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Very nice but maybe a bit pricey

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jlaird said:
Not bad at all but not at that price in any case. I see many things incorrect.

Engine color
shift boot carpet
exhaust pipe clamp
grill
stripe
etc, etc
Click to expand...
Yes, but any carpet at all is incorrect in a Bugeye. Little too "custom" for my taste.

The Engine color really jumps out.
 
That is true orginal had rubber stuff.
 
OK, so, I'd like to comment. Not so much on this particular car, but on what our definitions are, please. And I'm not being defensive, per se, but I think we need to put things in just a little bit of perspective here.

Drew, you comment "A driver car just needs to look nice, and originality takes a back seat. For one looking for a premium price, the buyers will be well educated. Top dollar demands a top car"...but then you also add "buyers are willing to reward quality, and equally willing to punish shoddy work"

And someone else wrote "Appropriate attention given to the proper details"...

Unfortunately, I think we're confusing originality and quality of workmanship here--or at least using the terms too interchangably and loosely.

Does "not original" mean that the owner/restorer did not give the proper attention to the car? Does "not original" mean shoddy work? Do these terms go hand-in-hand? I really don't believe so. And I know the group is just commenting on this car (and yes, I did also notice the non-shiny gear shift lever--a mistake), but in all resto/collecting circle, these exact types of conversations come up, and I don't think they're necessarily accurate.

I'm commenting here because my car is NOT original, but the workmanship is hopefully evident. My car, at first glance, looks fairly original, but when you start digging, it's not. Too many upgrades. Too many conscious upgrades. Does that mean I didn't give appropriate attention to the details? Further, does that mean that its a "poor example" of what an original car is? I think not. I lived, breathed and slept this car for 16 months. I read every book I could find. For example, I know that the original car came with vinyl seats, but I CHOSE to go with leather seats. Jack, I know (yes, I know-know-know) the ORIGINAL engine was that famous AH green--but I CHOSE to go another color. Does that mean that I should be "punished for shoddy work" and I "didn't give enough attention to detail"? I just don't know.

The car on ebay does have some things that appear a bit odd, true (i.e., the 5 speed shifter), but for example the stripe running down and ending on the grill? You don't think that guy knew what the original one looked like? C'mon guys. That's not inattention to detail, that's a preference...just like the color of the shirt you are wearing this very second is a preference.

To be sure, I am not crying sour grapes here because all of a sudden, for example, I believe my car is not worth what I thought it was. I actually don't care about what these old cars are worth at all, as I will never sell mine and I spent more during the resto process than it will ever be worth (at least in my lifetime).

I guess I just get a little sensitive when folks too liberaly equate "non-original" and "poor attention to detail" in the same sentance, and give little thought in doing so.

Sorry for the diatribe.
 
I think the car in question lacks originality AND attention to detail. Which will bring more money ... show quality custom or concours(original)? I think we all agree that the serious money goes to concours car. I personally prefer a quality custom job... but I wouldn't want to spend big money on one that was done by someone else. The whole point of a custom job is that it fits your every need and desire.

My bugeye is going to be a custom jobbie. I passed on several cars because they were too nice to hack up... I left for someone that wanted to restore them properly.
 
My comments and I believe most others are related to the expectation of top dollar. I'll admit that I'm a bit of a purist but to each his own. When a car is modified to suit personal preference, one shouldn't except that everyone else will have the same taste and appreciaton regardless of the quality of the work.

As far as "apprporiate attention to proper detail", a rusted shifter, an unconnected exhaust pipe bracket and an unpainted wiper motor housing are the types of things I'm talking about.

With all that said, I do respect the effort that is obvious in this restoration.
 
I think the whole point was that there were things that detracted from the price asked.

That is top dollar today, high teens for a Bugeye, such a car must be well excuited and correct in this market.

Now is it ok to do things that are not orginal, sure if it suits you but do not expect top dollar.

Miss Agatha is not orginal, many things are different than when she came from the factory, does it suit me, yep.

Is she for sale, noop. I turned down 20K.
 
healeyboz said:
Are you kidding?

Well, so much for that thread. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif
Click to expand...

Actually, are you kidding me?

You take a car from ebay, roundly criticize it up and down on a public forum (after, in fact, the board moderator specifically told the board NOT to do so)--primarily bc it is not deemed "original" by the purists we have on the board here, and then get pissy with me if I post something that questions our definitions?

Please.
 
Gesh, we are not against the car. It looks nice, it is just that the price is a bit out of line with the current market considering condition.

That car can have space in my garage but not at that price.
 
I might be unclear about Basil's Policy about EBay. Can we not comment on a car and offer our opinion. We are not implying that the car is misrepresented or anything is seedy about it. We are all just offering our personal opinions and assessments.
 
I was trying to say (maybe not clearly enough, limitations of the written word sometimes) that for the true top dollar, the market favors quality *and* correctness (2 distinct things). The asking price is near the top of the range, so I would expect to see both.

I don't equate "correct" with "quality." Tunebug is getting a 1275, ribcase, disc brakes, etc. shortly, and that's what I wanted in my car. I realize full well that I'll never get top dollar for the car when it is done my way, but I'm not building it to sell it, I'm building it for me to drive. I appreciate that same approach in others' cars, and love to see how folks have made their cars their own.
 
Gesh, is right Jack.


Hey guy, I'm not a purist either. Most on here are not. But, I don't have a problem with the guys that are. I appreciate the attention to detail that they consider when building their cars. Shoot, Jack just spent a bunch just to have his surround anodized when most would have just had them polished.

By the way, Jack, they look great. ;)I think I would like to do the same to mine.

I'm not as you say "pissy" with you. I really don't care as much as you seem to about the topic.

Don't get me wrong--I hate to hear a person walking around a show and talking badly about a car that a guy has spent the amount of time and money building that all of us do.

Sorry to hurt your feelings.
 
No feelings hurt healeyboz.

I think I just felt what you described in your second to last paragraph up above--that the thread had transformed into a criticism of this restorer's work--and that the primary criticism was that it wasn't "original" enough. But I probably was being too sensitive...and I think we've all slogged through this enough for one evening. Good night-
 
/bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/savewave.gif
 
I think that the main thing in a thread like this is to be careful not to compromise the potential sale for the seller with nasty, derogatory comments. If a car is up for sale though, I see no problem with having a discussion on the various aspects of a car that we are all somewhat familiar with through our own experiences and preferrences! As witnessed by the above comments, some of us are "purists", others enjoy "personalizing" our cars (I tend to fall in the latter, but certainly appreciate the "pure" ones).
When a car is offered for sale, a healthy discussion of the plusses and minuses, relative to the price being asked, is inevitable and harmless! The consensus on this car seems to be that while it is a nice example, a few flaws/differences in "tastes" would make the price being asked on the high side for most of us! Quite honestly, I am not sure I have EVER seen a "nuts-on perfect" BE restoration!! If I ever hit the lottery though, it would be fun to try and do one!! For the amount of work done on this car, there are a few details that were overlooked that are somewhat puzzling, especially in light of the asking price!! /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/driving.gif /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/banana.gif /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/banana.gif /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/thumbsup.gif
 
Gosh, I thought everybody thought the car looked really good. I do. It was just some problems that pulled it down from the top, and it was just that the price was at the top.

Ufortunately the problems were easily seen. Easy because the car is very very clean.

I guess it's like a newly polished mirror. One smudge and it' really noticable. And if the guy who polished the mirror wants top-dollar for doing the work, of course people will notice the smudge and comment on it.
 
My point exactly Donn!! (Only you said it with less words /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/thumbsup.gif )
 
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