Cranky but not cranking

[Bayless]

the ground strap is from the tranny to the body.
im talking the starter moter to the tranny it might be a big plate at the back but the point is the same.


electiral flow for starting its pos battery to starter solinod to starter moter into the block from the block to the body, body to neg to battery?

Short answer is YES. The starter to gearbox electrical connection must be good or no start. I have personal experience to prove that. Also be sure the ground cable connections are clean and making good contact.

 

[Sopwith_Camel]

Thanks. Remove all the spark plugs and see if the starter improves.

ok the starter just spun the crank all is fine there.

steve

 

[NutmegCT]

Thanks Steve. No compression, so starter load is greatly reduced.

You've replaced battery, cables, and the starter (I assume the solenoid also). If the electrical is ok, only thing left is the engine itself.

Now that the plugs are out, is the engine relatively easy to turn by hand?

 

[Sopwith_Camel]

i did not try by hand
my friend kjell ivar rebuilt the engine in 2013
he is very good. im helping him with restoring a 1913 renault

 

[NutmegCT]

So the car was running fine after the engine rebuild?

I'm of two minds: (1) the engine may have an internal corrosion issue (turning by hand might help determine if there's unusual difficulty in cranking), or (2) there's still a bad cable or cable connection.

Here's something your friend Kvell might find interesting - a 1913 A.L.F.A. (Anonima Lombarda Fabbrica Automobili):

http://theoldmotor.com/?p=43433

 

[Sopwith_Camel]

oh yes its been glourus.
https://youtu.be/p-9wNb9dt9E

it must be a bad cable at this point ill put the new battery in tomorrow.

 

[Boink]

https://youtu.be/p-9wNb9dt9E
.

Fun video!

 

[Jim_Gruber]

Wow 1913 ALFA and what an aerodynamic shape. That is really cool . And a 93 mph top speed from a 40-60 HP Engine. Talk about state of the art engineering at that time. WOW WOW WOW

 

[NutmegCT]

it must be a bad cable at this point ill put the new battery in tomorrow.

Let us know if there's a change.

 

[Sopwith_Camel]

no luck fully charged battery.
fresh cable to the new solinoid. fresh cable to the chassi.
i even tried a jumper cable from the starter moter mounting bolt to the neg termanl.
still waiting on the new starter moter
baffled

 

[NutmegCT]

no luck fully charged battery.
fresh cable to the new solinoid. fresh cable to the chassi.
i even tried a jumper cable from the starter moter mounting bolt to the neg termanl.
still waiting on the new starter moter
baffled

Steve, in your first post, you wrote:

New battery wire, I've tryed two starter moters, i have replaced the ground strap.
two different battery
disconcerted the battery kill switch.
cleaned the neg earth to the battery.
jump kit
jumped from a running car

Neither of those two starters made a difference?

Thanks.
Tom M.

 

[Sopwith_Camel]

nope no change between the starters. i orderd a new one figuring its about time for a new one, not much original left on the car.
the car did run on saterday. i took it up the street and back, turned it off and turned it on again.

 

[NutmegCT]

nope no change between the starters. i orderd a new one figuring its about time for a new one, not much original left on the car.
the car did run on saterday. i took it up the street and back, turned it off and turned it on again.

Thanks. So this is a good time to try turning the engine by hand - plugs out, no compression, see if there's unusual resistance.

If you've replaced all the cables and straps, the battery is new and fully charged, you've jumped from a running car, and tried a different starter and solenoid, and you're still having the problem, sure seems the devil is in the engine, not the starter system.

Tom M.

 

[Bayless]

oh yes its been glourus.
https://youtu.be/p-9wNb9dt9E

it must be a bad cable at this point ill put the new battery in tomorrow.

Nice. Wish I had been there.

 

[Sopwith_Camel]

ok well was able to move it but its was very stiff.
i was just pulling on the belt. is there anouther way?
the starter moter dose spin it freely with the plugs out.
it is very cold here (touch of snow) so the oil would be fairly viscus

 

[Sopwith_Camel]

yeah that video is one of my favorits. its in Jotenheim.:eagerness:

 

[NutmegCT]

ok well was able to move it but its was very stiff.
i was just pulling on the belt. is there anouther way?
the starter moter dose spin it freely with the plugs out.
it is very cold here (touch of snow) so the oil would be fairly viscus

OK - so the starter spins it fine without the plugs.

Can you test the battery strength? Voltage doesn't measure strength. Do you have access to a battery load tester like this:



Click the image for a close up.

It sees how much strength the battery has under load.

If you can't find one, turn on all the lights, including high beam headlights, and any other electrical devices. Then blow the horn and see if the lights get really dim.

 

[Sopwith_Camel]

its a brand new battery and i charged it over night.
i have a multi meter,
steve

 

[NutmegCT]

its a brand new battery and i charged it over night.
i have a multi meter,
steve

Most multi-meters aren't good for a load test.

 

[Sopwith_Camel]

toast.
im realy out of ideas.
steve