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TR2/3/3A Tr3 original rear oil seal

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sp53

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Hi tr3 people I was wonder if anybody has installed an original rear main seal lately. I understand that crankshaft has the oil deflector built in. However, I do not want to minimize the installation of the aluminum seal. Some of the literature I have suggests:

1. Check that the two halves of the rear seal bear the same number. These are machined as a mated pair and failure to observe this instruction may result in oil leakage. Shellac the top half of the upper oil seal and attach it loosely to the cylinder block by its four bolts and lock washers. Shellac and similarly fit the lower half of the oil seal to the rear bearing cap. Ensuring that the crankshaft mandrel is clean lay it in the rear bearing housing (without the shell bearing). Fit the bearing cap and tighten down sufficiently to nip the mandrel. Tighten the eight bolts to secure the oil seal to the cylinder block and bearing cap (torque loading of 8-10 lbs.). Remove bearing cap from block.
2. Fit the upper half of the main bearing to the cylinder block; thoroughly clean and lubricate; place the crankshaft in position.
3. Fit the lower halves of the main bearing to the bearing caps, and lubricate.
4. Thread the two top hales of the thrust washers at the side of the center main bearing between the crankshaft and the cylinder block.
It is essential that the white metal side is towards the crankshaft.
Fit the trust washers, one either side, to the center bearing cap and lightly secure with the two bolts and lock washers to the cylinder block. Fit the two remaining caps to the cylinder block with two bolts and two lock washers each.
5. Commencing from the front of the engine tighten the bearing cap bolts to the correct torque (see data). On tightening the rear bearing cap tap the oil seal lightly so that the joint between the two halves is flush.
In the absence of a crankcase mandrel the oil seal attachment bolts will still be loose at this juncture. They should now be tightened to a torque loading 8-10 lbs. ft. The bearing cap must be tightened down so that the oil seal division is flush.


I know this is kinda drawn out, but my questions are what would work best for the Shellac? How important is the mandrel tool?

Regards George
 
sp53, the best seal compound I have used of late is the JBWeld gasket compound. Just a light smeer will do the trick, be sure and put some between the halves. The mandrel tool would be nice but not something that will guarantee it won't leek. Wayne
 
I asked a long time local sportscar guy before I rebuilt my last TR motor. On his reccomendation I took the Shellac literally and went to the hardware store to get it.Regular old shellac, like you would use to finish wood, is exactly what they used on them at Sandard Triumph. I have a mandrel, It's really nice to have. There was no doubt that the "seal" was lined up. But I'm sure fitting it around the crank would align it just fine.
As for leaking... They do.
With the "seal" properly aligned it's minimal but, no matter what you do, when the car sits it will leak.While it's running, there is a spiral groove machined into the crank that keeps the oil in the engine but There is no positive seal involved in the factory setup. The cotter pin that is through the hole in the bottom of the bell housing is to keep the hole clear so the leaking oil dosen't pool around the clutch.
Moss offers a conversion kit that uses a modern rubber seal, part # 837-005 for around $150.(I'm sure the others offer one too) That's the only way I know to totally stop the rear main from leaking.
 
Hi Banjo and thanks for your comments. I was wondering did you let the shellac dry or did you attach it when it was tacky or wet to the block?
Regards George
 
Assemble the parts with the shellac wet. when it dries, that's what seals it (old school RTV, yo? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif). Those pieces of felt that you pack on either side of the bearing cap, make an awful mess. Have a rag handy. A little laquer thinner takes off any extra.
 
Thanks for listing your old post and the other information.
 
I believe that there is nothing wrong with the orignal style scroll seal, but it has to be positioned properly. My recent engine rebuild shows NO sign of leakage. You can't just use the crank to align the seal, as it will be "off" by the amount of clearance in the bearings.

Two problems seem to exist. One is that the alignment tool that is commonly available is the wrong size. It is larger then what the recommedation is by several thousandths of an inch. The other problem is that I, and several other people, believe that the recommendation in the Triumph service manual concerning the size of tool is also not right.

When I took my engine apart, I left the seals in place, as I wanted to actually measure the opening as my engine before teardown leaked almost no oil. I wanted to see what that dimension was. Well, it turned out to be exactly what is referenced in this thread. I wound up making my own alignment tool based on those figures.

If you set the seal wrong, it will leak. Do it right, and it won't...or at worst, will be very minimal.

Edit: OK, now I see that this is a five year old thread...boy, that was a long winded bunch of stuff I just gave out.
 
Permatex #3 is also a good substitute for gasket shellac.
 
IMHO you must use a very slow drying sealer,then when the crank is in place, you can move the seal halves into alignment and tighten up the bolts. This is after you have spent the time to plasty gauge the seal and hand fit as required for the proper clearance.......
MD(mad dog)
 
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