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TR4/4A Starting without Transmission attached

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ghawk16

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So I'm going to be pulling the transmission back from the engine today to see if I can find out where my leak is coming from. If it is not evident that it's a plug or the RMS can I run the engine briefly with the flywheel, clutch disc, pressure plate attached and disc alignment tool inserted that way I can see where it is leaking from? I'm thinking it wouldn't be an issue, but JUST want to be sure. Let's all pray for a plug leaking and NOT my RMS!!!! Thanks for the confirmation.
 
The alignment tool is not needed, I would leave it out.

Make sure you have the engine well supported, Murphys law says this is the one time it will backfire and try to jump off the jack.
Otherwise, should be no problem.
 
I ran my boat diesel (40 HP) just sitting on a piece of plywood under the oil pan on the garage floor with no issues. Tom
 
I have started my TR3A engine briefly on a stand with no problem but it was a secure stand.

David

Engine on stand.jpg
 
I don't think the test running will reveal much. With the flywheel attached and it has to be attached, you won't be able to see any leak from the rear seal. If you're going that far then pull the flywheel and look for any indication of leakage. In my opinion the crank seal works well and the leakage is from the rear main bearing cap interface between it and the block. It all gets gathered up and drips from the back of the oil pan and then the rear main seal gets blamed. Every time I've been this far into my engine I've not seen any leakage around the rear seal. The back of the flywheel has not been wet (it has been very dirty but not oily) keep in mind all the spinning and clutch dust can make stuff pretty dirty. I think it's an exercise in futility.
 
JerryVV said:
I don't think the test running will reveal much. With the flywheel attached and it has to be attached, you won't be able to see any leak from the rear seal. If you're going that far then pull the flywheel and look for any indication of leakage. In my opinion the crank seal works well and the leakage is from the rear main bearing cap interface between it and the block. It all gets gathered up and drips from the back of the oil pan and then the rear main seal gets blamed. Every time I've been this far into my engine I've not seen any leakage around the rear seal. The back of the flywheel has not been wet (it has been very dirty but not oily) keep in mind all the spinning and clutch dust can make stuff pretty dirty. I think it's an exercise in futility.
Click to expand...

Well, the test run actually did reveal something. In fact, it revealed EXACTLY what I thought. I just couldn't see with the transmission bell housing in the way. I wiped everything up and started her up. Sure enough the plug at about the 9pm position that is flush with the block had a nice steady line of oil coming from it. The RMS was dray! So I put some hi temp JB Weld on it, let it set overnight and most of morning, started her up and NO leak!! I also went ahead and tightened the head bolts since that hadn't been done yet. I will do it one more time OR I may have to replace the head gasket. Reason...in my coolant/water I do have some brown film that seems like oil. Plus I was getting some oil on the top of the block on the ledge between the block and head. And now, my ARP bolt/nut that is furthest forward on the outside of the valve cover is bubbling while running. I'm assuming it's a head gasket that is cracked and air is escaping that way. So odd. Never seen that. The car runs great tho.

The other issue I'm having is I cannot get the brake pedal to be firm on the first push. I have a soft pedal on the initial push and then need to keep pumping to get a hard pedal and I've bled the brakes 3 times. The brakes don't grip because I can't bed in the pads or the rotors because my pedal is far too soft. Could it be the brake reservoir? Or should I keep bleeding?
 
Good.
Were you able to see the leak with the flywheel attached? Or did you need to remove it to see the leak? Was it the 2" plug at the rear of the camshaft or the smaller oil gallery plug? Standard practice on a rebuild is to apply sealant to the large cam plug at install. The smaller oil gallery plug is generally not removed unless the block was boiled and the plug was eroded by the boiling solution which is not friendly to aluminum. At any rate it's good you found the leak.
 
Yes, Glad this was successful. Do pull the head and examine and replace the gasket. Also measure the liner protrusion. You'll find lots of information and fixes on this forum. Certainly bleed the brakes again and it is not really unusual to have a lower pedal on the first pump than on the second and this usually improves over time but several pumps is unusual and of course unacceptable. A reproduction master is not very expensive and may solve the problem.
Tom
 
JerryVV said:
Good.
Were you able to see the leak with the flywheel attached? Or did you need to remove it to see the leak? Was it the 2" plug at the rear of the camshaft or the smaller oil gallery plug? Standard practice on a rebuild is to apply sealant to the large cam plug at install. The smaller oil gallery plug is generally not removed unless the block was boiled and the plug was eroded by the boiling solution which is not friendly to aluminum. At any rate it's good you found the leak.
Click to expand...

I could see the leak once the transmission was pulled back. The location of the plug was JUST high enough that I couldn't see up that way with the transmission attached. Guess I could have used a mirror, but had to pull the flywheel off anyway to fix the leak. And of course the hardest part was sliding that transmission back forward. Now...to find out what's up with the brakes and head.
 
Yes, Glad this was successful. Do pull the head and examine and replace the gasket. Also measure the liner protrusion. You'll find lots of information and fixes on this forum. Certainly bleed the brakes again and it is not really unusual to have a lower pedal on the first pump than on the second and this usually improves over time but several pumps is unusual and of course unacceptable. A reproduction master is not very expensive and may solve the problem.
Tom
Click to expand...

Yeah, I rebuilt the calipers with stainless hardware, BUT I did separate the calipers so maybe that was it. Or while cleaning the calipers I sanded too much out, but the pistons seemed nice and tight with new O-rings. Just may have to pull the driver side out as I did notice some black grease around my pads and rotor and have no idea where it came from. But even with that the brakes don't bite. When I do that I'll send the slave to Apple for a sleeve. And if all that doesn't help as I have no hard and soft lines then I'll just upgrade to the Toyota calipers with TSI lines and eat the cost of the rebuild kit and pads.

As for the head...well that will have to wait. Car runs strong and when I drain the oil it will be interesting to see if there is any water in it. I'm going to put some coolant in it but I'm nowhere near my 500 mile mark yet. May wait till after that to change the head gasket. At least that is somewhat easy to do.
 
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