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TR2/3/3A TR3A Will Not Start

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SteveBones said:
This will be the first time needing to remove the "drive dog" to rotate 180 degrees. I plan to use a punch to knock out the pin. Not sure if I need to reorder a replacement pin. Since Moss does have both the "drive dog" and the pin, if I can not reuse the original pin, I can order a replacement.
Click to expand...

The original pin was a solid "Mills" pin with a slight taper from end to end. If that is still in there, it will only come out one way (without applying excess force anyway). Generally they are reusable.

However, the holes through the shaft & dog are slightly offset (just like the slot in the drive gear), so I am guessing that your pin has already been replaced with a common hollow 'spring' pin. If so, I would replace it as a matter of course. I forget the size offhand, but they are readily available. Most likely, that is what Moss supplies as well.
 
Jeff,

Very good to know. It do not want to make this harder than it needs to be by focusing in the wrong area. I will check out what you recommended. It does make sense.

Steve


TRopic6 said:
Aloha Steve,

If I read this correctly, you might can fix it by just moving the cam 180 degrees instead of messing with the drive dog. The cam slips onto the "shaft action plate" and is held on by a single screw in the middle. The centrifugal advance springs keep the cam against the stop on said plate, so those have to come off. My TR3A is 5000 miles away, but the TR6 distributor works the same way. In dissembling the TR6 distributor to lube those same parts, it is possible to get that cam 180 out; ask me how I know...

Jeff
Click to expand...
 
Watch out though, that the advance range stays the same. I can't recall the details, but ISTR there is some reason that the early dizzys only go together one way.
 
Randall,

I was able to make the switch on the distributor to get the distributor rotor pointing to the #1 cylinder. I ran out of time and was not able to try starting. I will do this sometime tomorrow. Timing is all set and should be ready to go.

Steve

TR3driver said:
Watch out though, that the advance range stays the same. I can't recall the details, but ISTR there is some reason that the early dizzys only go together one way.
Click to expand...
 
Yes it really has.

This is the first time I have had to resolve this type of timing issue. I now have a better understanding on what to look for. I really learned quite a bit during this process.

Trying to find and fix something on a car that was not running for 10 years can be a bit challenging. More so when I was more focused on what I might have done wrong vs what was done by the PO.


poolboy said:
This has really turned into a marathon.
Click to expand...
 
Aloha Jeff,

Your suggestion really seems to have worked out. I have it all back assembled, and will try to get my TR3A started tomorrow. Thanks for the suggestion. Very much appreciated.

Steve

TRopic6 said:
Aloha Steve,

If I read this correctly, you might can fix it by just moving the cam 180 degrees instead of messing with the drive dog. The cam slips onto the "shaft action plate" and is held on by a single screw in the middle. The centrifugal advance springs keep the cam against the stop on said plate, so those have to come off. My TR3A is 5000 miles away, but the TR6 distributor works the same way. In dissembling the TR6 distributor to lube those same parts, it is possible to get that cam 180 out; ask me how I know...

Jeff
Click to expand...
 
Randall,

Good point. Moving the cam 180 degrees looks to have worked out regarding fit. When spinning the cam after installed back in the distributor, the centrifuge weights look to be working. I will follow up tomorrow to confirm when I try and start the car. I tried removing the pin from the 'dog drive'. The pin looked to be original and was not coming out without some effort.

Based on the "dog drive" pin appearing to be original, I am hopeful that the cam is where the PO had misassembled. The top screw on the cam had been messed with (partially stripped) and one of the screws holding the ground wire was stripped as well.

Again I want to thank you and the others for all the help. This is an area that I have not worked on previously, was not clear on how to isolate the actual problem or figure out how to fix.

Wish me luck!

Steve

TR3driver said:
Watch out though, that the advance range stays the same. I can't recall the details, but ISTR there is some reason that the early dizzys only go together one way.
Click to expand...
 
Re: TR3A Will Not Start - It's Running!

The TR3A started right up after fixing and rotating the distributor cam 180 degrees. The engine ran great even before I synchronized the carbs. Thanks again everyone for all the help.

Now I am on to the next challenge with the car. The clutch will not disengage. The clutch hydraulics have been rebuilt with most items replaced. I believe the clutch itself is sticking with the car sitting for 10 years. I will plan to start another thread on this. I will be gone this weekend so will have to wait until next week to work on getting this fixed. Then I will finally be able to take the car for a drive.

Steve
 
Re: TR3A Will Not Start - It's Running!

Stuck clutch is a common complaint after a long sit and often there is a very easy fix.

I'll withhold details until your return and the new thread.
 
Re: TR3A Will Not Start - It's Running!

What? This threads over? How am I going to spend my eveinings now?
 
I was curious about Randall's comment on affecting the advance on early dizzys. I looked at a Lucas training manual from the '50s (it's online) and yes, there are some early distributors where the orientation of the cam does make a difference on 4-cylinder distributors, and you can't just flip it 180. It seems to be on pre-DM2 types though, so TR3 & up should be OK. Maybe someone with a TR2 can verify.

Jeff
 
Aha! the distributor, as we suspected back on the 26th!

Congratulations on getting the engine going. Sure feels good, eh?

We'll post the "clutch fix" when you start that topic.

Tom in CT
 
Tom,

You nailed it. It feels really good. I am actually surprised on how easy it started and ran. Good thing I have a new battery. I was so caught up with the easy start that I shut it down and restarted close to a dozen times.

Now on to the clutch!

Steve

NutmegCT said:
Aha! the distributor, as we suspected back on the 26th!

Congratulations on getting the engine going. Sure feels good, eh?

We'll post the "clutch fix" when you start that topic.

Tom in CT
Click to expand...
 
Re: TR3A Will Not Start - It's Running!

I was starting the feel the same way.......just driving it without having to dedicate some time with the wrenches was feeling a bit anti climatic. Not to be let down, I now get to figure out the clutch issue. I just have to laugh......it beats crying.

Steve

CJD said:
What? This threads over? How am I going to spend my eveinings now?
Click to expand...
 
Jeff,

Thanks again for the suggestion. It looks to have been the fix (removing and rotating the cam). I mentioned this in an earlier response, there was evidence this was were the PO had worked on the dizzy.

Steve

TRopic6 said:
I was curious about Randall's comment on affecting the advance on early dizzys. I looked at a Lucas training manual from the '50s (it's online) and yes, there are some early distributors where the orientation of the cam does make a difference on 4-cylinder distributors, and you can't just flip it 180. It seems to be on pre-DM2 types though, so TR3 & up should be OK. Maybe someone with a TR2 can verify.

Jeff
Click to expand...
 
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