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whitey72mg
Freshman Member
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Ok I have the usual rust and would like to start repairs. I need advice on the most important part to replace first,second etc... Is it the floor pans?
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where to begin?
- Thread starter whitey72mg
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Jim_Gruber
Yoda
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I'd say determine if the engine and tranny are good to begin with, are suspension mounting points sound or do those have issues,
1) unibody over all( suspension mounts, inner sills, cowl)
2) Floors unless you want a Flintstone mobile
3) A-Pillar
4) Outer Sills
5) Trunk Floor
6) Rear lower quarters
And then wewant to talk about the things that will be worn out and will need to be replaced. But that is another thread.
1) unibody over all( suspension mounts, inner sills, cowl)
2) Floors unless you want a Flintstone mobile
3) A-Pillar
4) Outer Sills
5) Trunk Floor
6) Rear lower quarters
And then wewant to talk about the things that will be worn out and will need to be replaced. But that is another thread.
emann
Senior Member
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If I remember correctly (1/4 elliptic):
1) replace rear suspension spring boxes (and metal surrounding them)if needed
2) replace jacking point cross-members if needed
3) replace inner sills
4) replace floors (attaching to new jacking points, spring boxes, and inner sills)
5) replace top-hat on top of floors
6) replace/repair any sides of footwells that need it
7) replace/repair A-pillars, hinge boxes
8) repair rear lower B-pillars
9) replace outer sills
10) repair Trunk Floor
11) repair rear lower quarters
12) repair/replace battery shelf and firewall
13) inner front fenders
The first 3 steps will require some cutting away of the floor panels, but try to keep the floors as attached to everything not coming off as you can. You want the car not to flex when you remove the inner sills to replace them. Also, do one side at a time up to the floor panels. After the floor panels you can do both sides simultaneously.
This was done as a non-rolling restoration. If you're doing a rolling restoration, I'm sure this would be different.
Thats just my 2 cents and from memory and pictures from 20 years ago.
1) replace rear suspension spring boxes (and metal surrounding them)if needed
2) replace jacking point cross-members if needed
3) replace inner sills
4) replace floors (attaching to new jacking points, spring boxes, and inner sills)
5) replace top-hat on top of floors
6) replace/repair any sides of footwells that need it
7) replace/repair A-pillars, hinge boxes
8) repair rear lower B-pillars
9) replace outer sills
10) repair Trunk Floor
11) repair rear lower quarters
12) repair/replace battery shelf and firewall
13) inner front fenders
The first 3 steps will require some cutting away of the floor panels, but try to keep the floors as attached to everything not coming off as you can. You want the car not to flex when you remove the inner sills to replace them. Also, do one side at a time up to the floor panels. After the floor panels you can do both sides simultaneously.
This was done as a non-rolling restoration. If you're doing a rolling restoration, I'm sure this would be different.
Thats just my 2 cents and from memory and pictures from 20 years ago.
mccalebr
Jedi Knight
Offline
You didn't mention the model. If it's a quarter elliptic like emann mentioned, the list he provided is a good starting point. Just bear in mind that something that appears simple, like "replace spring boxes" may involve a bit more than anticipated.
I've just done this to my '62 Sprite; you can find the challenges and progress chronicled at:
https://www.raysmg.com (click on "The Spridget Project" then go to the "Bodywork" section)
Replacing the spring boxes means you first have to remove them...they are welded between the front and rear half of the rear bulkhead. After cutting apart the bulkhead to get at them, the only thing left holding the front half of the car to the back half were the rusted out sills and floor pans. Now having the car in two pieces, access is good and as the new parts go back together I have good opportunity to get the geometry dead on.
Oh yes, even though the spring boxes are listed in the Moss catalog (along with a very hefty price) they are actually "special order" items (Heritage parts) that took 6 weeks to receive from England.
But one example...
Ray
I've just done this to my '62 Sprite; you can find the challenges and progress chronicled at:
https://www.raysmg.com (click on "The Spridget Project" then go to the "Bodywork" section)
Replacing the spring boxes means you first have to remove them...they are welded between the front and rear half of the rear bulkhead. After cutting apart the bulkhead to get at them, the only thing left holding the front half of the car to the back half were the rusted out sills and floor pans. Now having the car in two pieces, access is good and as the new parts go back together I have good opportunity to get the geometry dead on.
Oh yes, even though the spring boxes are listed in the Moss catalog (along with a very hefty price) they are actually "special order" items (Heritage parts) that took 6 weeks to receive from England.
But one example...
Ray
emann
Senior Member
Offline
Wow Ray, I thought I replaced a lot of metal on my car.
I replaced the spring boxes but without replacing the entire bulkhead. I just cut out the spring boxes and the metal around them in the bulkhead that was bad and made up patch panels for the bulkheads.
Same with the boot floor and rear quarters. I only had to cut out pieces and make up (or buy) repair panels instead of replacing the whole thing.
But definitely, as you go, removing paint and rust to do a little repair, quickly turns into replacing major body sections.
Your project looks quite impressive. I wish I had taken so many pictures in the midst of my project. It's tough to explain to people how much work goes into the restoration.
-Ed
I replaced the spring boxes but without replacing the entire bulkhead. I just cut out the spring boxes and the metal around them in the bulkhead that was bad and made up patch panels for the bulkheads.
Same with the boot floor and rear quarters. I only had to cut out pieces and make up (or buy) repair panels instead of replacing the whole thing.
But definitely, as you go, removing paint and rust to do a little repair, quickly turns into replacing major body sections.
Your project looks quite impressive. I wish I had taken so many pictures in the midst of my project. It's tough to explain to people how much work goes into the restoration.
-Ed
mccalebr
Jedi Knight
Offline
Right you are, Ed, looking under that paint and rust can unearth some real ugly!
Believe me, I would have LOVED to have been able to cut out the spring boxes and replace them with some patches and bracing. Unfortunately, too much was gone on the bulkhead, and especially with the quarter elliptic car, as you know, that's where much of the structural integrity is.
BUT, on the upside, I have the all new bulkhead in, the passenger side floor and foot pans tacked, the passenger side cross member tacked, and did a trial fit today on the rear clip and the new doglegs I fabricated. Fit like a glove!!!
Life is good...after the rust,
Ray
Believe me, I would have LOVED to have been able to cut out the spring boxes and replace them with some patches and bracing. Unfortunately, too much was gone on the bulkhead, and especially with the quarter elliptic car, as you know, that's where much of the structural integrity is.
BUT, on the upside, I have the all new bulkhead in, the passenger side floor and foot pans tacked, the passenger side cross member tacked, and did a trial fit today on the rear clip and the new doglegs I fabricated. Fit like a glove!!!
Life is good...after the rust,
Ray
mccalebr
Jedi Knight
Offline
Well, my very first LBC was a '65 red Midget, when I was in high school, 1968-69. So, this probably being THE car I will keep forever...red! Not very original, but, most everyone, myself included, loves a red car.
Underbonnet, boot, and interior...an industrial gray, similar to several cars on Hap's web site:
I'm thinking I will do the floor pans (underneath) and front frame members in satin black (POR-15).
Ray
Underbonnet, boot, and interior...an industrial gray, similar to several cars on Hap's web site:
I'm thinking I will do the floor pans (underneath) and front frame members in satin black (POR-15).
Ray
mccalebr
Jedi Knight
Offline
Thanks for noticing, Jack...I've been having FUN.
Wait til I post the photos from this week! Got the new rear bulkhead installed, passenger side floor pan and sills, and passenger side footwell side panel in. Temporarily positioned the rear clip (including the new doglegs I fabricated) to check the fit and the fit was dead-on.
It's no longer a Flintstone mobile...at least on one side /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif
Next week it's on to the driver's side.
Ray
Wait til I post the photos from this week! Got the new rear bulkhead installed, passenger side floor pan and sills, and passenger side footwell side panel in. Temporarily positioned the rear clip (including the new doglegs I fabricated) to check the fit and the fit was dead-on.
It's no longer a Flintstone mobile...at least on one side /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif
Next week it's on to the driver's side.
Ray
Trevor Jessie
Yoda
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Dark metallic gray with chrome color stripes.
mccalebr
Jedi Knight
Offline
Stripes...yes. When I was a kid, All the cool cars had "racing stripes"...blame Carroll Shelby. My first Midget (the red one) had the three stripe treatment; one center stripe of about 5" and then on each side of it a space of about 1/2" and then a thin stipe of about 1/2". The stripe was offset, I believe on the drivers side.
On this car, I plan on doing a three line stripe, probably centered, and round number backgrounds with a contrasting number...62, for the model year. Not sure what the color of the stripe and rounds will be...maybe the same gray as the interior and a black number.
Ray
On this car, I plan on doing a three line stripe, probably centered, and round number backgrounds with a contrasting number...62, for the model year. Not sure what the color of the stripe and rounds will be...maybe the same gray as the interior and a black number.
Ray
racingenglishcars
Darth Vader
Offline
Ray. Just don't use a number that can be read up-side-down.
Your rebuild pictures look quite extensive, and just a few months ahead of mine.
I like the idea of industrial gray for interiour and under bonnet. I was thinking of a very bright yellow for the externals. Definately a lime green stripe (and maybe green seats).
Your rebuild pictures look quite extensive, and just a few months ahead of mine.
I like the idea of industrial gray for interiour and under bonnet. I was thinking of a very bright yellow for the externals. Definately a lime green stripe (and maybe green seats).
mccalebr
Jedi Knight
Offline
Thanks for the note, Donn, it's comforting to know I'm not the only one that's sawed one in half!
I've bookmarked your photos and will take some time to go through them all; there's always something to be learned. Thanks for the link.
I also have a '73 Midget that I show that I bought as a turn-key completed project. Love the car, but I must say that when I talk to people about it I ALWAYS give the cridit for the restoration to the guy that did the work. My buddy told me recently that when I complete the Sprite I'll "own it"...good, bad, or ugly...it's got my hand prints on it, and in it, and around it, and through it!
Ray
I've bookmarked your photos and will take some time to go through them all; there's always something to be learned. Thanks for the link.
I also have a '73 Midget that I show that I bought as a turn-key completed project. Love the car, but I must say that when I talk to people about it I ALWAYS give the cridit for the restoration to the guy that did the work. My buddy told me recently that when I complete the Sprite I'll "own it"...good, bad, or ugly...it's got my hand prints on it, and in it, and around it, and through it!
Ray