VB poor parts quality

[nomad]

I have noticed that if the parts are priced about the same from the common vendors they are usually the same part. Quality has become a problem for us but we should be thankful there is a somewhat competitive parts network for our cars. Though there was many more japanese car models built finding parts for them can be a real headache.
As for me I will continue to spend an inordinate amount of time on e-bay looking for good used and nos parts.
KA.

 

[Guest]

I apologize for not having the Vendor Review forum turned on, but this discussion was a reminder to me that I needed to turn it back on. Now that I've turned it back on, I'd appreciate if folks would use it to rate vendors (including the ones you like) and post your real-world experieices there.

Thanks,Basil

Didn't know we had that. Great idea.

 

[Guest]

Lotus 1600 twin-cam engines are master link single row. And nearly six feet long.

Doc, did that come factory w/ a link?

 

[Guest]

In the rules, which EVRYONE HERE agreed to upon joining, we ask that you NOT engage in what sometimes (not always) amounts to vendor bashing. but rather only posts that relate YOUR experiince in a factual manner.

Now that I've turned it back on, I'd appreciate if folks would use it to rate vendors (including the ones you like) and post your real-world experieices there.

Thanks,

Basil

Boss, was I out of line?

 

[regularman]

If you don't like the master just put the link in there and brad the ends then it can't come apart at the master as there will be no clip. I never had a problem with the master clip coming off of anything and I work in industry where we use them all the time at fairly high speeds.

 

[SilentUnicorn]

An unmarked timing sprocket is a good thing. Generally sprockets and chains are replaced at the same time. And if rebuilding the engine then a new cam is generally fitted.The unmarked sprocket is a reminder(at least to me) to degree the cam properly.
When that is done I then make my own marks on the sprockets. Can you imagine if these items were produced and shipped with the marks already in place? The cam sprocket is designed to mount in at least 4 different orientations. How could the manufacturer determine just how an engine is going to be set up? How could they account for the variations in manufacturing? It would make these items extremely expensive. Can you imagine the fella that relies on a pre-marked sprocket? Does not degree his cam and then wonders why his engine doesn't run correctly? I will take an unmarked sprocket any day.


Mark

 

[billspit]

If you are installing an aftermarket cam, the markings on the cam gear are wrong anyway.

 

[DrEntropy]

Lotus 1600 twin-cam engines are master link single row. And nearly six feet long.

Doc, did that come factory w/ a link?

Yup. And fine adjustment to timing (cam) is altered with various offset dowels to locate the sprocket to the bump-stick.

I'll take a chain with a master link over those poxy BELTS any day...

But that's a discussion for another thread. :smirk:

 

[Westfield_XI]

Sounds like the old Microsoft joke: "it's not a bug, it's a feature!".

 

[markberry]

I like the idea of having a place like this to discuss these problems and help each other avoid being taken advantage of. Or just being unnecessarily inconvenienced. Our cars all suffer from the same problems eventually and it helps out immensely to be able to draw from other's experiences with replacement parts. Having said that, I have to agree that we need to be careful in how we go about discussing Vendor's shortcomings in public. Nobody wants Basil to get shut down over a slander issue.
Maybe we could post short, succinct, factual descriptions of the problem (pictures are very helpful as well), with the vendors name included, in the Vendor review forum. Then hyperlink or make another post in the "marque specific" forum to alert members to examine and chime in with their thoughts and experiences (on the Marque specific forum). The Vendor in question could then be invited to review the post if the administrators of this forum deem appropriate. Just an idea.
Mark
P.S. thanks Kellysguy for bringing up your problem! I'm sure it will benefit some of us in some way.

 

[Guest]

Can you imagine if these items were produced and shipped with the marks already in place? The cam sprocket is designed to mount in at least 4 different orientations. Can you imagine the fella that relies on a pre-marked sprocket? Does not degree his cam and then wonders why his engine doesn't run correctly? I will take an unmarked sprocket any day.Mark

Mark,

Yep, go in a parts store and see if you can find one without them. MILLIONS have been sold and installed using just the marks and things have worked out just fine.

It will mount in 4 diffrent locations, but only has two differnt timing variables. (by half a tooth either way.)

Line up the marks and it will run right. It might not be perfect optimal timing.....but it didn't come that way to begin with. Those that are that worried about it who run a wilder cam, can opt for the adjustable gear, which is why they make it. It left the factory with marks and they were lined up. It doesn't make manufacturing sense to degree EVERY cam that comes down the line, thus they have marks. In the real world, marks work out just fine. Neither my BL 1500 manual nor my Chilton say ~anything~ about dialing it it, but both give nice purty pitchers of sprokets with marks and a straight edge to line them up.

I have seen/sold and installed hundreds, if not thouands of timing set and each and evey one had marks, be it small engine or big diesel. (they do it on gear set too.)

Kim, I have had these things spit off on me since I was a child. My dirt bike would spit the link and pile the chain up into the case and bend my clutch rod ~EVERY~ time. On ALL of my street bikes that were chain driven (about 50), the master would come off sooner or later and either pile in (maybe crack) the case, drag down the road or lock the rear wheel.

I do not trust these things ~AT ALL~!

I've seen the dowels before, and offset keys, but they have always started off on marks. I don't mind the belts that much anymore, unless on an interference engine. Means more $$$ fer the service guy.

 

[SilentUnicorn]

I would like my engine better than when it left the factory. To each his own.

m

 

[Morris]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:]I've seen the dowels before, and offset keys, but they have always started off on marks. I don't mind the belts that much anymore, unless on an interference engine. Means more $$$ fer the service guy.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, the Honda dealer has made a mint on that one.

 

[Guest]

I would like my engine better than when it left the factory. To each his own.

m

I'm with you, but 99% of the DIYer market is just glad to have it going again. Plus, most chains sold are for replacement, rather than a complete rebuild.
( At least historically, as belts now own the market.)

Now with the engine in question, it's just a rering and fresh bearings w/ a worn stock cam. I put the old chain and gears back in as they weren't that far off from the new stuff. I prefer a slightly looser chain to one that has the chance of a link comming apart.( no matter how slight that be.) I'll be happy w/ another 5K out of this engine. That's about two years in my world with my current driving habbits. At this point I'm just happy with my car on the road till I build another engine.

Now the ~next~ motor, that's a different story.

 

[Guest]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:]I've seen the dowels before, and offset keys, but they have always started off on marks. I don't mind the belts that much anymore, unless on an interference engine. Means more $$$ fer the service guy.

Yeah, the Honda dealer has made a mint on that one. [/QUOTE]

Allow me to clarify.

I like the belts as a PM sale, ~NOT~ when they frag a motor.

 

[nomad]

Just another .02. It would seem that vendors if they want to stay in business rather than just make a fast buck would realize that they are shooting themselves in the foot by not supplying the very best of parts. Selling poor quality only tends to drive enthusiasts away from the hobby. A friend of mine, who had been a long time brit car driver, sold his MGB after the terrible quality hoses being supplied a couple of years ago dumped all its antifreeze on his garage floor while it sat unused over the winter. This was the last straw for him after several other problems caused by poor quality parts.
I'm sure that lack of and poor quality parts are only going to make cars that a few years ago would be restored end up going to the junk heap and a few less enthusiasts in the sport.
Kelleysguy is doing us all a favor and I only hope the vendors read this.
I have delt with Moss for 40+ years now and miss the day when the parts people would come right out and tell you if a part was up to snuff. If a part is'nt the same as stock it would be nice if they would at least note that.
KA.

 

[Guest]

I sold my Z for the same reason, but I wasn't all that crazy about it to begin with. Thanks for the support. AS an ex-parts guy, this drives me NUTS !!!

 

[bthompson]

Lotus 1600 twin-cam engines are master link single row. And nearly six feet long.

Doc, did that come factory w/ a link?

Yup. And fine adjustment to timing (cam) is altered with various offset dowels to locate the sprocket to the bump-stick.

I'll take a chain with a master link over those poxy BELTS any day...

But that's a discussion for another thread. :smirk:

Hey, Doc, you're an Alfisti...
Didn't Alfas have master links and cam adjustments like that too?

 

[DrEntropy]

Yeah, double row chain and the cam sprockets are actually more complex; they have "adjustability" built in. Multiple holes to attach to the stick. Not as neat as the Jag sprockets (a kinda vernier deal... two piece, very elegant) but dialable.

Alfa and Jag use two chains, lower to drive a jackshaft, upper for the cams. Chapman (Costin & Duckworth) built in lightness by using one LONG chain.

 

[DrEntropy]

As an adjunct to the thread, Google "Regina chains"... high quality internal in addition to motorcycle apps.

This is an illustration I did 25+ years back for a business card... Highly stylized Lotus engine. Pro'lly the last one with actual ink on paper! Koh-i-nor pen and drawing table. :wink: