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TR2/3/3A TR3-B Steering
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Alan_Myers
Luke Skywalker
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Hi Mike,
First check that all the steering linkage is free, lubed, working properly and that bushings aren't sloppy. The tie-rod ends sold today mostly come without grease fittings, might look for some that have them (I think TRF offers them for TR4, not sure what's avail. for TR3). The vertical link/trunnions should be checked for free movement, too.
The best way to check these things is to remove the shocks and springs, then operate the steering mechanism by hand with the car up on jack stands. With the springs and shocks off, it's possible to test at different deflections of the suspension, see if all is working correctly throughout the swing of the axle and there are no binding points.
You might want to take the car to a local alignment professional and have them look at it. TR3 steering is heavier to begin with, of course. Modern radial tires can add to the problem, since the car was originally designed for the bias belted tires that were most common at the time. Perhaps the alignment shop can do some tweaking to improve matters.
If caster and/or camber and/or toe is off it can make for heavier steering. They should check those and can adjust them on most cars. TR2/3/4 have no obvious caster/camber adjustment points, but the vertical links can be "adjusted" by bending them (or can get out of adjustment if bent). There are also adjustable top fulcrums available, from Revington TR, but these are usually used to set up negative camber for racing and such. They might not be useful to you, but I've posted photos of these installed on my TR4 at https://www.triumphowners.com/640 if you want to see them. Note that these fulcrums are being used on a TR4 with 3 degrees of caster. I'm not certain if 0 degree caster type fulcrums are available (0 degree was used on TR2 through very early TR4).
Look for an alignment/frame/suspension shop that is a step above the typical, perhaps someone who specializes in older cars. They can probably give you better advice specific to your car, after looking everything over carefully.
There are a few other things that might be done. It might help to simply run the tires harder, the tire pressures recommended by the manuals are also most likely for "old technology" tires. You could try this carefully, or look for advice from the tire manufacturer or the local alignment shop.
Hope this helps!
Alan Myers
San Jose, Calif.
'62 TR4 CT17602L
First check that all the steering linkage is free, lubed, working properly and that bushings aren't sloppy. The tie-rod ends sold today mostly come without grease fittings, might look for some that have them (I think TRF offers them for TR4, not sure what's avail. for TR3). The vertical link/trunnions should be checked for free movement, too.
The best way to check these things is to remove the shocks and springs, then operate the steering mechanism by hand with the car up on jack stands. With the springs and shocks off, it's possible to test at different deflections of the suspension, see if all is working correctly throughout the swing of the axle and there are no binding points.
You might want to take the car to a local alignment professional and have them look at it. TR3 steering is heavier to begin with, of course. Modern radial tires can add to the problem, since the car was originally designed for the bias belted tires that were most common at the time. Perhaps the alignment shop can do some tweaking to improve matters.
If caster and/or camber and/or toe is off it can make for heavier steering. They should check those and can adjust them on most cars. TR2/3/4 have no obvious caster/camber adjustment points, but the vertical links can be "adjusted" by bending them (or can get out of adjustment if bent). There are also adjustable top fulcrums available, from Revington TR, but these are usually used to set up negative camber for racing and such. They might not be useful to you, but I've posted photos of these installed on my TR4 at https://www.triumphowners.com/640 if you want to see them. Note that these fulcrums are being used on a TR4 with 3 degrees of caster. I'm not certain if 0 degree caster type fulcrums are available (0 degree was used on TR2 through very early TR4).
Look for an alignment/frame/suspension shop that is a step above the typical, perhaps someone who specializes in older cars. They can probably give you better advice specific to your car, after looking everything over carefully.
There are a few other things that might be done. It might help to simply run the tires harder, the tire pressures recommended by the manuals are also most likely for "old technology" tires. You could try this carefully, or look for advice from the tire manufacturer or the local alignment shop.
Hope this helps!
Alan Myers
San Jose, Calif.
'62 TR4 CT17602L
Simon TR4a
Jedi Knight
Offline
Make sure the trunnions are not seized. These are "swivels" encased in brass just inboard of the brakes. There is a grease nipple though I think the recommended lubricant is heavy oil, but sometimes this job gets ignored, resulting in stiff steering and wear.
Simon.
Simon.
Simon TR4a
Jedi Knight
Offline
Sorry, I see Alan has already given a much more detailed response!
I started mine an hour ago but got distracted by work part way through.
Simon.
I started mine an hour ago but got distracted by work part way through.
Simon.
Don Elliott
Obi Wan
Offline
Before you do all the things suggested by Alan (and they are all good things to do) may I suggest that you have another TR3 or TR3A owner drive your car. All the sidescreen TRs have heavy steering at speeds below 5 miles per hour and what you have may be normal for your TR3B. Fixing all those other things will be needed if the steering is also heavy at 40 or 50 miles per hour.
Don Elliott, Original Owner, TS 27489 LO
https://www.britishcarforum.com/ubbthread...e=&sortdir=
Don Elliott, Original Owner, TS 27489 LO
https://www.britishcarforum.com/ubbthread...e=&sortdir=
Geo Hahn
Yoda
Offline
One trick that might help diagnose the cause of the heavy steering is to jack up the front and see if it is still stiff. That will elminate the effect of the radial tires and reduce the effect of the trunnions. It will have no affect on any stiffness in the steering box itself.
There is an adjustment screw on the top of the steering box that any TR3 manual will explain... important to not have it adjusted too tight. Sometimes a PO has adjusted it too tight to compensate for loose steering.
My steering was a bit loose when adjusted correctly but not so much that I wanted to rebuild the box... so I obtained a spring-loaded adjustment screw from Herman van den Akker that tightened it up nicely.
https://www.blindmoosefab.com/hvda.htm
My TR3A still requires more steering effort (at low speed) than the TR4's R&P but it is by no means heavy or hard.
BTW -- If you are running tire pressures recommended in the manual this will make your steering feel heavy. I run much higher pressures front and rear.
There is an adjustment screw on the top of the steering box that any TR3 manual will explain... important to not have it adjusted too tight. Sometimes a PO has adjusted it too tight to compensate for loose steering.
My steering was a bit loose when adjusted correctly but not so much that I wanted to rebuild the box... so I obtained a spring-loaded adjustment screw from Herman van den Akker that tightened it up nicely.
https://www.blindmoosefab.com/hvda.htm
My TR3A still requires more steering effort (at low speed) than the TR4's R&P but it is by no means heavy or hard.
BTW -- If you are running tire pressures recommended in the manual this will make your steering feel heavy. I run much higher pressures front and rear.
D
Deleted member 451
Guest
Guest
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I got tired of the sloppy steering in my '59 so I converted it to rack and pinion. World of difference and my 100lb wife can drive it now. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jester.gif
Hi Mike you have received much good information. I would like to add that often on a tr3 the idler arm does not get greased enough or is wore out, and would contribute greatly to your present problem. Anyways make sure that it is greased. I would make sure the worm gear in the steering box has the right tension. Read up on it. The tension is basically zero or minor drag and is adjusted, like Geo mentioned, with a bolt on top of the box. Be very carefully not to run the screw back to far and drive the car because you can make it too sloppy and chip the gear. But good common sense with get that thing adjusted just fine with the wheels off the ground and the idler arm moving freely.
George
George
My steering was also very sloppy. I ended up replacing all the tie-rod ends, idler arm, and the silent-bloc bushings in the center tie-rod. I originally purchased the silent-bloc bushings from Victoria British because they are only a few minutes from my house. All their silent bloc bushings were junk, none would fit correctly. I ended up ordering them from The Roadster Factory, which were not only cheaper, but Charles measured them for me and called me back advising me they were the correct size. The front end is nice and tight now.
Don
Don
D
Deleted member 451
Guest
Guest
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I got the rack and pinion kit from the guys in Virginia. Can't remember the name right now but they are easy to find on the net and in the back of British car mags.
martx-5
Yoda
Offline
[ QUOTE ]
I got the rack and pinion kit from the guys in Virginia. Can't remember the name right now but they are easy to find on the net and in the back of British car mags.
[/ QUOTE ]
Ted, British Auto Restorations, 540-989-5121, VA. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cheers.gif
That's where I got mine from. The kit comes from England. You have to remove the engine fan. An electric fan etc. is included as part of the kit.
I got the rack and pinion kit from the guys in Virginia. Can't remember the name right now but they are easy to find on the net and in the back of British car mags.
[/ QUOTE ]
Ted, British Auto Restorations, 540-989-5121, VA. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cheers.gif
That's where I got mine from. The kit comes from England. You have to remove the engine fan. An electric fan etc. is included as part of the kit.
D
Deleted member 451
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Guest
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That's the guys! About a 10 hour job, bolts right in. I did a sway bar at the same time along with a wood 14" steering wheel. Drives great.
Be sure to save all the old parts in case you want to go back original. Mine is a really nice driver and I want to keep it that way. I'll never go back.
Be sure to save all the old parts in case you want to go back original. Mine is a really nice driver and I want to keep it that way. I'll never go back.