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New Tires...

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I have 165/70R13 Michelin X Radials on stock wheels. They fit just fine, so I'm sure that they'd work for you too. As an aside, Yokohama A032R's wear pretty well, and could be feasible for a limited use vehicle for street use. Much better handling, but they're about $110/each and might require a spacer on stock wheels. The smallest size (what I'm using), 175/60R13 is slightly smaller than my 165/70's in diameter, but it's marginal. They might also require a panhard rod for hard cornering. While this isn't difficult, it is one more thing to work on.

The Yokohamas should get you at least 6000 street miles (maybe more on such a light car). However, the nature of modern offerings for these cars don't include Falken Azenis, or anything else remotely sporty. Therefore, they can be expected to be 40-80k mile tires. Obviously the mileage doesn't really compare, but they're likely to dry rot before they wear out. However, the Yoko's will probably wear out first, but I'd imagine they'd still last a few years, depending on use.
 
So if I need to get wheel spacers...where can I get those? The guys at Firestone and Sears seem to be adamant that the 175/70's will fit just fine. I told them I was worried about rubbing with hard cornering but they busted out the measuring tape and were insisted that they would fit.

I dunno...the only 165 tires they have are 165/80's and they are the Sears econo brand, Guardsman. I suppose they wouldn't be that bad.

Anyway...wheel spacers? I already have a panhard rod.

Joel /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cheers.gif
 
You do? Who installed the panhard rod, and how hard was it? I found that my "kit" was a bear to install, and basically re-designed it. I could easily design a better one if starting from scratch. That way you wouldn't have to reposition the parking brake thing, and it wouldn't hit on anything else, either.

As to spacers, I believe certain speed shops may sell them. Alternatively, you could have them made. As to the cheapie tires, they're probably going to be at least as uncomfortable to ride (due to non-compliant sidewalls) as the Yoko's, and not anywhere near as performance oriented. I'd wager they're more uncomfortable. In addition, the 175 wide tires WILL fit IF you have the perfect backspace. I repeat the perfect backspace. This is not likely to happen without spacers, as mentioned before. I also had to roll my fenders a bit with the moss generic minilites (and no spacers). This is because the extra .5" of wheel width is tacked onto the outside. If they had split the difference, and increased backspace by .25" the rolling of the lip would probably not be necessary. Similarly, any old 175 may or may not fit due to this exact reason. With Kumhos (which are .6" wider than the Yoko's) I know that the tires wouldn't fit with the minilite replicas due to the lack of present clearance. With stock wheels and no spacers, they would rub on the inside (spring) area. I expect that other 175's would have similar issues, and you'd definitely have to fit them (and drive them hard) to be sure. Spacers may cure the problem, and .25" spacers would probably be just the ticket.

If the usual spridget speed shops don't have them, you could always go to eMachineshop.com or some similar location and have them waterjetted. This is fairly simple to do, and I could probably make the necessary drawings in a few minutes. Alternatively, you could either find a local machine shop, or do it yourself out of .25" stock. It may not look as nice, but it'd work just as well! You could just scribe out the holes for the lug studs and go to work on the drill-press. For the center section, you might need to get a bit more clever, but it's still do-able.
 
Well, I ended up going with the 155/80's today at Sears. I don't have the time or money right now to mess around with backspacing and spacers and rolling the fenders and such. I also didn't want to risk rubbing the sidewall on a 175/70 and having a blowout...so...I played it safe and economical for the time being. BF Goodrich 155/80's.

However, it seems like no place is able to do an alignment for me. Has anyone used the wheel alignment gauge that Moss sells? Is it worth it? I'm going to be going through the front end to sort things out as I have time...but I don't want to pay $50 - $75 each time to have an alignment done.

Should I get one of those gauges or is there another way to do this?

Mahalos,
Joel
 
I've always just used a tape measure. I've not had any excessive tire wear and the car tracks as it should.
 
BTW, you can get that same gauge at harbor freight for less.
 
Good choice on the tires, they'll be fine for now. When you get the money and time for aftermarket wheels, you can investigate tires for them. I can't believe that your local goodyear dealer, or similar shop, won't touch your car. Our local goodyear did my alignment (and did a pretty good job, too), and they didn't even give me trouble. However, my mechanic is friends with the alignment guys, and he told them it was an autocross car, so they were actually interested.

As an aside, I know the Philly region has a few contacts (including a manager of a Just Tires -- also a goodyear store) who will do various things for the local racers. He does a good autocross alignment for us, and only $59.95! I suggest contacting the local region of the SCCA and seeing if anyone can recommend a shop to do the alignment.
 
Trevor - good God that's a heck of a lot cheaper than Moss! I think I'll be buying from Harborfreight. Makes me feel better to know that most people just do the measuring on their own. However, I'll have to ask you guys for the exact procedure on how to do that.

Matthew - that's what I figured as well. I want to put some superlites or something like that on the car later on, and when I do so I'll put some wider tires on. For now I gotta just be a tightwad about it.

Goodyear and Firestone were "willing" to have a go at it, if I agreed to pay them for their time upfront before all the work was done. I said no way. I'm not going to pay some wrench monkey to put my car on a lift, try to align it, screw something up and then charge me for it.

Joel
 
The Harbour Freight one may not be the same quality of the Moss one. But for $9 it won't cost much to try it.
 
Toe in out is the only thing that is adjustable and easy as cake to do. A tape measure does the trick.
 
BTW, I think Bridgestone has some OK all season 165/65 tires on the market.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Jack - would you be willing to describe the process by using a tape measure?

Joel

[/ QUOTE ]

You measure tire centerline in the front vs tire centerline in the rear. If necessary, you can make a mark for centerline (doesn't need to be dead center, just a point to measure from) by spinning the tire against a board with a nail or an equivalent method to make a line along the tire tread. For my jeep, I want about 5/32" to 3/16" difference between the two measurements. You also want the steering links to be the exact same length.

Here's a jeep write-up, but the procedure is basically the same...

https://www.stu-offroad.com/steering/align/align-1.htm
 
Hi Rob,

That's a great little write-up. What would be the proper amount of difference in measurements for a 155/80 tire? That's a diameter of 22.8 inches.

I believe I've seen some people saying that Spridgets like a bit of toe-in (?). What would that setting be? Or, should I just set it to the stock settings?

Joel
 
I started with about 1/8" of toe-in to be sure. Then, after replacing my tie rod ends, I brought them out to 1/16".
 
You guys got it for sure. Our little cars are so simple that there are lots of tricks to get around the expensive tools. Cost tape measure, 3.95 Ace is the place.

Beep beep, Bugeye comming through.
 
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