TR6 TR-6 brake pedals in a TR4A including booster &...

[nissanite]

looking to upgrade my braking. I want to have a double chamber master for safety. My friend crashed his 49 1800 last year when the master failed. I have too much invested.

Has anyone done this complete swap? My only concern is the bead rolled firewall on the 4.

Is the 6 flat?

Any pics of a 6 without the booster in place?

 

[tdskip]

Not sure but I think the TR6 MC should fit with some work. You can bypass the booster by just running lines from the MC to a brake proportioner.

Flat? Not sure what you are asking there.

 

[tdskip]

The TR6 has a different bolt pattern than the TR4, so mounting it will take some work.

TR4 one for reference;

You might be better off trying to find another similar bore size MC that as the vertical bolt pattern.

I think a Volvo 140 series might work actually.

 

[M_Pied_Lourd]

nissanite,

Here is a pic of my 6 with the booster and back plate removed.

Cheers,
M. Pied Lourd

 

[nissanite]

That is exactly what I was looking for. Thank you.

I have a pedal assy & booster with both cylinders. The front of the TR4A, where the spacer plate goes has 2 beads rolled in it. I will need to flaten those out, cut holes & drill away. Then the old TR4A holes will be filled.

Sounds like alot of work but the safety of front & rear brakes seperate incase of failure will be worth it.

 

[DanB]

Take some pictures as you do this conversion. This is something I have been thinking about for the same reasons. Did you see the race car someone posted recently with the extended pedal box for an extra brake cylinder? That is another option I have been thinking about.

Dan B
WV

 

[TR3driver]

Like this?

 

[DanB]

Yes! Where did you get that? Or is it a custom fabrication?

 

[TR3driver]

Don't recall where I got the photo, but I think the assembly came from Revington

 

[Andrew Mace]

The TR6 has a different bolt pattern than the TR4, so mounting it will take some work....You might be better off trying to find another similar bore size MC that as the vertical bolt pattern.

I'm not sure about bore sizes, but the later Triumph Spitfire and GT6 dual master cylinders have the vertical bolt pattern and, AFAIK, should bolt up to the same kinds of brake line fittings you have now.

 

[martx-5]

Here's the set-up I originally made for my TR3. However, Randall correctly pointed out that if I used the same size cylinders as original, that my braking forces at the wheels would be less and that I'd have to go to smaller bore masters. I calculated that about two 9/16" cylinders would provide the same force as one 3/4" cylinder. They don't seem to make them in that size, 5/8" is the closest. I abandoned the project for now, but would like to return to it one day.

I wonder what size cylinders Revington is using?? Probably 5/8". Since the TR3 has a pretty heavy pedal as it is, I don't know if I want to go to that size.

Edit: BTW, the Revington setup for the TR3 has you widening the opening in the firewall to accept their set-up. I managed to squeeze it all in without doing that, however, I would then need another remote reservoir. Not a problem, however, the other problem would be brake bias. I don't have a lot of room between the two brake master on the bias rod, so it would be tricky to get that just right. A lot of trial and error, but it could be done. ANy one know where to get 9/16" or even 1/2" cylinders???

 

[TR4nut]

Art-

Did you manage to do that without modifying the bulkhead? That would be better than Revington, as they say for the TR3 you have to cut the bulkhead because they enlarged the brake box some.

Randy

 

[TR3driver]

Since the TR3 has a pretty heavy pedal as it is,

That's interesting; mine doesn't seem all that heavy. In fact, I just noticed the other day that, although it worked fine in driveway testing, my brake light wasn't coming on in normal driving ... not enough pressure to trigger the switch. And my brakes are stock (at the moment), except for DOT 5 fluid and removing the guts from the RPV.

But I did keep the brake pads from the wrecked 3A, and now that I think of it, they did take awhile to bed in and start working well, so perhaps that's part of the difference. The rear shoes may be the 'Kevlar' ones I got from TSi, just don't remember offhand.

 

[martx-5]

Art-

Did you manage to do that without modifying the bulkhead? That would be better than Revington, as they say for the TR3 you have to cut the bulkhead because they enlarged the brake box some.

Randy

Yes I did it without widening the bulkhead...see my edit on the previous post.

 

[martx-5]

Since the TR3 has a pretty heavy pedal as it is,

That's interesting; mine doesn't seem all that heavy. In fact, I just noticed the other day that, although it worked fine in driveway testing, my brake light wasn't coming on in normal driving ... not enough pressure to trigger the switch. And my brakes are stock (at the moment), except for DOT 5 fluid and removing the guts from the RPV.

But I did keep the brake pads from the wrecked 3A, and now that I think of it, they did take awhile to bed in and start working well, so perhaps that's part of the difference. The rear shoes may be the 'Kevlar' ones I got from TSi, just don't remember offhand.

You know Randall, I thought about the brake pads, and they are the ones that were with the calipers I took from work (4-piston Toyotas). I'd like to try better pads, as I'm sure the ones we supply aren't the best...customer's don't want to pay for that.

If I find a set of pads that work better then what I know have, I will revisit the dual set-up with 5/8" cylinders.

BTW, I was working on that project with Tony at Ratco as a possible product for him to sell. I liked it because you didn't have to modify the firewall. We'll see. For now, I'm going to hunt down some better pads. Any ideas???

 

[TR3driver]

For now, I'm going to hunt down some better pads. Any ideas???

I believe EBC offers their "Greenstuff" pads to fit the TR3 (probably have them for the Toy calipers too), and they are supposed to work pretty good.

Or, TSI can reline any pad or shoe with their 'Kevlar' compound. I bought a full set with the intention of trying them out, but got distracted and lost track of which ones they are. The shoes may be on the rear of TS13571L, but I'm pretty sure the pads are still in a parts box, somewhere. Probably mixed in with all the asbestos pads I squirreled away "back when".

Cost was about $50/axle plus shipping both ways (you have to supply the cores to be relined) but that was a few years back so it may have gone up.

Surface finish is important too, you might want to invest in something like this:
https://multimedia.3m.com/mws/mediawebserver?66666UuZjcFSLXTtMxf2LXT2EV76EbHSHVs6EVs6E666666--

But I just use crocus cloth & my fingers to break the glaze.

 

[PeterK]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:]
looking to upgrade my braking. I want to have a double chamber master for safety. My friend crashed his 49 1800 last year when the master failed. I have too much invested.

Has anyone done this complete swap? My only concern is the bead rolled firewall on the 4.

Is the 6 flat?

Any pics of a 6 without the booster in place?[/QUOTE]

I bought a TR250/6 Heritage bulkhead repair panel from TRF. I plan to install it in my 4A tub to repair rust at the bottom of the panel (which attaches at the driver front floor) and install a TR6 m/c & booster servo. I'm not sure that I'll use a PDWA but I have collected and rebuilt all parts and lines to do the conversion. Waiting on time, ambition, and warmer weather.

If you want I could trace the mounting holes to transfer to your 4A or you could just buy a panel, think they were very resonable. I could also take a photo of the bare panel but not until the weekend.

 

[nissanite]

PeterK,

The tracing would be fantastic. I am going to the body shop in a week. The shop owner is not familiar with this and is reluctant. If it could be traced for him it would be much easier. Let me know what you need to get the tracing to me.

Thanks

 

[martx-5]

For now, I'm going to hunt down some better pads. Any ideas???

I believe EBC offers their "Greenstuff" pads to fit the TR3 (probably have them for the Toy calipers too), and they are supposed to work pretty good.

Or, TSI can reline any pad or shoe with their 'Kevlar' compound. I bought a full set with the intention of trying them out, but got distracted and lost track of which ones they are. The shoes may be on the rear of TS13571L, but I'm pretty sure the pads are still in a parts box, somewhere. Probably mixed in with all the asbestos pads I squirreled away "back when".

Cost was about $50/axle plus shipping both ways (you have to supply the cores to be relined) but that was a few years back so it may have gone up.

Surface finish is important too, you might want to invest in something like this:
https://multimedia.3m.com/mws/mediawebserver?66666UuZjcFSLXTtMxf2LXT2EV76EbHSHVs6EVs6E666666--

But I just use crocus cloth & my fingers to break the glaze.

Thanks for the info Randall. I'll give the EBC Greenstuff a try first.

 

[TR4nut]

Thanks for the info Randall. I'll give the EBC Greenstuff a try first.

Just get ready to invest in a good wire wheel cleaning setup - I have Greenstuff pads on my TR4 and cleaning the alloy rims is a neverending task due to the pad dust.