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Very interesting very long blog posting - racing oil and zinc

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This is certainly a very interesting subject, particularly for people like me with too much time on their hands! :wink-new:

Finally decided to go fully synthetic and have just ordered some Mobil 1 10W-60. Confusingly, as if there wasn't already enough confusion, in the UK this oil is sometimes labelled 'Extended Life' and sometimes 'Motorsport Formula' but its the same stuff. For those in the UK, Opie Oils are the cheapest seller at £38.75 for 5 litres and also currently have a £10 discount on orders over £75. So I got 10 litres for £67. Great price over here!:greedy_dollars:
 
That's what I use Derek. My son and his wife are off across Europe end of July, over the Alps etc and heat is going to be an issue. I just feel the the Mobil 1 10w60 offers more protection in extremes. I was told that racing oil and oils for old cars needed the same thing, which makes sense if you think about it.
 
That's good. That's what it should have been from the start. But I am kind of surprised that they continue to make it at all. It seems like everyone who was going to buy one already has. And i think [DELETED] the best car dealer to find the cool car for race like Toyota 86 or Fotuner
 
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As this thread has come alive again, albeit due to a spammer, I thought i'd give an update. Since filling with the Mobil 1 10W-60 I have noticed the car definitely spins up easier on cold starting. Oil pressure is the same as previously. I am now using Millers fully synthetic, Motorsport 85W- 140 in the diff and I have just put Penrite GB30 Gearbox oil in the gearbox, which is a big improvement on the standard, mineral engine oil that was in there previously.
 
In the very late '70's, I bought a BMW R90 bike. I had it serviced at a dealer somewhere around Palo Alto, CA, and I inquired about using Mobil 1, which I think had just recently been put on the market. He said that NOT to use synthetic oil until the engine had broken in. Their opinion was this would be at 7K-10k miles for that engine. There has been a LOT of information of late on this BB, about oil, and my RAM is overloaded.

So, is the general consensus of opinion here that if I use Mobile 1, without a zinc additive, from the beginning (during "break-in", whatever that means now), in my rebuilt Healey 6cyl, I should be fine? Even with flat tappets, etc? TIA, Jim
 
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Jim, here in the UK Mobil 1 make this 10W-60 specifically to cover the whole 'flat tappet, old engine' range of uses. It has higher levels of zinc and phosphorous than other Mobil 1 products. Are these levels really necessary? Who knows. I suspect you can use most fully synthetic oils without a problem as they are so much better than mineral oils. However, I've decided to be conservative and use what they say. I think Mobil 1 have a similar product on sale in the US but I don't think its a 10W-60.
 
DerekJ said:
Jim, here in the UK Mobil 1 make this 10W-60 specifically to cover the whole 'flat tappet, old engine' range of uses. It has higher levels of zinc and phosphorous than other Mobil 1 products. Are these levels really necessary? Who knows. I suspect you can use most fully synthetic oils without a problem as they are so much better than mineral oils. However, I've decided to be conservative and use what they say. I think Mobil 1 have a similar product on sale in the US but I don't think its a 10W-60.
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In the US, the Mobil 1 oil is 15W50. Other choices are Valvoline VR-1 in 20W50 (dino oil) or Castrol Edge 5W50 (synthetic). There are others, but these are usually available at your local auto parts store.
 
Derek and John, Thanks for the information. You are correct. I can't find a source for the Mobile 1 10w60, but I did locate the oils that John mentions above, plus a Castrol 10w60, and several "racing oil" 10w60's on Amazon.com. Many of the brands I'm not familiar with.

It's interesting that some of 540rat's data show that some of the "racing oils", and the premium (i.e, Purple) brands don't test as well as some of the more "mundane" ones.

In the past, I have always used Castrol GTX 20-50 in my TR's and 124 Spider, and have never had an issue. My "testing", however, was far more simple minded: I based it on initial cold oil pressure vs. hot oil pressure. In my original TR4 (>30yrs ago), the Castrol would start at about 70psi, and then always settle in at 50-55psi. Any other oil I tried-Valvoline, Pennzoil, Quaker State-all dino, would be at 30-40psi hot, so I stuck with the Castrol, thinking "higher pressure must somehow equal durability". It's nice to see some data rather than anecdotes like mine! And, man, there sure are of a lot of information and opinions on this subject. Some based on evidence, many apparently on almost religious beliefs!

I still have about 8 qts of the Castrol from 2 cases that I bought about 15 years ago, since the job kept me from having much time for my cars. That's now changing, and it was just within the last year that I even became aware of the change in the formulation of some oils. I'm almost certain that the catalysts on my LBC and Italian cars will be safe from the old oil formulations!

Thanks again. Jim
 
My BJ7 with a BJ8 engine is about 1500 miles plus into a trip round Europe and it has included 340 miles of French Freeway in over 95 degrees and cruising at up to 84mph, which is their limit. I chose Mobil 1 10 W 60 in case overheating was an issue. So far even over the Alps, the car seems happy and is maintaining 50psi oil pressure.
 
EV2239 said:
My BJ7 with a BJ8 engine is about 1500 miles plus into a trip round Europe and it has included 340 miles of French Freeway in over 95 degrees and cruising at up to 84mph, which is their limit. I chose Mobil 1 10 W 60 in case overheating was an issue. So far even over the Alps, the car seems happy and is maintaining 50psi oil pressure.
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That's the kind of data that my simple mind can process! Thanks and enjoy the rest of your trip! My dad traveled the world for about 30 years, and I once asked him his favorite place. He said Northern Italy, and the Alps. Be safe, Jim
 
The link to 540RAT's blog was sent to me by a friend, Dick Paterson, who has a very radical and competitive racing mini.
He knew of my interest in the subject based upon my blog post here https://www.netbug.net/blogmichael/?p=49.
Dick had sever cam/tappet issues for several years but found a most innovative solution which involved replacing he bottom 0.100" or so of the tappet with some exotic NASA developed material.
It wasn't an inexpensive solution but that set of tappets have survived many blow ups, countless rebuilds and spring valve pressures that make those in a Healey engine pale into insignificance... all in the interests of getting 130 BHP at the wheels of a 1298c.c. "A" series.
I'll try to get more information and post it later.
 
My take on all of this is that--while the need for ZDDP is somewhat debatable--there is no downside to having an adequate level of ZDDP, since our Healeys don't have catalytic converters which can be damaged by it (I'm not aware of any other adverse environmental issues). It may be like taking vitamin C or, ironically, zinc: it may not do any good, but it probably doesn't hurt anything and it makes you feel like you're doing something when you first get the sniffles.


I will buy that approach too,been using Valvoline VR1 for ages no engine wear.
 
I've read these posts, 540rat's research blog, and opinions on other forums. Mobil 1 0W40 FS europeon ranked among the highest oils tested. And it has 1100 ppm zinc. Seems to be an excellent option for a full synthetic oil.
I agree VR1 is the best choice for conventional oil. The 10W30 had impressive test results.
Are we better served by these lower viscosity oils that offer increased flow? Or by the Mobil 1 15W50 and VR1 20W50 that offer increased oil pressure?
Thanks.
Douglas
 
I recently spent hours researching and looking for zinc-free oil for several excavators. For both Hitachi and John Deere hydraulic systems, one has to use zinc-free hydraulic oil. So many oils have zinc additives, and so few are zinc free, which means that one has to pay a premium for oil without zinc these days. The reason for staying away from zinc in some applications has to do with the use of yellow metals - probably mainly bronze and brass - that zinc will attack. Probably, this is not an issue for Healey engines, although it could be for the transmissions.
 
Hi All,
Pressure vs flow, synthetic vs mineral, and ZDDP vs synthetic incorporated ware components ... are we buried in confusion yet?

When I purchased my Healey new, the engine was filled with ESSO 10W30 and I was confident enough to seldom focus on my oil pressure gauge. Over the years I used a countless number of "New and Improved" engine oils with viscosities ranging from the Esso 10W30 to VR1 20W50 mineral and synthetic Racing with growing concern and, luckily, no specific issues. Today I am running Mobile 1 15W50, purchase at a reasonable price from Walmart, and seem to have much easier starts and good equivalent oil pressure to the VR1 Racing Synthetic 20W50 previously used. I don't race, my highway driving is usually under 70mph, and my driving is less aggressive today then in previous times. so, with all the confusion and discussion, I still don't know what is the best oil for my Healey or which factor should be monitored as most important for engine wellbeing Pressure (resistance to flow) or Flow .

Sorry, but I am now more confused then ever and I would bet my lack of understanding is not unique.
Ray(64BJ8P1)
 
RAC68 said:
Hi All,
Pressure vs flow, synthetic vs mineral, and ZDDP vs synthetic incorporated ware components ... are we buried in confusion yet?

When I purchased my Healey new, the engine was filled with ESSO 10W30 and I was confident enough to seldom focus on my oil pressure gauge. Over the years I used a countless number of "New and Improved" engine oils with viscosities ranging from the Esso 10W30 to VR1 20W50 mineral and synthetic Racing with growing concern and, luckily, no specific issues. Today I am running Mobile 1 15W50, purchase at a reasonable price from Walmart, and seem to have much easier starts and good equivalent oil pressure to the VR1 Racing Synthetic 20W50 previously used. I don't race, my highway driving is usually under 70mph, and my driving is less aggressive today then in previous times. so, with all the confusion and discussion, I still don't know what is the best oil for my Healey or which factor should be monitored as most important for engine wellbeing Pressure (resistance to flow) or Flow .

Sorry, but I am now more confused then ever and I would bet my lack of understanding is not unique.
Ray(64BJ8P1)
Click to expand...

Ray, your use of Mobil 1 15W50 is just fine. You may ignore the rest.
 
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