Stuck Engine. Help!!!

[martx-5]

I also agree with pulling the head. Just remember to lock down the liners with some washers, spacers and nuts before you try to turn things again. You don't wnat to dislodge the liners from the figure of eight gaskets. Hopefully pulling the head with shed light on what's going on.

 

[Silverghost]

Just some thoughts.
Take the engine back to the state where everything rotated freely one step at a time. If it is still sticking, you'll know to look elsewhere.
When you removed the rocker gear, did you take off the chain for the cam shaft?

 

[sp53]

It is early here for me so let me throw this out. If the crank was installed by an experienced person, I might check to see if something has not broken in the clutch and holding the ring gear, or something to the effect. Can you see anything from the starter hole on the flywheel like a bolt or something, but like said, you will most likely sleep better if you pull the pan.

 

[trfourtune]

I think i would pull the engine, head,and pan, and go over everything very carefully. I'm sorry but i just do not trust anyone else. You will sleep better at night if you go though the entire engine. A set of gaskets is all it will cost you. Plastercene on top of the pistons will check valve clearances. If there is corrosion in the pistons or liner, then it is better to clean it up than to run it that way. Could be a rod bolt was loose and jammed against the block? Better to KNOW what it is than to proceed and possibly ruin a new engine.
valve stuck?
Rob

 

[martx-5]

... Could be a rod bolt was loose and jammed against the block?
Rob

IIRC, on the TRactor motor, if you install the con rods backwards they will hit the block.

 

[Moseso]

IIRC, on the TRactor motor, if you install the con rods backwards they will hit the block.

This is true! Don't ask me how I know this...
However, it's unlikely to be the cause, in light of his description. He said the motor DID turn over a few times and, later, would no longer do so. If the rods were in backwards, it would never have turned over.

Actually, I don't think it would be possible to get them all in wrong. I discovered my error after putting in two, and then trying to rotate the crank to a position where I could get the other two in. Oooops!

 

[PAUL161]

Don't know what happened to my previous post, but it seems to have vanished. In it I said it could possibly be the reaction of the piston and/or rings in one or more cylinders due to a dry cylinder condition which could cause possible galling of the pistons and/or rings. If it was my engine, I wouldn't turn the crank one inch until I pulled the head and pan for a visual inspection. As stated before, if your engine has liners, lock them down before turning the crank with the head off.

 

[Don Elliott]

Frank - A good engine rebuilder will do the crankshaft and bearing shells first. With the thrust washers as well. Then he will test it by hand pulling on the connecting rod ends to see that it all rotates a turn or two. Then he would continue to put in the next parts like the cam sprockets and the timing chain and re-test it after each step. That's the way I do it and I'm not an expert.

BTW, I don't believe that 6 months would really damage an engine or affect it in any way. When I restored the BRG TR3A for the owner in Toronto, he had just had his engine re-built and he said it ran fine. That was just before his accident where he found himself being "plowed" sideways along the freeway by the front bumper of a huge tractor trailer. He survived but he has about 12 screws and plates in his left leg and ankle.

Then it sat 3 or 4 years under a tarp in his garden. Humidity all summer and snow all winter. Then I undertook the 7-year restoration putting it onto a "new" frame. He specifically told me not to touch the engine. I checked the compression cold and it was about 20 psi on each cylinder. So, after 7 years, I finished the car and started the engine. It warmed up and ran fine. After all that, the compression measured 160 to 175 on each cylinder.

I goes like a bomb, even after 11 years sitting idle.

 

[angelfj1]

<span style="text-decoration: underline"><span style="font-weight: bold">Update. Friday, 10-3-08, 18:00 EDT</span></span>

Oil drained - crystal clear - no trash.

oil filter off and drained - filter element clean no evidence of trash, shot from con-rod peening, etc.

pan off - nothing obvious. no nuts, bolts, washers, or other trash in pan.

initial inspection shows most surfaces generously coated with assembly lube.

connecting rods installed correctly.

tomorrow morning main and thrust bearings will be removed and examined along with crankshaft journals.

if crank still doesn't turn (while it is disconnected from the pistons) the problem must be in the clutch, flywheel, ring gear area. If the crankshaft does move, the problem has to be one or more stuck pistons. Then the head must come off.

hope to have another update later this weekend.

fja

 

[ChaSto59]

I am sure you know this, but will offer it just in case. I recently completed a rebuild of my Spitfire engine, and recall that the connecting rod rods have the cylinder number stamped on each bearing cap, and stamped on the end of each connecting rod. You have to install each bearing cap such the the numbers line up together. If you reverse a bearing cap so that the number on the cap does not align with the number on the connecting rod, the engine will lock up and not turn. Seems too simple, but you never know . . . .

 

[TR3driver]

BTW, I don't believe that 6 months would really damage an engine or affect it in any way.

Don, I would agree with you, except that I have seen it happen. Years ago, a friend of mine left his MGA parked in my driveway while he went off to the Army. I was a little slow getting around to trying to start it, but it couldn't have been too long as he hadn't shipped out yet when I discovered it was locked solid.

 

[angelfj1]

<span style="text-decoration: underline"><span style="font-weight: bold">Saturday, October 04, 2008</span></span>

Update on stuck engine.

This morning we accomplished the following:

• Removed all con-rod bearing caps. Upon examination the crankshaft journals and bearing shells appear perfect and are still liberally coated with assembly lubricant.
• With the rods free from the pistons, we could easily (with one finger) move the pistons up and down in their cylinders.
• Tried to rotate crankshaft – frozen – can’t rotate in either direction.
• Removed the center main bearing cap, shell and thrust bearings. Again, the crank journal looked perfect. Examined shell and thrust bearings – they look perfect.
• Tried to rotate crankshaft – frozen – can’t rotate in either direction.
• Did not remove the rear or front main at this time. May have to later.
• While under the car we used a length of SS wire to push up on the bottom of each lifter. All eight lifters moved smoothly in their bores. All eight push rods were removed (one at a time) and checked for length and straightness. The measurements are exactly the same as recorded six years ago.
• Removed the transmission and clutch. Found nothing wedged between the ring gear and bell housing. Transmission input shaft, clutch and flywheel look perfect.
• Note: the crankshaft and camshaft are now completely frozen. There is absolutely no motion possible, not even what you would expect with normal slack in the timing chain. Whatever is causing this problem has gotten worse since last week we were able to rotate the crankshaft about 30 degrees forward and reverse.
• So far we have eliminated stuck pistons, valve gear, transmission, clutch, ring gear and bearings.
• We have a new theory. Whatever is causing this problem prevents motion of both the camshaft and crankshaft. Normally there is a small amount of relative motion possible between the two due to the slack, albeit small, in the timing chain. However, now both are frozen solid. We suspect a problem where something, possibly a piece of the timing chain has broken and lodged between the two sprockets.

Tomorrow or Monday we’ll remove the timing chain cover and see what’s going on inside. I hope to post another at that time.

 

[hondo402000]

cant offer any advise but what a bummer to have to disassemble the engine to find the problem. but better it happen now rather than driving 55 and it happen. Interesting to know what the problem really is.

good luck
Hondo

 

[DNK]

When I rebuilt my motor maybe 5 years ago. Been so long I don't remember when. I didn't change the sealing block. Should I go ahead and do it before I start this beast if it ever happens?

 

[Brosky]

After that amount of disassembly on the bottom, there is nothing left but the cam gear/crank gear/chain combination being locked up with something.

Unless.............................

One of the bolts on the REAR sealing plate is out of position and is jammed against the back of the flywheel?

 

[Tinster]

Wow, that's really sad Frank!

I know exactly how you feel. Install a system,
gut ut out, try again, gut it out, etc.

Maybe my method might work for you, also.
Take everything apart down to indivudual nuts
and bolts. Purchase all new parts and give it
a go again?

<span style="color: #000099">Keep at it --think back about viewing the dreadful
leak in my brand new water pump!! Now try to see
the 9/16" wrench protruding from the housing.

Sometimes the obvious is so obvious we don'y see it!

d</span>

 

[angelfj1]

One of the bolts on the REAR sealing plate is out of position and is jammed against the back of the flywheel?

Paul - no fortunately the flywheel is clear.

 

[angelfj1]

Wow, that's really sad Frank!

I know exactly how you feel.

Sometimes the obvious is so obvious we don't see it!

d[/color]

YES and I'm not even a celebrity like you. Great article in <span style="font-weight: bold">"Triumph World Magazine"</span>

 

[Brosky]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:]Now try to see the 9/16" wrench protruding from the housing.[/QUOTE]

And after the socket fell out, I thought your tool tray was full again Dale!!

Better get that wrench out of there. Vibrations can suddenly loosen things up and that would not look good getting jammed into your radiator core up in the mountains.

 

[martx-5]

One of the bolts on the REAR sealing plate is out of position and is jammed against the back of the flywheel?

Paul - no fortunately the flywheel is clear.

Did you take the flywheel off to see??? I didn't read that you had done that. Wouldn't hurt to check...only four more bolts.