience… not the only answer!

 

[sp53]

Ok I want to play too

1) Mine was like yours and I did what you are doing. It seems best

• 2) No experience with aluminum. The one I am going to use is not perfect, but where the tensioner goes there is no scaring. One or two holes are elongated, I remember the generator hole was egg shaped, but I think I can fix it or make it work
• 
  
• 3) I leave off the engine what I can to make thing lighter. I do think the dampener will be in the way.
• 
  
• 4) The area in front to seal is large and I wanted the gasket sealer to be evenly spread. I think I used some red kinda goop that smeared on ok, but I was not in love it because in spreading it started to build up. Perhaps some spray something would work better there, just do not know. I am open on what sealer use. I have used a lot different types with no favorite.
• 
  
• 5) Same I wish I could clam success on a tr3 oil pan.
• 
  
• 6) 12 inches sounds good.

steve

 

[Geo Hahn]

For the pan gasket I used cork affixed to the pan with RTV and the whole thing placed upside down on a sheet of glass to set up very level.

On the engine side you now have a very flat cork against a flat machined surface so Hylomar can be used.

RTV is a bother to remove but at least if that day ever comes you'll be working on the bench scraping the pan and not lying on your back scraping the block.

 

[KVH]

Great. Thanks Geo

 

[Popeye]

For the pan gasket I used cork affixed to the pan with RTV and the whole thing placed upside down on a sheet of glass to set up very level.

On the engine side you now have a very flat cork against a flat machined surface so Hylomar can be used.

RTV is a bother to remove but at least if that day ever comes you'll be working on the bench scraping the pan and not lying on your back scraping the block.

Exactly what I did - thanks for refreshing my memory! The result is RTV on the lumpy side and the now “perfectly” flat gasket on the machined side (plus your favorite sealer - I used permatex aviation).

 

[charlie74]

Of note...the way shown in Charlie's pic could be problematic. If you adjust the fore and aft, the chain will slide through the rings, which could cause the whole engine to end up vertical. If you do a 2-point lift with a chain through the eyes like that, be sure to lock the chain into at least one eye to prevent slipping.

All the engines I have pulled...it sure would have been nice to have an adjuster like that!

I can see what you’re saying and how it could be an issue with the transmission installed but I had no such problem and the amount of adjustment to the level of the engine was minimal but it was certainly helpful…