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Well, we got the fuel problem solved but noticed that one fitting at the "T" in the brake system was dripping a little bit. Tightening it made it worse so we took it loose and made sure it seated properly. Of course then we needed to bleed the brake lines. Fluid just sort of "runs" out of the rear lines and squirts out of the front calipers. Brakes are now pretty much crap even though they worked fine with the slight leak. We are at a lose(sp?) as to what we should do!! Any suggestions? Thanks
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One thing after another
- Thread starter GaryBeu
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RATS!!
Not bein' able to GO is a problem but not bein' able to STOP is worse.
Sounds like you're needing to go through the entire brake system.
Is the fluid you see leaking coming from hoses or fittings? You say the front calipers are squirting... from parts where the pads are or where the hoses attach?
Not bein' able to GO is a problem but not bein' able to STOP is worse.
Sounds like you're needing to go through the entire brake system.
Is the fluid you see leaking coming from hoses or fittings? You say the front calipers are squirting... from parts where the pads are or where the hoses attach?
No, no, no...The calipers squirt when we open the bleeder valves. Lots of pressure. The rear bleeders only "run". Nothing is leaking now...we only had the one small leak at the "T" but now we have very little brake pressure. Can't seem to accomplish much with bleeding.
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Ah. Good.
The fluid shouldn't "fly" out of the rear bleeders, but a steady flow would be expected on pedal depression. You started (bleeding) at the rear, yes?
I suppose it is possible some 'junk' may be blocking the rear circuit. Are you getting any 'action' at the rear cylinders? IOW, with the rear wheels off the ground, spinning the wheels and applying the brake. Should stop spinning and lock up tight. Do NOT remove the drum to check, as the pressure will pop the pucks out of the cylinders and you'll have a real mess. :wink:
Which t-fitting was the leak coming from? Can't envision just removing/reattaching a line would cause a blockage. Have you visually inspected the lines running rear for any kink or crush evidence? Seen some Bundy lines on the diff smushed from inconsiderate tow-truck drivers using chains on the axle tubes. Since you replaced one of those the diff lines must be okay... Line from the engine bay to the rear crushed from an unlucky 'grounding' of the chassis. Rare, but not impossible.
If all is normal in appearance I'd be for disconnecting the lines at cylinders and up front, blowing them out with air to be sure they're clear. Messy job but lots of paper towels and water to wash/wipe the fluid off the coachwork and parts helps. Is your master cylinder new-ish? That's the only other thing in the equation I can think of. But start with th' simple stuff first.
The fluid shouldn't "fly" out of the rear bleeders, but a steady flow would be expected on pedal depression. You started (bleeding) at the rear, yes?
I suppose it is possible some 'junk' may be blocking the rear circuit. Are you getting any 'action' at the rear cylinders? IOW, with the rear wheels off the ground, spinning the wheels and applying the brake. Should stop spinning and lock up tight. Do NOT remove the drum to check, as the pressure will pop the pucks out of the cylinders and you'll have a real mess. :wink:
Which t-fitting was the leak coming from? Can't envision just removing/reattaching a line would cause a blockage. Have you visually inspected the lines running rear for any kink or crush evidence? Seen some Bundy lines on the diff smushed from inconsiderate tow-truck drivers using chains on the axle tubes. Since you replaced one of those the diff lines must be okay... Line from the engine bay to the rear crushed from an unlucky 'grounding' of the chassis. Rare, but not impossible.
If all is normal in appearance I'd be for disconnecting the lines at cylinders and up front, blowing them out with air to be sure they're clear. Messy job but lots of paper towels and water to wash/wipe the fluid off the coachwork and parts helps. Is your master cylinder new-ish? That's the only other thing in the equation I can think of. But start with th' simple stuff first.
Yes doc, we started bleeding at the rear and have a steady flow on depression. With all bleeders closed, the pedal goes down about half way and feels sort of like it hits a "stop". You don't get anymore by pumping it...shouldn't it sorta "pump up"? We'll lift the rear off the ground and check the action.
The "T" fitting at the diff which has a rubber flex line (new) was leaking at the driver side line fitting...we just loosened and refitted. We'll check all of the "easy stuff" and post our results. Thanks a million for your input
Gary and Carla
The "T" fitting at the diff which has a rubber flex line (new) was leaking at the driver side line fitting...we just loosened and refitted. We'll check all of the "easy stuff" and post our results. Thanks a million for your input
Gary and Carla
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From your last description, it could be that the rear shoe adjustment is not quite right.
Is your e-brake adjusted and working? reason I ask is: if you apply the handbrake and then pump the pedal, see if that changes how it feels. If it feels more like a "normal" brake, the shoes are too far in and need adjusting. Spinning the wheel and turning the adjuster cloclwise (looking from the backing plate) one "click" (1/4 turn) at a time until the shoes ~just~ sound like they're dragging is right. Settle the shoes by pumping the brake pedal or pulling the handbrake a few times and check the spinning wheel again for the "sound". Re-adjust as necessary.
Is your e-brake adjusted and working? reason I ask is: if you apply the handbrake and then pump the pedal, see if that changes how it feels. If it feels more like a "normal" brake, the shoes are too far in and need adjusting. Spinning the wheel and turning the adjuster cloclwise (looking from the backing plate) one "click" (1/4 turn) at a time until the shoes ~just~ sound like they're dragging is right. Settle the shoes by pumping the brake pedal or pulling the handbrake a few times and check the spinning wheel again for the "sound". Re-adjust as necessary.
OK...we lifted the rear wheels and adjusted the brakes. Rebled all four and got quite a bit of air out of each then we still DO NOT HAVE ANY BRAKES!! We can start a rear wheel spinning, push the pedal down and nothing happens. The pedal goes down about half way, sort of "hits a stop" and that's it. Haven't blown out the lines but plenty of fluid moves through so they surely aren't clogged. If we have fluid at all four brakes, what can keep them from doing something?
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Gary from what you are describing, I might be looking very close at the actual pedal mechanism. Is it binding on something? Is something blocking it? On mine the clevis pin was pretty worn - though the hole itself wasn't oval yet. It may be that you're overthinking this.
Latest news on the brakes...we checked the pedal JP and all looks OK. Fluid in master cylinder is full, no lines kinked or crimped. Bled lines again and get fluid at all four with no air coming out. We jacked it up and have front brakes but still none in back. I'm attaching photos of both brakes with drums off as I'm not SURE the shoes are on properly. Keep in mind though that we HAD GOOD BRAKING until we reset the one back line to stop the small leak. Any more ideas?? THANKS!
Sorry, forgot the photos 1st time! :frown: 1st photo is passenger side and 2nd photo is driver's side.
Sorry, forgot the photos 1st time! :frown: 1st photo is passenger side and 2nd photo is driver's side.
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The brake mechanicals look to be correct. I see nothing there to prevent things from working.
I ~DO~ see something to cause me concern from a safety standpoint, tho...
Gary, please find a replacement for the concrete blocks. At the very least, change the way you stress them (turn them 90° so the "webbing" is compression loaded) with that jack! Those things are "brittle" and will (and HAVE) disintegrate(d). Wood planking or steel, please. We do NOT need to learn you have found this out the hard way!
Flipping the blocks (if you insist on using them) so the openings are up and putting a 2x8" plank on 'em is BY FAR much safer.
I ~DO~ see something to cause me concern from a safety standpoint, tho...
Gary, please find a replacement for the concrete blocks. At the very least, change the way you stress them (turn them 90° so the "webbing" is compression loaded) with that jack! Those things are "brittle" and will (and HAVE) disintegrate(d). Wood planking or steel, please. We do NOT need to learn you have found this out the hard way!
Flipping the blocks (if you insist on using them) so the openings are up and putting a 2x8" plank on 'em is BY FAR much safer.
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Gary, the only thing I can come up with is something isn't right in the master cylinder. With all the work you've done and no success, I'd pull the lines off the master cylinder and see if the pedal will go fully down. If not, the master cylinder is screwed up. If it does work properly, then check the shuttle valve. PJ
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DrEntropy said:
Good call, Bro!
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If the pedal pushes fluid to all four corners, albeit "slower" on the rears, that switch ~may~ be the answer. A quick check would be to unscrew the switch and see if there's a "valley" for the switch actuator... if it looks cylindrical in there the shuttlecock has shifted. There's a fair cut-away illustration of that device in the Bentley book, IIRC. We've had fifty-fifty success re-centering 'em thru the switch hole.
BTW Doc...THANK YOU for calling my attention to the concrete blocks. I do know better but sometimes (as in this case) expediency causes stupidity to manifest.
The fitting where my pressure switch is installed looks nothing like the one in the Bentley manual. Mine has 5 lines coming in/going out. My eyes aren't good enough to see down into that little hole so I'm waiting for Carla to get home and help.
The fitting where my pressure switch is installed looks nothing like the one in the Bentley manual. Mine has 5 lines coming in/going out. My eyes aren't good enough to see down into that little hole so I'm waiting for Carla to get home and help.