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what could be wrong now??????

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terriphill

Darth Vader
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Engine in, everything hooked up. Torqued the head down to specs (3 times) Set all the rockers according to spec. Detached the coil wire so it wouldn't fire off immediately. Turned the key. It spun around freely like there was no compression about 5 or 6 turns then quit spinning and all I heard was clicks. Acts like its locked up.
Can't turn the harmonic balancer at all with it out of gear.
We just picked up this motor new rings, turned and balanced the crank, replaced the bearings, balanced rods, new camshaft and lifters.
AAAAAAARGH. Any ideas. Removed the starter, removed the head again. 1 and 4 pistons down, 2 and 3 pistons half way up. Still can't get the harmonic balancer to budge. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/confused.gif
 
I don't know much at all about 1500 motors but to me it sounds like you might want to look at the timing chain which may be broken and locking everything up- it's a long shot but maybe worth a look.
Bill
 
I would have to guess timing chain as well. I really can't see anything on the bottom end locking up the engine and you've already proved you don't have any damage on the top end. If you dropped the thrust washers I would think it would still turn over but the thuds from the bottom would be enough to make you not want to rotate it. Seriously suspect the timing chain.
JC
 
Couldn't stand to wait. Went out to the garage and unbolted enough of the timing cover bolts enough to peer into the abyss......You nailed it!!! The timing chain is off and laying in the bottom. I won't know unitl I pull the motor tomorrow what happened.
Since its attached to the cam gear....is it possible the guy who rebuilt it didn't get the camshaft gear torqued down? This is really getting ridiculous!! The first rebuild forgot thrust bearings! This is the 4th time I have had to pull this motor. I knew I should have checked that timing chain, but he had sealed it up and I figured this meant he had done what he said he would do!!!! I could have paid tuition and taken classes and done better than this for less money!!!!! Hence the reason I try to do as much of the work as possible myself. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/hammer.gif
 
When you rebuild those 1500s, I think you have to shim the crank sprocket out to line it up with the cam sprocket. If your rebuilder didn't know that, then maybe the shims aren't there and the sprockets are not aligned.
Cheers,
Derf
 
Is the chain intact? Sounds like there is something else going on. I can't imagine anyone who would have enough sense to bolt an engine back together not noticing the sprockets were out of alignment enough to pop it off. If the chain is indeed intact, then I would think it was too large for the application. You might look at the tensioner but even if there was no tensioner a stretched chain should have stayed on the sprockets. I think there is something else going on here bud. Check it over closely.
JC
 
Terri, I feel your pain. I too have my motor apart AGAIN thanks to the fine work of some slack jawed machinist. Stay strong.
 
Terri,
I can just feel the frustration growing. However you've answered a question for me. I'm getting my engine back from the machine shop this weekend and I wondered if I should check all his work (clearances,bore size, etc..) before I build the engine.

Now I know the answer is a definite yes. Good luck with your troubleshooting. Keep us all posted.
 
A definite YES. Never leave it up to the machine shop. Check ALL clearances, dimensions & fits. Plasti Gage is an easy way to verify many bearing clearances.

Clean all oil passages, crank shaft included, cylinder bores, etc in hot soapy water. Compressed air dry & coat with a silicone spray or something to prevent rust. Any clearances that are off, or even a tiny piece of grit in the wrong place can rapidly destroy an engine or shorten it's life.

The final bore honing operation will definitely leave microscopic but harmful grit in the bores. You need hot detergent & scrubbing to float this stuff out.

Engine cleaning brushes are available or the right size rifle barrel brushes will work.

Verify ALL torque settings.

I would never leave this step up to the shop. They just don't have the time or inclination to do it really right. Some don't even think that it is necessary.
D
 
Highly ugly. Impossible to know from here why a chain would "jump the rails" but it SHOULDN'T be possible on a fresh rebuild. No matter ~what~ "flavor" it is. It was either defective new parts (no pro I know would use the OLD chain/assembly) or a serious inattention to professional workmanship practices. Either way it would seem you'd be better off learning the machine from the inside out on your own. If this was a shop you may have recourse. Be professional but firm. There's no way it was "abused" if events went as you've described. It was only on the starter to see O/P.
 
OK got the motor out his afternoon and removed the timing cover. Turns out the chain is still in place and seems tight and correctly assembled. Still cannot budge the crank. I haven't yet removed the oil pan to see why its locked up but its definitely locked up. I called the guy who did the rebuild. He is VERY PROFESSIONAL! He is highly recommended by members of the British Motor Club here in Central Arkansas as the best. I am sure he will stand by his work, but we still want to know what could have happened.
 
That being the case let HIM do the "forensics" work. He'll want to see it first hand. IMO there's no reason he shouldn't have you over his shoulder as it comes apart, either.
 
Could be something simple like a locked up oil pump? I'm not sure what all you've tried but I think I would have to agree with Doc on this one. Give it back to the man who charged you money in the first place but bird dog him this time and make sure it is put together right.
JC
 
DrEntropy said:
IMO there's no reason he shouldn't have you over his shoulder as it comes apart, either.
Click to expand...

I am sure he would LOVE for me to be there bird-dogging him. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/rolleyes.gif He actually loves to share knowledge and always has LBC people around his shop doing their own work while he adds input. I probably should have done it that way to begin with and done it myself under a "tutor" but I am so new to this that I am often afraid to ask. I shoudl have though cause so far...I've never met anyone who works on these that doesn't love to share their knowledge and information.
I'll keep ya'll posted as to the outcome of this.
My husband has officially upgraded the name of my car from Jezebel to Satan!!!! I will need a cross to hang over it in the garage soon to exorcize the evil that seems to plague this car.
A year ago I bought it and was told it needed a battery and clutch slave.....oh where we've gone by then. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazyeyes.gif

But I keep telling myself.....its not the destination, its the journey that is so fun!!!!
 
Good to see you have the right attitude. Sometimes when I come in to the house, with bleeding hands and broken parts (Parts that weren't broken until I touched them!) - I have to remind myself that it's a hobby, and yes...it is fun.

As far as naming it Satan....Will your license plate have '666' on it next?
 
terriphill said:
DrEntropy said:
A year ago I bought it and was told it needed a battery and clutch slave.....oh where we've gone by then. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazyeyes.gif

But I keep telling myself.....its not the destination, its the journey that is so fun!!!!
Click to expand...
.
i'm laughing nervously ... my son asked me yesterday, while i was closing up the tranny rebuild, if i was almost done. i quitely said "almost". i have no idea what "almost" means in this case.
Click to expand...
 
You are never done. That's the joy. Always things to think about and plan.
 
Took the motor back to the guy who rebuilt it. He took it apart AGAIN. He couldn't find anything wrong. It spun free, all clearances re-checked for the new bearings. Crank looks good, cam beautiful everything in place and fresh. In fact he kinda looked at me like I was a little nuts (OK maybe I imagined that part---I certainly felt like it). It would not turn or budge when I pulled it. Of course I didn't try to force it for fear I would make the problem worse.
It has been mentioned that perhaps it could have been the transmission, but this spins free. The timing chain is new and tighly sealed in its housing. It spins freely now. Maybe I really am losing my mind and dreaming all of this....or maybe the car really is possessed and thinks its funny.
 
I vote on possessed!! I have had similar issues. I think I have done just about everything on this car twice.
 
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