TR2/3/3A Thrust washer gap

[sp53]

I finally got back to the oil pan gasket and got looking around for whatever. I noticed one thrust would move and the other did not. This is probably because the engine is jacket up. Anyways, I used the old thrust washers on this engine because I am afraid of aftermarket parts. Are thrust washers something that is a potential problem on a tr3 engine? I think when I let the engine down the crank shaft will go back to a floating position.

I am now just looking into the gap on thrust washers for a tr3 because I know so little about them, but my hope is the engine is built strongly in an old style and a little more play in the thrust washers should not matter……..

I made the gasket out of a 3mm rubber sheet from across the pond.



Thanks for looking I am concerned about the rubber gasket; time will tell

steve

 

[CJD]

Nice gasket! I would be inclined to install that one to the pan dry, with only a touch of sealant at the front and rear bearing cap splits.

The engine sits in the car tilted to the rear. This means when it is running, the crank leans against the forward thrust washer...so all the way to the rear-most position. When you press the clutch, the pressure from the clutch pushes the crank against the rear thrust washer, so fully forward.

I might accept a few thousandths crank motion for and aft, above the spec. If it gets to be too much play, then the constant for and aft motion of the crank during use will start to put stress on the rod bearings, and could affect clutch operation and/or rubbing of the front crank sprocket inside the cam chain cover. Since you pan is off, you can check for most of these potential problems, and decide if the play is an issue or not.

 

[sp53]

I never thought about not using any sealer. I like the idea. I bought the large permatex non-hardening, but yeh sure would be a lot less messy.

The one problem I potentially see with the gasket is I punched the holes into it with a ¼ punch that leaves a slightly under 5/16 hole to keep the holes closed up as much as I could. I am thinking I should have given more wiggle room for the bolt. Without using gasket sealer, doing a dry run without the sealer might be the way to go.

I guess I could pull the main cap off and measure and check the gap of the trust washers. Overthinking is typical for me when I start getting too close to finishing something I started. When I get to the other side of this one, I will be happier…….

Thank you Steve

 

[mastaphixa]

Steve, have you considered measuring your crankshaft float? That would answer your thrust washer clearance questions without having to remove a bearing cap.
Steve Baker

 

[sp53]

I must admit I have never measured the float before. I just used the old parts. What is a good way to measure the float? I would imagine a feeler gauge on each side of the cap or maybe when the engine is up like this I could simply measure one side.

What is the measurement and method commonly used to measure the float?

Thanks steve

 

[mastaphixa]

There is a method to measure it with a feeler gauge in the manual. You are looking at .004-.006"

 

[KVH]

After I rebuilt my engine about 1.5 years back, I did one of those things where you stand there and stare, asking yourself if you installed the thrust washers correctly or backwards. There must be a name for that ailment, and I sure have it. I can’t remember what I disassembled to check, but I did. But, back to your question. I used a dial gauge to check my end float. It was perfect. I believe I used oil and a fine abrasive wet or dry paper to get the thrust washers to just the right thickness. I’m sure I checked with a feeler gauge as well. The manual shows that procedure.

 

[sp53]

Ok I got the oil pan back on and sealed the seams in the aluminum piece and rear cap with some sealer on the seams. It was clearly leaking before at the aluminum piece. I removed the piece, cleaned the area up with Brake clean and rags a few times then gooped the piece up with the sealer and carefully put it back, letting the sealer squish out and then trimmed the sealer with a new razor.

Now I need to torque the pan down, but not sure if I can make the book's torque speciation without freaking out. The book wants 16ft to 18 foot pounds. I have an old memory of the problem about torquing pan and KVH mention the same thing.

I have a nice ratcheting torque wrench that goes up to I think 150ft pounds, but again perhaps the lower ends calibration might be off. I torqued the bolts down to wrist strength which could be 5 to 10lbs I do not.

I really would like some success here because I have fought leaky Triumph pans for too long. Any ideas on the torquing problem please speak up.

Thanks Steve

 

[KVH]

Ok I got the oil pan back on and sealed the seams in the aluminum piece and rear cap with some sealer on the seams. It was clearly leaking before at the aluminum piece. I removed the piece, cleaned the area up with Brake clean and rags a few times then gooped the piece up with the sealer and carefully put it back, letting the sealer squish out and then trimmed the sealer with a new razor.

Now I need to torque the pan down, but not sure if I can make the book's torque speciation without freaking out. The book wants 16ft to 18 foot pounds. I have an old memory of the problem about torquing pan and KVH mention the same thing.

I have a nice ratcheting torque wrench that goes up to I think 150ft pounds, but again perhaps the lower ends calibration might be off. I torqued the bolts down to wrist strength which could be 5 to 10lbs I do not.

I really would like some success here because I have fought leaky Triumph pans for too long. Any ideas on the torquing problem please speak up.

Thanks Steve

I guess the manual spec at 18-20 ft/lbs for a TR4 makes sense but I’m so gun shy because I’ve sheared the heads off two bolts in my TR car istory, and it was no fun. I also worry about stripping the threads in the block. So, truthfully, I torque lower, like about 15 ft/lbs or “to feel.” And here’s the reality for me—that pan will leak no matter what I do, and so will the RMS.

All the care in the world, at least for me, and I still get leaks. So I just do my best and use Permatex High Tack with a Moss gasket. I see yours in 3mm rubber or silicone so you’ll be in a different zone.

I hesitate to say this but I once used that gray Ford Motorcraft gasket sealer, and it seemed it was the best I’d ever used, but it gets hard, and I paid the price in labor cleaning that stuff off at the next pan service. For me, therefore, it’s working the pan carefully on a piece of glass, getting the flanges are true and square, leveling out the bolt holes, and picking out a gasket sealer.