This one claims to be a real factory 100M

[Healey Nut]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Factory-10...ash=item2ab626a456:g:EDgAAOSwybpbo8-q&vxp=mtr

is it legit ?

 

[Legal Bill]

Is that what they go for now? To many other things to buy for that kind of money.

 

[HealeyRick]

Heritage cert: https://lbilimited.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/BMIHT-Certificate.jpg

 

[pkmh]

I'm not an expert with proving or disproving this sort of thing as being the real McCoy, but after viewing the Heritage Certificate and the matching tags on the vehicle, it sure has me convinced its the real thing. But I've seen similar examples in the past as being stated the same, only to find that they are fakes, repros or at the very least, questionable.

So far and in my opinion, I feel it's harder to fake a vehicle like this and get away with it, especially with the evidence presented. But for those who are into say, collecting coins, may now be aware that places like China, etc., are very capable of producing quality fake errors or rarities that even fool the pros. I've witnessed this which really jeopardizes the hobby of collecting, especially from an investment point of view. But again, with cars like this, I find it highly unlikely or that even an effort would be considered. In my opinion, it takes a lot more energy to fake a Lemans as this example shows with the documentation, than to stamp out a fake coin.

So now the question in my mind remains, is it worth the price? Maybe some collectible coins and paper $$ would seal the deal, you think?

 

[Bob_Spidell]

Very nice car. Have to wonder why they went with the common--70% or so shipped--white/black color instead of staying with Healey Blue/white. The only 'off' things I spotted were the spare tire isn't secured with the metal 'spoon,' and the 'wrap-back,' where the black lower paint folds back behind the front wheel wells is too sharp a curve (according to Rich Chrysler--who told me it's the same as the flange on the 6-cyl cars--and the paper template Bill Meade charges $40 for).

Looks like they've changed the certs since we got ours; they used to say only 'since this car was supplied with a louvred bonnet it is a 100M' (or similar).

Edit: Note there are two levels of '100M Registry' certification: 'Owner Verified' and 'Registry Verified;' for the latter you have to provide body# stampings, the etchings on the carbs and distributor and a few other things.

 

[Editor_Reid]

The engine number plate is a re-stamp, and so for those who care about "matching numbers," you'll never know.

The tool kit was not assembled by someone with detailed knowledge of the model.

Funny they state that the color combo - white over black - "is much more uncommon and attractive" when in fact this combo was the most common for the 100M. Blue over white may have been used in sales literature and ads, but it was not the most common combo for the model.

No undercarriage photos is odd for a broker.

A few more "things" are visible in the small photos (overdrive switch not original, lower lip of rear shroud flange not painted black, no evidence of a tonneau cover or side curtain storage bag or jack), but overall a pretty gorgeous Healey.

 

[Bob_Spidell]

I don't think I've ever seen a restoration, even a good one, where they painted the shroud/boot pan flange black (with a brush, IIRC). Does anyone know what the proper hose clamps are for older cars (which sounded to me like the band-type like used on ducting)? Rich told me they should be 'jubilee' clamps, but a web search identifies them as the common worm-drive type; whereas I believe later 6-cyl cars had the wire type.

 

[DerekJ]

The 100M hype continues. When the music stops people will finally realise these were ‘production run out’ models with a few bolt on bits.

 

[HealeyRick]

The engine number plate is a re-stamp, and so for those who care about "matching numbers," you'll never know.

The chassis plate looks new as well, doesn't it? I agree with Derek, the price premium for an M seems to be out of step with the improvements the M package offers, but I doubt the prices of them will drop anytime soon.

 

[simon1966]

Hi Bob

Just to show that it does happen, here is the hand painted black flange on my 100 restored by Tom Kovacs. I did not know enough to ask that this be done, but it was anyway Not the greatest photo of this feature, but as good as it gets at short notice.

Oh and my car is one of the incredibly rare factory original Right Hand Drive cars that has not been M ed:highly_amused:

 

[Editor_Reid]

When the music stops people will finally realise these were ‘production run out’ models with a few bolt on bits.

I'm not sure the music will stop as too many have too much invested in the model, but the collector car market - for better or for worse - often prizes limited-edition models beyond what might seem "reasonable."

In appearance, a 100M differs from the standard 100 only by the louvered bonnet and usually by two-tone paint, and it differs in performance only by 20 HP. Throw in the quantities made - 640 100M models versus 13,974 "standard 100" models - and a premium for a 100M is understandable, but FOUR TIMES the price of a standard car?

But the market is the market, despite what some may think is a reasonable premium.

 

[Bob_Spidell]

I'm not sure the music will stop as too many have too much invested in the model, but the collector car market - for better or for worse - often prizes limited-edition models beyond what might seem "reasonable."

In appearance, a 100M differs from the standard 100 only by the louvered bonnet and usually by two-tone paint, and it differs in performance only by 20 HP. Throw in the quantities made - 640 100M models versus 13,974 "standard 100" models - and a premium for a 100M is understandable, but FOUR TIMES the price of a standard car?

But the market is the market, despite what some may think is a reasonable premium.

Well put, Reid. There are a lot of things I think people pay too much for, but it's their choice.

On another note, just caught this at the end of the description--which mostly describes the virtues of this particular car (yes, the panel fit does appear to be excellent)--is: "Included in the sale, but only at an appropriate price point, is an extra engine (rebuilt and sealed short block with only a little assembly needed), spare gearbox, head, carbs, manifolds etc"

Hmmmmmmm ....

 

[Editor_Reid]

...just caught this at the end of the description--which mostly describes the virtues of this particular car (yes, the panel fit does appear to be excellent)--is: "Included in the sale, but only at an appropriate price point, is an extra engine (rebuilt and sealed short block with only a little assembly needed), spare gearbox, head, carbs, manifolds etc" Hmmmmmmm ....

Smells like a drivetrain swap, doesn't it? And the currently installed engine has a re-stamped engine number plate.

I wonder what number is on the "extra engine," or perhaps its engine number plate is missing. For starters, a buyer would be wise to really check the numbers on the carbs and distributors of both engines. Then check the body number stamped under the cockpit trim rails and on the boot lid prop rod flange. It could all check out, or things could fall apart quickly.

 

[HealeyRick]

Here's the 100M Registry entry: https://www.100mregistry.com/pages/A_FC179_William_OBrian_DE.htm I believe Bill Meade requires inspection of all the points Reid mentioned above for an "FC" car. I think the eBay ad with all its great photography is meant to catch the eye of someone with that kind of dough to spend and not necessarily to show photos of the things that knowledgeable enthusiasts look for in trying to figure out if a car is an M. Notice neither the Heritage cert or the M registry number are given in the ad.

 

[Healey Nut]

. Notice neither the Heritage cert or the M registry number are given in the ad.

That was the first thing that made me question its authenticity...
if it truely was a documented real 100M then Im darn sure if I was the seller it would be the first pic in the ad .

 

[Bob_Spidell]

"The tool kit was not assembled by someone with detailed knowledge of the model."

Did the original tool kit have a valve lapping tool? Were Healey owners supposed to stop every couple thousand miles on the side of the road, pull the head and lap the valves?

 

[Healey Nut]

Did the original tool kit have a valve lapping tool? Were Healey owners supposed to stop every couple thousand miles on the side of the road, pull the head and lap the valves?

Absolutely and pull the transmission for a rebuild and dont forget to do the overdrive “while your in there”
And seeing as you are in there may as well pull the diff and check the wear on the ring n pinion and set the backlash .....
All before a tea , cucumber sandwiches and cakes picnic lunch of course

 

[Editor_Reid]

Did the original tool kit have a valve lapping tool? Were Healey owners supposed to stop every couple thousand miles on the side of the road, pull the head and lap the valves?

Yes, they called it the Valve grinding-in tool, Austin part number 2H 4502. They're pretty rare now (because they were discarded as unneeded/unwanted, would be my bet), and of the ones I've seen, they look pretty pristine (as in "unused").

 

[BN6]

All the identification plates are modern reproductions, except for the engine tag which may have been destroyed during an acid dip you have to ask why replace the chassis and body identification plates !

If this was my car and a real factory 100M I would be more inclined to put it through an auction house, say Bonhams, not eBay.

 

[Sr_Pinguino]

If this is the same AH as has been listed on eBay, then it was recently bid to $130,000, but unsold, at Saratoga Auto Auction.

https://www.saratogaautoauction.org/vehicles/704/1956-austin-healey-100m