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GT6 I Give Up! Help A Millennial Out [Carb/Choke Related]

UmmYeahOk

Jedi Warrior
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I bought a jigsaw puzzle that we did a pretty good job putting together, but for the past couple years have had issues with the choke cable.

History: 1967 GT6, came with 1971 Carbs and the two cable 1967 choke cable uninstalled. Setup didn't work, so we got year correct strombergs. Cable broke before installation, so we went with a universal single cable choke, which only functioned by opening up the "bonnet" and manually opening and closing it. Now that it's uninstalled, I can't even do it manually. For Xmas I got a year correct choke cable, with the correct knob and everything (didn't even know they had them!) and I can't connect the cables, as they're too short. All the pics I see have them installed on the opposite sides of where I want it (which would make the cable long enough to work) but I have no brackets or gizmos for them to go anywhere. So even if I could magically source these brackets that I can't even see where they would mount, they still wouldn't connect to the choke shaft thing.

Pics:
https://imgur.com/a/ClDDB
 

TR3driver

Great Pumpkin - R.I.P
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Oddly enough, my GT6 factory catalog "KC1 and future" seems to imply a single cable to the rear carb, and a coupling from rear to front. I'm guessing that's the pre-emissions setup. Would it work any better for you ?

 

3798j

Luke Skywalker
Country flag
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If your carburetors are 150cd's they have the starter bar chokes and will have only a one cable choke pull. Sometime in 1968 the Mk1 switched to the emissions 150cds's which have the cold start valve disc. These carburetors used the two cable choke pull. The bracket that holds the cable casing and the cable anchor bolt on a cds look like this...on my 1968 Mk1.

 

dklawson

Yoda
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Hi, How is that baby doing? (The human one, not the car!)

As others said above, the early Mk1 cars (like mine) have a single cable choke going to the rear carb. It opens both starter bar chokes via the front/rear carb choke linkage. From memory... I don't think this is braided aircraft cable but a solid core/wire choke.

Our car's cable is connected as shown in Zitch's first picture above. Our setup does not look like his second picture, not like 3798J's picture, and not like what is shown in the Zitch's video link.

Rather than buying a bunch of new and NOS Triumph chokes, while you are sorting this out, consider buying a generic choke cable from the "HELP" section of parts at Advance Auto or similar (Dorman Part No. 55101 or equivalent). It's cheap and will let you experiment.
 
OP
UmmYeahOk

UmmYeahOk

Jedi Warrior
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Hi, How is that baby doing? (The human one, not the car!)

Shes 4 now, and in preschool. That's how I was able to find the chance to install something I got back in December. That and our stupid state has become evil ever since purchasing this car. I have to keep my car registered or I lose my year of manufacturer plates. But ever since I got the car they wouldn't let me register unless it was inspected first. Every. Single. Year. I have since moved to house #3, and DROVE it to its new home, unlike house #2. But now I can't get the car even started because of the choke issue. And the cars registration expires end of April.

As others said above, the early Mk1 cars (like mine) have a single cable choke going to the rear carb. It opens both starter bar chokes via the front/rear carb choke linkage. From memory... I don't think this is braided aircraft cable but a solid core/wire choke.

so when you say rear, you mean the one closest to the firewall, and does it go where I currently have it in the pic?

Rather than buying a bunch of new and NOS Triumph chokes, while you are sorting this out, consider buying a generic choke cable from the "HELP" section of parts at Advance Auto or similar (Dorman Part No. 55101 or equivalent). It's cheap and will let you experiment.

I believe that's the actual part we were using. ...which was a major PITA. It allowed the car to run, but had to manually open and close it from the engine bay. Basically, if I wanted to start the car, I would have to lift the hood, which is rather heavy, then open the choke, then get back in the car, start the car, then get out of the car, close the choke, close the hood, and get back in. This was lots of fun on a hill when the hand brake wasn't working. (Parked in gear, but can't start the car that way) Anyway, pushing and pulling the knob did absolutely nothing. I would have to get out each time.

The knob I have, and what came with the car (though still might not be original) matches my windshield wiper knob, so I'm assuming it's correct. Maybe I can use the longer cable in slot, since neither for where they're supposed to.
 

trrdster2000

Luke Skywalker
Country flag
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The normal place for the two cable choke is low and below the tack. I will be putting mine in the upper left corner of the right panel with the "T" handle from the early ones. A straight shot right to the carbs. Never did under stand why they thought the curve was a good idea on the double.
Oh, mine will be a Spit6. Waiting on a little warmer weather to paint it.
 

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3798j

Luke Skywalker
Country flag
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Giving your photo a closer look, it appears that the choke cable should come in from below the carburetor with the casing seating in that lower eyelet and the cable anchoring in the set screw at the top. That is the way it's routed on TR4A's with Zenith carbs. Hope this makes some sense, I tried to give you an idea of what I'm describing by photographing my 4A's choke cable....



 

dklawson

Yoda
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Giving your photo a closer look, it appears that the choke cable should come in from below the carburetor with the casing seating in that lower eyelet and the cable anchoring in the set screw at the top.

That may be correct for a TR4. However, the Mk1 GT with the early ZS carbs should have the cable routed as shown in Zitch's first picture (see above). Copy the link address for the picture and post it in a new browser tab. The source photo is larger than displayed in this thread. With the larger image you can see more detail of the cable routing.

You asked if the cable routing is correct as shown in your photos. Your photos show the dual choke cable. Therefore... sort-of correct. Yes, the rear carb is the one closest to the firewall. A single cable routed to the rear carb is correct. The sheath anchors in the hole on the carb body. The cable core extends downward from there and passes through the cable stop on the linkage.

I don't understand why the Dorman cable did not work for you. You may need to shorten it by cutting off some of the "spring" sheath and then trimming the core to length. With that done the cable should operate the carb choke the same way the factory one works. Anchor the spring sheath as shown in Zitch's first picture with the core routed through the cable stop on the carb linkage. If the choke is extra stiff and hard to pull, remove the core completely, lube it with motor oil, then feed it back through the sheath.

You can get an OEM looking Mk1 choke cable from Rimmer Bros. The one shown in the link below looks like the one on my '67.
https://www.rimmerbros.co.uk/Item--i-402694

The choke pull knob on our car looks almost exactly like the one shown in the link below.
https://www.rimmerbros.co.uk/Item--i-GRID005216

4 years old? It doesn't seem possible!

EDIT: In his post Zitch included the link below to a thread about the Mk1 choke cable. It confirms that the Mk1 cable uses a single core, not two. It has the winged pull, not the square pull. Posters to that thread point out that Spitbits does not have the right part. Their's has two aircraft cable cores and the winged pull. In the thread there is mention of the part being available at TRF. However, I still suggest you get the Dorman cable working for a while. When you are comfortable with the use of the single cable... and annual inspection is behind you... buy the cable from Rimmer. It is much less expensive from them.
Zitch's Link: https://www.triumphexp.com/phorum/read.php?8,701662
 
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OP
UmmYeahOk

UmmYeahOk

Jedi Warrior
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Thanks for the rimmer bros link. Wished I knew about this back in 09 when I was buying parts left and right. Seems like a lot on this 67 is not listed, and borrowed from other models. Then again, I've got parts on this car that I KNOW never were offered, yet somehow I got em. For Xmas I had to ask for sun visors for a TR6! And of course my door cards and fuel door came with the car, but not original for the car.

As for my 4yo daughter, it is pretty scary to think about how much time has gone by. Pretty soon she'll be off going to college, and STILL pretending the GT6 is hers.
 
OP
UmmYeahOk

UmmYeahOk

Jedi Warrior
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You can get an OEM looking Mk1 choke cable from Rimmer Bros. The one shown in the link below looks like the one on my '67.
https://www.rimmerbros.co.uk/Item--i-402694


Ok... ...replacement cable #3 is a bust. Handle and cable shrouding doesn't even look anything like the pic. Before complaining to rimmer brothers I decided to do a test fit. It reaches, but I can't even slide it into the hole! Do Heralds use different strombergs? There was nothing on the packaging indicating a part number.
 

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dklawson

Yoda
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By all means complain to Rimmer Bros. The part I posted the link for should have matched the original GT6 choke with its pull handle AND its terminal end. Tell them to go back and compare what they sold you to the pictures on their website. They are NOT the same. What they sold you looks like it was for an MG.

https://www.rimmerbros.co.uk/ItemImages/Large/12026-Large.jpg
12026-Large.jpg


In their picture you can see the flat, rectangular profile of the choke pull handle. What you received looks NOTHING like what they show for either the GT6 or the Herald.

I spent some time looking for pictures of Herald dashes to see how they compare to the GT6. I defer to Andy for the details and ask that he correct what I am about to say. It appears the early Heralds had "round" disk shaped pull knobs for their cables. The later cars around 1969 and 1970 used the "flat" rectangular pulls like what you want for your Mk1 GT6 AND as shown in the Rimmer picture linked above.

Rather than fill this post with picture images, I am going to fill it with picture links. Follow them to see the flat rectangular dash cable pulls on 1969 and 1970 Heralds.
https://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTIwMFgxNTk5/z/7SAAAOSwdGFYnHqm/$_57.JPG?set_id=880000500F

https://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/ODAwWDEyMDA=/z/FocAAOSwax5YyUUh/$_57.JPG?set_id=880000500F

and zoom in to see...
https://assets.bauer-wolke.co.uk/im...r-assets-uk/MomoAds/2017/03/16/202807/021.jpg
https://assets.bauer-wolke.co.uk/im...r-assets-uk/MomoAds/2017/03/16/202804/020.jpg

For comparison, the link below is to a Mk1 GT6 dash (I think this is Andre Russeau's picture... but not his car).
https://www.gt6.ca/photos/06/063006/slides/DSCN0984.JPG

EDIT: Sorry... the eBay images posted above won't work as direct hyperlinks. Copy and paste the picture locations into your browser.
 
OP
UmmYeahOk

UmmYeahOk

Jedi Warrior
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Contacted Rimmer. They asked if my old cable was single or twin and mentioned that twin was what came on the U.S. Spec GT6. I was first shocked that they knew my car. Maybe I filled something out years ago or something recent that I forgot about. But then I was all like, "nope. Got plenty of twin cables to know that won't work." Anyway, they're shipping me the right part, and told me to keep the old. If anyone knows some one that needs it, let me know, and I can ship it to them.
 

dklawson

Yoda
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Keep the "wrong" one. You said it is close to the right length. To use it all you should need to do is cut that crimped terminal off the end. It's always good to have a spare.

Be sure to update this thread when you get the replacement !
 
OP
UmmYeahOk

UmmYeahOk

Jedi Warrior
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Ok, replacement cable number FOUR has come in, and I am a little confused. Looks like what I need, fits like what I need, but it is missing the white paint, and the outside chrome piece and inside washer. Can't really tell by the picture, so, maybe it's not supposed to come with all that. That's all ok though, I have paint and spare parts. What I am having a huge issue with now is how to actually operate the choke cable. With it all installed, I sat in the drivers side, used my dominant, right hand, to pull on the knob, and it comes right out with ease, but there's no cable attached to it. Seems like it could easily get lost that way. Anyway, the choke attached to the cable did not even move a bit, so I am really confused by all this. Seems like the knob needs to be attached to the cable for it to function properly. In addition to the confusion, I am also very annoyed, and understand completely why fuel injection was/is so important. It's not about power. It's not about efficiency. It's about turning the key and having the car run.
 

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dklawson

Yoda
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Your frustration is justified.

I am confused by the pictures. Can you post more showing all the components spread out?

I will take a close look at what is on our car and post back a description as soon as possible.

EDIT: See the picture in the link below.
https://www.jamespaddock.co.uk/choke-cable-t-knob-vit-mk2-2
That's a Mk2 Vitesse cable. It should also work for the GT6. That's the way the cable on your car and mine should look.

EDIT2: I looked at our car and have the following observations for you. I suspect they have changed the design of the choke cable to use current, common parts. My description below is for the 50 year old choke pull. Regardless, the wire should NOT have pulled out of the rod in the pull knob (see below).

The choke cable wire is a solid core type, not stranded multi-fillament flexible cable. That wire is mechanically, permanently, attached/bonded to a cylindrical steel rod about 1/4" in diameter. That rod passes through the mounting bushing that passes through the dash. The round rod transitions to a hex shape that fits inside a hex socket of the plastic choke pull. A spring loaded detent button in the hex section secures the pull to the hex portion of the choke cable.

The spring-like sheath of the choke cable is permanently mechanically attached to the bushing that passes through the dash. The bushing has threads on the "inboard" end and a "D" profile to preventing it from turning freely once installed in the dash. Bushing is installed from the back side of the dash, then the round bezel threads onto the exposed theaded end of the bushing. If the manufacturer has copied the 50 year old design it will be as described above.

Looking at your right-side picture above, it appears like you have the round chrome bezel. You can see the "D" profile of the cable bushing in the center of the round bezel. You need to unscrew the bezel and feed the choke cable bushing from behind the dash so its threads pass through, then fit the round bezel.

The steel pull wire should NOT have separated from the pull. That will need to be fixed. You MAY be able to put some kinks in it so it is not straight and JB Weld it back into the 1/4" rod. On our Spitfire I did that AND used a set of hex die coax cable crimpers to swage the parts back together. The wire with installed pull will then be fed through the bushing and its spring sheath all the way to the back carb. The wire passes through the ear on the top, side of the back carb and down to the cable stop on the choke linkage. The cable sheath enters a socket on that ear where it is secured by a horizontal screw.

EDIT3: One more Rimmer Bros Reference. A picture may be a lot more helpful than my text. Follow the link below. Our forum says it is too large to post here.

See the bottom of the image for the Mk2 Vitesse. The choke cable pull is horizontal instead of vertical but otherwise mounts like the GT6. You can see the cable is installed from the back of the dash with the pull removed. Then from the front the bezel nut secures the cable to the dash and finally t the pull is reinstalled.
https://www.rimmerbros.co.uk/ItemImages/Large/GRID007862.gif
 
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OP
UmmYeahOk

UmmYeahOk

Jedi Warrior
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I was pretty sure I had everything installed correctly. But when the plastic knob pulled out, I uninstalled it from the dash to see what was wrong with it, but still couldn't figure out how the knob connected to the cable itself. I emailed Rimmer Bros, replying to my original part issue email. No response, but I also understand that if its the afternoon in central US time, their customer support is most likely gone for the day, if not the weekend. Just annoying since I still need to pass my inspection this month, and had hoped on registering for a local car show a few blocks away. I can't seem to locate my universal choke cable I had been using. Might have to modify the MG looking one that you recommended me keeping just in case.
 

dklawson

Yoda
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We have reached an interesting point. I was Googling for more pictures to show you the choke cable both installed and free. During those searches, Google is now returning links to pictures in this thread.

I did find two pictures of the carb end of the choke attachment. However, they are on The Triumph Experience. It has been my experience that trying to post images here using pictures there often results in broken links. Therefore, I am posting the Google search links below so you can see the pictures through Google.

The first picture is a zoomed out view showing the choke cable routed to the ear on the back carb. The second link is to a picture showing a closeup of the rear carb. You can see the choke cable core is a solid wire, not twisted muli-fillament.

https://www.google.com/imgres?imgur...5TTAhXD8CYKHbcaCYkQMwguKBIwEg&iact=mrc&uact=8

https://www.google.com/imgres?imgur...5TTAhXD8CYKHbcaCYkQMwgsKBAwEA&iact=mrc&uact=8

As I mentioned in my last post, I had to fix the cable which pulled out of our Spitfire's choke. (I think that is what has happened to yours). I put some kinks in the end of the solid core wire so it wasn't completely straight, gooped it and the hole in the pull rod with JB Weld, then held the solid core wire with vise grips and tapped the rod back on with a hammer. Before the glue set I took a set of hex die crimpers (used to be common for working on coax cables) and squished the hex of the pull rod down to better grip the solid core wire. (crimp plier picture below). The Spitfire cable is still in use 8 years later.
RG58-RG59-RG6-font-b-coaxial-b-font-font-b-cable-b-font-font-b-crimping.jpg

If you need additional clarification, post back and/or PM me. I will be running errands most of the weekend but will try to help when I can.
 
OP
UmmYeahOk

UmmYeahOk

Jedi Warrior
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We have reached an interesting point. I was Googling for more pictures to show you the choke cable both installed and free. During those searches, Google is now returning links to pictures in this thread.

thats pretty much my experience with anything GT6 related. I guess the car is rare enough that I'm finding my own pics. The brother of the young man I bought the car from discovered my car's restoration site while looking for pics of a GT6 engine to reference, as he was still restoring his MK3. (The brothers each had their own, but the younger was attending college and needed the money)
 
OP
UmmYeahOk

UmmYeahOk

Jedi Warrior
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Ok, so I disassembled it, reassembled, attempted to "crimp" it with whatever I had, tested it out of the car, and it worked. Reinstalled, installing it at the dash first since it needs as much cable length as possible. The outer layer doesn't reach the top mounting hole unless you really pull hard, and even then, only can stick it in the hole, not deep enough to use the screw. That probably is the reason why there is too much stress on the cable. Anyway, the only screw that actually is tightened is the one on the bottom, the actual choke cable. Pull the knob, comes right off, just as before
 

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