• Hi Guest! Being a Paying Supporter is NOT a requirement to participate at BCF. However, subscribing will help ensure we can continue to serve the LBC community for years to come. If you enjoy BCF and find our forum a useful resource...Please consider supporting us by **Upgrading**
    (PS: Subscribers don't see this banner)
Tips
Tips

TR2/3/3A New engine mounts not sitting flat

71TR6

Senior Member
Country flag
Offline
Hello all,
Another question on my TR3A restoration.

I just installed the engine with new engine mounts and it was a bear getting bolt holes lined up. It appears the angle of the engine mount attach point for the mount is different than the angle on the frame. It results in a gap as seen in the image.

IMG_1776.jpg

I don't recall having this much of an issue when I did my 6. Is this normal and will the mounts settle in eventually?

Ron
 

CJD

Yoda
Country flag
Offline
Did it sit off like that before you tightened the bolts? It may need to be shimmed.
 
OP
71TR6

71TR6

Senior Member
Country flag
Offline
There was a good 3/16" space on each mount. Both sides pulled in at the bottom when I tightened the bolts and had the same gap at the top edge.

Ron
 

CJD

Yoda
Country flag
Offline
Now I am confused. If the gap was all the way across the mount, what was holding up the engine?
 

DavidApp

Yoda
Gold
Country flag
Offline
Do you have a radiator with the crank hole? If you do does the hole line up with the crank dog?

The holes in the mounts may be in the wrong position. How did it look before you had the bolts installed?

David
 

Graham H

Jedi Warrior
Gold
Country flag
Offline
I do recall seeing something like this once before and the problem was the front engine plate was for a TR4 which has different front mounts, could this be your problem?

Graham
 

Jim_Stevens

Jedi Trainee
Gold
Country flag
Offline
+1 on Graham.
Ron, yes definitely something is wrong. I just did it a few months ago on my 3A and all was tidy. ISTR the shims being flat, not wedged, so if true that’s not gonna work either. Looks like you also have a small gap also at the front and above of the mount? Is the rear mount correct? If the front plate is indeed correct, it looks like the engine is tilted forward 5-degrees.
 

sp53

Yoda
Country flag
Offline
Can the mount be 180 out? Can the mount spin around and correct the problem. I think the studs are not centered so it might be the problem
 
OP
71TR6

71TR6

Senior Member
Country flag
Offline
The mount hole locations and the stud location are in the same location as the old mounts I removed from the car. Based on the pictures I took before I pulled the engine, I believe the orientation of the mounts is correct and not 180 degrees out but I'm certainly open to anyone's feedback whether this is indeed the case. Maybe the PO had them in the wrong way and they settled in to fit?

As far as the rear mount, I needed to mill slots in the mounting holes to move the transmission mount back since I'm using a later TR4 overdrive transmission I picked up that is slightly longer. That fits fine.

As far as a TR4 front engine plate, it's unlikely but given the pedigree of this car, it is possible. The engine number is clearly correct for my TR3A. What are the differences between a TR3 vs TR4 engine plate?
 

charleyf

Jedi Knight
Bronze
Country flag
Offline
When you modified the rear engine/ transmission plate, did you also grind down some of the flange at the rear of that plate? This is the flange that sits up a good 1/2" on the rear of that plate. It does not seem that that much would make the difference you are having. But one does need to grind off the rear flange.
 
OP
71TR6

71TR6

Senior Member
Country flag
Offline
Charley, I avoided needing to grind off the rear flange you mentioned by milling the transmission mount holes into 5/8" slots to allow the mount to butt up against the flange and then milling the frame mount holes around 0.10" in the opposite direction to allow the transmission holes to match perfectly with the mount holes. There is no binding fore-aft on the engine/transmission.

Ron
 

Madflyer

Jedi Knight
Country flag
Offline
I think Graham has a good point but the other way did you get TR4 mounts instead of TR 3. It looks' like the mounting holes are a bit off if you take the bolts out of the frame it would sit flat. Where did you get the mounts ?? Moss ?? If it did not sit like that with the old ones that would be the first place to check and compare. It looks like a half hole off and the mount would be the only thing to modify. Looks like you are moving along well send more pic.. Madflyer
 
OP
71TR6

71TR6

Senior Member
Country flag
Offline
I dug through my stash of parts and came across another engine plate and it is very different than the one on the engine- here is an image. I noticed immediately the pads appear to be much smaller (maybe better suited to the round TR4 mounts?) and have 45 degree clipped corners. Is this therefore a TR4 plate?

TR4mount.jpg

Here is a view of the engine plate and mount that is on the engine. The mounting pad on this is more rectangular and has a rounded pad corner. Does a TR4 engine plate have these characteristics?

TR3mount.jpg
 
OP
71TR6

71TR6

Senior Member
Country flag
Offline
Madflyer- to respond to your question concerning the engine mount possibly being for a TR4, the mount I have is Moss PN 810-011 which is for TR2-TR3B

I just found an image on Rimmer's site for a used TR3 engine plate and it looks like mine...

301251U.JPG


They also list a used TR4 plate that looks like what I suspected is the TR4 plate I have.

304711U.JPG
 

poolboy

Yoda
Country flag
Offline
Has there been any frame damage or repair that could have caused this ?
 
OP
71TR6

71TR6

Senior Member
Country flag
Offline
Ken, you bring up a good point. The right front end of the car had suspension damage that I had repaired by a frame shop. They pulled the top of the shock tower back out along with the short frame section immediately behind the shock tower. I ended up replacing the lower fulcrum pin myself since that was mangled. The frame and shock tower are back to spec but it is possible the angled piece the mount attaches to the frame may still be out of whack. I wasn't able to find any specification on what this angle needs to be but I'll take some measurements tomorrow and see what I find.

From what I can see just looking at it, something is out by a couple of degrees and it is possible that could be on the right side. The engine settles into the middle and splits the error between the left and right side which would be why it is pulling up on both sides. A 0.1" gap on the top of a 5" long mount translates into just a shade over one degree and would explain the gap on the left side mount (which is the same on the right side) in the image I sent earlier.

I may have to machine one or more custom angled shims to correct this. I'm hoping I don't have to add 3/16-1/4" of shims since I'm not sure what else this will affect besides just raise the engine slightly.

Thanks everyone!
Ron
 

Graham H

Jedi Warrior
Gold
Country flag
Offline
Hello Ron,

I just checked my front plate and mounts and yours is setup the same as mine and looking at the way the front plate is made I can't see how the angle where the mounts bolt on could be changed without completely destroying the plate so the only area that could be out is the angle of the frame. Looks like a wedge is the likely fix and you will be the only one who knows its there.

Graham
 

bobhustead

Senior Member
Silver
Country flag
Offline
It looks like this could be solved by removing the mounts and elongating the holes in the lower plate downward. A flat washer on the bolt head would probably hide the elongation.
Bob
 
OP
71TR6

71TR6

Senior Member
Country flag
Offline
Thanks everyone. I'm going to figure out how to mill a couple 1 degree wedges today out of some bar stock. That should take the worst of the angled difference out of it and the rest will be taken up by the mount compliance (I hope).

I'll post what I come up with. Never a dull moment with these LBCs!

Ron
 

CJD

Yoda
Country flag
Offline
I just scowered the manual to see if there is any reference geometry to measure...no luck. The 2 checks I would do before going too far is to first look at the crank lug through the radiator to see where that sits. That is to get an idea if your engine is sitting too high. If it sits to high, you will have interference issues later in the build, so VERY important to check. Too low will cause contact between the steering tie rod and the crank extension.

Second is to install the frame cross brace to make sure it will not change the position of the frame.

Once you look these over you will be in a good position to decide how to handle it.
 
Similar threads
Thread starter Title Forum Replies Date
D TR2/3/3A Engine mounts Triumph 11
Bob_Spidell Engine Mounts Austin Healey 19
KVH TR4/4A Dropping the Engine and Transmission Back onto the Mounts Triumph 22
S TR2/3/3A Engine mounts Triumph 8
C 3000 engine rubber mounts Austin Healey 1
F TR2/3/3A Engine Mounts TR3A Triumph 2
oxford Engine mounts Austin Healey 0
Boggsy64 MGB Transmission engine mounts and front engine mounts MG 0
H TR4/4A TR4A engine mounts Triumph 4
M Engine Mounts Spridgets 1
coj Motor Mounts AH 3000-1960 with 29 F engine Austin Healey 6
coj Engine mounts 1960 AH 3000 with 29 f ENGINE Austin Healey 1
W Replacement frame engine mounts for a 100-6 Austin Healey 4
S MGB MGB engine mounts - "extra" plate? MG 2
T TR4/4A TR4a engine mounts - round vs rectangular & vendor Triumph 13
drooartz Do I use: trans brace, braced engine mounts Spridgets 2
CinneaghTR TR4/4A TR4 v. TR4A engine mounts? Triumph 4
KVH Engine Mounts Triumph 4
S Spitfire Rear engine mounts - Spitfire Triumph 2
M Engine Mounts Austin Healey 3
Bruce_B Source for Motor Mounts for 1275 engine? Spridgets 4
JPSmit Tonight's Questions - engine mounts Spridgets 4
Guinn engine mounts MG 2
Hegg Elan +2 - Engine Mounts and Clutch Adjustment Lotus 6
Dave Russell Big Healey Engine Mounts Austin Healey 10
W Loose engine mounts MG 3
D Is my engine JUNK? Spridgets 4
S Engine or Tachometer Odd Problem Austin Healey 7
K TR2/3/3A Rebuilding an Engine?..New Cam Sprocket & Gear...1/2 Price Triumph 0
G TR6 Engine Cutout, Black Smoke, Large Backfire Triumph 7
J TR2/3/3A TR3 engine cylinder top clearance Triumph 22
D TR2/3/3A Engine shakes as it is accelerated. Triumph 26
D Land Rover engine swop. Rover / Land Rover 0
BoyRacer Rover 3.5L (Buick 215 c.i.) Engine Swap Austin Healey 15
Kolecki TR2/3/3A engine assembly cam timing issue Triumph 8
Pool Dad 1960 TR3 engine serial number Triumph 14
J TR2/3/3A "TR3" painted on the engine block Triumph 13
R Engine Number Plate Austin Healey 2
BoyRacer Engine Swap: 3000 Engine Into a BN1 Austin Healey 22
alexisrexx TR6 Engine Hoses Kit or Hose by the foot? Triumph 6
B Bugeye Original Engine Compartment Sheet Metal. Act Fast! Spridgets Classified 0
BoyRacer Nissan/Datsun engine swap into a 100/4? Austin Healey 30
G TR4/4A "Engine seized after engaging overdrive at low speed. Triumph 26
B COMPLETE DROP-IN Rebuilt 1975/6 MG Midget 1500 engine PLUS rebuilt Spitfire Overdrive trans NEVER INSTALLED Spridgets Classified 0
D Engine replacement. Rover / Land Rover 0
pairof75's General TR Circulate fluids without engine start Triumph 10
nicko Strange Engine Noise Austin Healey 7
AngliaGT WANTED - Cheap TD Engine/Transmission MG Classifieds 0
tr6nitjulius Oil flow view inside operating engine Other Cars 4
B TR4/4A Engine ground strap Triumph 5

Similar threads

Top