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Rhodyspit75
Jedi Knight
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Nice to see you are still at it neighbor! Some day I will get up to see it. Too much "stuff"going on around here to do so. Happy New Year hope to see you at DOT next year.
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The start of something big. Frame off restoration
- Thread starter justin_mercier
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OP
justin_mercier
Jedi Warrior
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These photos are the property of PhilsTR6 but this is the transmission where it currently is, installed in a TR6 out in California. I need to wait for it to be uninstalled, as the car it's currently in is being converted to an overdrive transmission, and then I will be purchasing it as well as all the 'stuff' that goes with it, flex plate, flex plate adapter to bolt it to the TR6 crankshaft, torque converter, mounting stuff, and if I remember from the Triumph World article about that TR6, it has a custom drive-shaft as well to mate up with the T35. It just so happened that as I was looking for the transmission, this TR6 which had the exact conversion done to it that I plan to do, was being converted back to a standard, fortuitous timing on my part!
As can be seen it's a yellow plate T35, model EZ. This is a 5 position BW 35 originally from a 1965 Triumph 2000.
I'm all excited to make progress on this car again. As it was, I lost my drive to finish it this last year and get it on the road when I realized that I wasnt going to be able to drive it. There was no room for my left foot when driving it except for UNDER the clutch pedal, which was going to make it very awkward and dangerous to drive. The footwell is plenty deep, but it's just too darned skinny, and with my long legs, I can not do what the other drivers I've talked to with this body do, and put their foot on the ground in-front of the pedal, because that puts my knees right into the dashboard and steering column. The solution to the problems for me is to just get rid of the clutch pedal so my left foot can rest down there comfortably while driving and not have to move.
My TR7 had a BW T35 automatic in it, and it was still wicked fun to drive. With traffic the way it is in New England, I actually find it more relaxing to drive a slush-box anyways, so for me this is going to be perfect, and making the car all the more enjoyable for me to drive... or in this case, possible for me to drive in the first place!
As can be seen it's a yellow plate T35, model EZ. This is a 5 position BW 35 originally from a 1965 Triumph 2000.
I'm all excited to make progress on this car again. As it was, I lost my drive to finish it this last year and get it on the road when I realized that I wasnt going to be able to drive it. There was no room for my left foot when driving it except for UNDER the clutch pedal, which was going to make it very awkward and dangerous to drive. The footwell is plenty deep, but it's just too darned skinny, and with my long legs, I can not do what the other drivers I've talked to with this body do, and put their foot on the ground in-front of the pedal, because that puts my knees right into the dashboard and steering column. The solution to the problems for me is to just get rid of the clutch pedal so my left foot can rest down there comfortably while driving and not have to move.
My TR7 had a BW T35 automatic in it, and it was still wicked fun to drive. With traffic the way it is in New England, I actually find it more relaxing to drive a slush-box anyways, so for me this is going to be perfect, and making the car all the more enjoyable for me to drive... or in this case, possible for me to drive in the first place!
OP
justin_mercier
Jedi Warrior
Offline
Happy new year everyone.
Here's my crappy quality phone photo of the roadster on new year's day 2014
Here's my crappy quality phone photo of the roadster on new year's day 2014
OP
justin_mercier
Jedi Warrior
Offline
So... major setback in getting on the road. I'm no longer able to buy the transmission from california that I was going to be purchasing. So I am now in search of anyone with access to a BW T35 transmission, or anyone in southern england who can help me get one there packed up and shipped the states. I have a flexplate from a triump 2000 for the BW T35 on the way over from england, and will need to machine an adapter to fit it on the end of the TR6 cam shaft, but before I worry about that I need to find a transmission again.
I'm told that supposedly the torque converter and transmission from any other T35 will mate up with the bell housing from a triumph 2000/2500/2.5pi if i can source a transmission from some other vehicle with a BW 35 automatic transmission. I'll also need to get a complete gear selector assembly as well.
So... if anyone knows of a triumph saloon in the states, or if anyone is near london who can pick up a transmission i'm watching on ebay from a 2.5pi, or has any other way to help me out... i'd appreciate it greatly =/ Kinda bummed atm.
I'm told that supposedly the torque converter and transmission from any other T35 will mate up with the bell housing from a triumph 2000/2500/2.5pi if i can source a transmission from some other vehicle with a BW 35 automatic transmission. I'll also need to get a complete gear selector assembly as well.
So... if anyone knows of a triumph saloon in the states, or if anyone is near london who can pick up a transmission i'm watching on ebay from a 2.5pi, or has any other way to help me out... i'd appreciate it greatly =/ Kinda bummed atm.
Tr3aguy
Jedi Knight
Offline
https://www.trans4less.com/mg-leyand_mgb_roadster_gt-automatic_transmissions-bw_t35.html ?? No interest....just found this on a search/
OP
justin_mercier
Jedi Warrior
Offline
i THINK that I may have found a transmission. I was put in contact with a fellow in the UK who says he thinks that he has a few T65s and maybe a T35 as well as the gear selector I'll need... and he's shipping a big crate of transmissions in a few weeks to John Esposito at Quantum Mechanics... which happens to be the same shop I was going to take any transmission that I got to for rebuilding. So it looks like things are finally falling into place. How strange to be put in contact with a person who is shipping a crate of transmissions from the UK to the very shop that I was planning on having my transmission sent to, when I find one. *starts humming 'it's a small world' *
Silverghost
Yoda
Offline
Been a while....wondering how you are getting on? Any updates? 
OP
justin_mercier
Jedi Warrior
Offline
Better late than never. Just got a really big box from FedEx today!
Stalled for 18 months, its' time to clean off the dust, pull the pile of parts out of the inside, and get back to work on this thing!
Stalled for 18 months, its' time to clean off the dust, pull the pile of parts out of the inside, and get back to work on this thing!
gbtr6
Jedi Trainee
Offline
Can agree more on the drain. I did mine like that and it makes a difference. These cars rust just by looking at them wrong.
Perry
Rhodyspit75
Jedi Knight
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Looks like you are going automatic! Good to see you are back at it.
OP
justin_mercier
Jedi Warrior
Offline
Completely unnecessary, but my transmission is now all nice and shiny =D
I cant stand to put a dirty part into the car lol.
I'm debating finding a transmission shop to go through it while it's out just in case, though the car it came out of, a Triumph 2500 TC with 30k miles, had it working just fine when removed.
I have an extra torque converter and a few other parts coming in another box which should be here next week, but I think that even without the spigot bushings and whatnot in the other box, that I already have the parts that I need, since most of the parts are the same for the BW65 and BW35 and I had bought some BW35 bushings and spacers.
The flexplate attaches to the end of the crankshaft with some spacers and bushings, and then the flexplate bolts to the front of the torque converter, with the spigot bushing to keep everything perfectly centered. If you look at the engine back plate here, looks just like a TR6 backplate, with one difference, that extra hole is there so you can fit a socket wrench in and get the 4 bolts through the flex plate to the torque converter.
The transmission is about 2.5 inches shorter than the TR6 transmission, so I'm going to have to either get a new longer drive shaft, or use my lathe and fabricate a 2.5 inch long bushing / adapter for the transmission side of the shaft, and use the stock TR6 shaft. The bushing may be easier, and should work just fine, and if I turn it on a lathe, it shouldn't affect the balance at all.
I cant stand to put a dirty part into the car lol.
I'm debating finding a transmission shop to go through it while it's out just in case, though the car it came out of, a Triumph 2500 TC with 30k miles, had it working just fine when removed.
I have an extra torque converter and a few other parts coming in another box which should be here next week, but I think that even without the spigot bushings and whatnot in the other box, that I already have the parts that I need, since most of the parts are the same for the BW65 and BW35 and I had bought some BW35 bushings and spacers.
The flexplate attaches to the end of the crankshaft with some spacers and bushings, and then the flexplate bolts to the front of the torque converter, with the spigot bushing to keep everything perfectly centered. If you look at the engine back plate here, looks just like a TR6 backplate, with one difference, that extra hole is there so you can fit a socket wrench in and get the 4 bolts through the flex plate to the torque converter.
The transmission is about 2.5 inches shorter than the TR6 transmission, so I'm going to have to either get a new longer drive shaft, or use my lathe and fabricate a 2.5 inch long bushing / adapter for the transmission side of the shaft, and use the stock TR6 shaft. The bushing may be easier, and should work just fine, and if I turn it on a lathe, it shouldn't affect the balance at all.
OP
justin_mercier
Jedi Warrior
Offline
So work has been progressing on the TR6 Hunter Roadster.
Because I'm going to need a new driveshaft made with the transmission, I decided that now would also be the best time to do the Goodparts R200 differential swap, because that also requires changing the driveshaft.
First step was removing the old diff.
With the differential out, I pulled out the original driveshaft. Unfortunately, I had thought that the flange was the same for the output of the TR6 4 speed and the BW65, but they're actually slightly different. I'm probably going to have to provide my spare flange when I get the driveshaft made, because while I know the TR6 U-joint flange end is an off the shelf part, I'm not sure if theyr'e still making the other flange end that I need for the BW65 output flange.
I got myself a nissan R200 from an Infinity Q45 with a 3.54:1 ratio, a bit better for highway driving and lower RP with the automatic, since I'll no longer have the 5spd and I cant put an overdrive in it
Here's the rest of the goodparts kit
The rear axles that I am using on this, since my originals needed rebuilding, I got from Al Gary when I bought his engine, and he had the R200 kit in his car already, so I didnt need to modify the axles any. I plan in the future to get a set of the CV axles from goodparts, but right now I just want to get on the road as soon as possible =)
The kit installs on the differential wicked easily, making this a true bolt-in conversion, if you source the differential from goodparts with the flange work and grinding already done.
I had forgotten that when I put the differential on the last time that I had no body on the frame, and so thought that I could get the differential out with the exhaust still attached. Trying to drop the differential and having it catch on the exhaust pipe and twist, just about coming off my jack sideways and ripping the fuel line off the frame quickly debased me of that idea! A few hours later and a bit of elbowgrease and I had the old differential out, the new one installed.
Something which I will be doing in the future, but probably not until everything else is finished, is making extra brackets for the rear suspension. I'm using the Moss motors rear tube shock conversion, and with the Hathaway Hunter body, the rear body/bumper bracket mount points are unused. One of the weaknesses of the Moss kit is excessive front and back motion breaking the welds of the rear differential crossmember. This illustration shows where I will be making a bolt-in bracket to attach the Moss bracket to the rear mounting points.
Right now there are just a couple of bolts holding the HVDA 5 speed in place, but they're positioned such that I cant get both sides of the bolt at once by myself, and it's getting quite frustrating! I think that I need to wait until I can get someone over to my house to help before I get the last few bolts out and remove the current transmission. Once that is done the next step is to test-fit the BW65 and take all the measurements needed to fabricate a new rear-mount for the transmission, and to measure the exact length from flange face to flange face for the new driveshaft. My goal is to order the driveshaft on monday (probably from Richard Good again, his service is great) and send him my extra bw65 output flange.
Once I've fabricated the brackets to hold the transmission, I'll get started figuring out the right order to bolt together the bushings and mount up the flexplate. Orignially I was going to swap the rear-engine plate with the triumph 2500TC automatic rear plate that I have, but I think the only actual difference is a single hole for a socket wrench to access the flex-plate to torque converter bolts, so I will just use a holesaw to cut the extra hole in the existing plate.
Because the BW65 is an automatic, it has a kickdown cable which needs to be attached to the throttle linkage. The current throttle linkage has no place to attach the cable. However, because I need to remove the pedal box and re-do it with fewer pedals and different spacing. Rather than fabricating a new linkage and doing the math to figure out the right throw for the kickdown cable, etc... The triumph TR7 throttle linkage and gas pedal is a cable-linkage which already has the extra mount for the kickdown cable, and is designed to work with dual stromberg 175CD, so the throw is correct too. Instead of playing around with angles and arc motions etc... i'm going to fabricate a bracket to mount a TR7 throttle linkage to the TR6 intake manifold and use a TR7 gas pedal, and call it a day, leaving only a brake pedal in the original pedal box.
Feels good to be making progress again! Been almost 2 years since the last major bit of work, and the time since then has all been trying to solve the "I'm too tall to drive this car" problem.
Because I'm going to need a new driveshaft made with the transmission, I decided that now would also be the best time to do the Goodparts R200 differential swap, because that also requires changing the driveshaft.
First step was removing the old diff.
With the differential out, I pulled out the original driveshaft. Unfortunately, I had thought that the flange was the same for the output of the TR6 4 speed and the BW65, but they're actually slightly different. I'm probably going to have to provide my spare flange when I get the driveshaft made, because while I know the TR6 U-joint flange end is an off the shelf part, I'm not sure if theyr'e still making the other flange end that I need for the BW65 output flange.
I got myself a nissan R200 from an Infinity Q45 with a 3.54:1 ratio, a bit better for highway driving and lower RP with the automatic, since I'll no longer have the 5spd and I cant put an overdrive in it
Here's the rest of the goodparts kit
The rear axles that I am using on this, since my originals needed rebuilding, I got from Al Gary when I bought his engine, and he had the R200 kit in his car already, so I didnt need to modify the axles any. I plan in the future to get a set of the CV axles from goodparts, but right now I just want to get on the road as soon as possible =)
The kit installs on the differential wicked easily, making this a true bolt-in conversion, if you source the differential from goodparts with the flange work and grinding already done.
I had forgotten that when I put the differential on the last time that I had no body on the frame, and so thought that I could get the differential out with the exhaust still attached. Trying to drop the differential and having it catch on the exhaust pipe and twist, just about coming off my jack sideways and ripping the fuel line off the frame quickly debased me of that idea! A few hours later and a bit of elbowgrease and I had the old differential out, the new one installed.
Something which I will be doing in the future, but probably not until everything else is finished, is making extra brackets for the rear suspension. I'm using the Moss motors rear tube shock conversion, and with the Hathaway Hunter body, the rear body/bumper bracket mount points are unused. One of the weaknesses of the Moss kit is excessive front and back motion breaking the welds of the rear differential crossmember. This illustration shows where I will be making a bolt-in bracket to attach the Moss bracket to the rear mounting points.
Right now there are just a couple of bolts holding the HVDA 5 speed in place, but they're positioned such that I cant get both sides of the bolt at once by myself, and it's getting quite frustrating! I think that I need to wait until I can get someone over to my house to help before I get the last few bolts out and remove the current transmission. Once that is done the next step is to test-fit the BW65 and take all the measurements needed to fabricate a new rear-mount for the transmission, and to measure the exact length from flange face to flange face for the new driveshaft. My goal is to order the driveshaft on monday (probably from Richard Good again, his service is great) and send him my extra bw65 output flange.
Once I've fabricated the brackets to hold the transmission, I'll get started figuring out the right order to bolt together the bushings and mount up the flexplate. Orignially I was going to swap the rear-engine plate with the triumph 2500TC automatic rear plate that I have, but I think the only actual difference is a single hole for a socket wrench to access the flex-plate to torque converter bolts, so I will just use a holesaw to cut the extra hole in the existing plate.
Because the BW65 is an automatic, it has a kickdown cable which needs to be attached to the throttle linkage. The current throttle linkage has no place to attach the cable. However, because I need to remove the pedal box and re-do it with fewer pedals and different spacing. Rather than fabricating a new linkage and doing the math to figure out the right throw for the kickdown cable, etc... The triumph TR7 throttle linkage and gas pedal is a cable-linkage which already has the extra mount for the kickdown cable, and is designed to work with dual stromberg 175CD, so the throw is correct too. Instead of playing around with angles and arc motions etc... i'm going to fabricate a bracket to mount a TR7 throttle linkage to the TR6 intake manifold and use a TR7 gas pedal, and call it a day, leaving only a brake pedal in the original pedal box.
Feels good to be making progress again! Been almost 2 years since the last major bit of work, and the time since then has all been trying to solve the "I'm too tall to drive this car" problem.
OP
justin_mercier
Jedi Warrior
Offline
Aye carumba those last few bolts took me forever to get off. Need to take the clutch and flywheels off now, and take out the old pedal box.
Here's the HVDA and the BW65 side by side
Here's the HVDA and the BW65 side by side
OP
justin_mercier
Jedi Warrior
Offline
I got the transmission test fit, without mounting the flexplate or anything to the crankshaft yet, so I can get some measurements. As expected there are a few things that I have to deal with to get it to work. One thing that I noticed right away, the 3 studs at the top of the transmission will need to come out and be replaced by slightly longer ones. The HVDA and original 4 speed bellhousings have a recess milled around the holes where those 3 studs go, this bellhousing does not. I could mill away some of the aluminum, but I think it's just easier to put longer studs in.
The rear mounts on the BW65 are actually quite close to the rear mounts for the TR6 so I'm only going to have to make some easy adapter plates. In fact I should be able to cut them out of some heavy duty angle iron and have it work just fine. That's a relief. The pipe i'm using to hold it in place blocks the view, but there are 2 convenient holes in teh mounting bracket already on the BW65 which line up in a straight line with the late TR6 mounting bushings.
The edges of the transmission tunnel will need to be trimmed back just slightly up in the front of the passenger footwell. The gear selector lever hits here just a tiny bit.
With the transmission in place I am also able to measure for the new driveshaft. The easiest way for me to figure out how to do this was to just shove a yardstick through the driveshaft tunnel and get it pressed up against the input flange of the R200
I measured a few times, and pushed and pulled the engine and transmission a bit and remeasured and it looks like it should be right around 29 1/8 to 29 1/4 in length, and like the original shaft, be collapsing, as neither flange on either side is a sliding flange.
Incidentally I was correct in that the stock shaft was the right size. If not for the fact that the splines on mine are worn, and the flange on one side doesnt match the BW65 ouput flange, I certainly would have been able to get away with using the original.
Next up is to order the new driveshaft made, remove the transmission again, and fit up the flexplate, spigot bushings and spacers to the end of the crankshaft.
The rear mounts on the BW65 are actually quite close to the rear mounts for the TR6 so I'm only going to have to make some easy adapter plates. In fact I should be able to cut them out of some heavy duty angle iron and have it work just fine. That's a relief. The pipe i'm using to hold it in place blocks the view, but there are 2 convenient holes in teh mounting bracket already on the BW65 which line up in a straight line with the late TR6 mounting bushings.
The edges of the transmission tunnel will need to be trimmed back just slightly up in the front of the passenger footwell. The gear selector lever hits here just a tiny bit.
With the transmission in place I am also able to measure for the new driveshaft. The easiest way for me to figure out how to do this was to just shove a yardstick through the driveshaft tunnel and get it pressed up against the input flange of the R200
I measured a few times, and pushed and pulled the engine and transmission a bit and remeasured and it looks like it should be right around 29 1/8 to 29 1/4 in length, and like the original shaft, be collapsing, as neither flange on either side is a sliding flange.
Incidentally I was correct in that the stock shaft was the right size. If not for the fact that the splines on mine are worn, and the flange on one side doesnt match the BW65 ouput flange, I certainly would have been able to get away with using the original.
Next up is to order the new driveshaft made, remove the transmission again, and fit up the flexplate, spigot bushings and spacers to the end of the crankshaft.
HerronScott
Darth Vader
Offline
Justin,
Glad to see you are moving forward on this again! I'm curious what you are going to do in the transmission tunnel area where the gear shift selector seems to be right where the tunnel mounts/seals to the floor pan. Also what's that L-shaped bracket near there? It seems like that might hit the tunnel as well.
I do have to kid you though about no paint for the R200 differential?
Scott
Glad to see you are moving forward on this again! I'm curious what you are going to do in the transmission tunnel area where the gear shift selector seems to be right where the tunnel mounts/seals to the floor pan. Also what's that L-shaped bracket near there? It seems like that might hit the tunnel as well.
I do have to kid you though about no paint for the R200 differential?
Scott
OP
justin_mercier
Jedi Warrior
Offline
Justin,
Glad to see you are moving forward on this again! I'm curious what you are going to do in the transmission tunnel area where the gear shift selector seems to be right where the tunnel mounts/seals to the floor pan. Also what's that L-shaped bracket near there? It seems like that might hit the tunnel as well.
I do have to kid you though about no paint for the R200 differential?
Scott
I'm getting impatient and didnt want to wait for paint to dry on the differential >_<
the top L bracket was part of the bracket that held the gear selector in place, and will probably be coming off as I need to fabricate a new mount for the selector. The gear lever , if it doesnt clear the tunnel top completely, well... the tunnel is just ABS plastic, so I'll chop it open and make a patch that clears it =)
OP
justin_mercier
Jedi Warrior
Offline
I hope so, almost no progress over winter though, work kicked my butt and I wasnt in the garage almost at all. After I'm back from my trip to Baltimore / DC this next week I hope to get a few weeks of lighter work after we launch our next release.
Did get the driveshaft made and delivered, as well as getting the parts I needed for the throttle linkages and kickdown cable linkage to the BW65.
Did get the driveshaft made and delivered, as well as getting the parts I needed for the throttle linkages and kickdown cable linkage to the BW65.
Silverghost
Yoda
Offline
Has anyone heard from Justin? It's been almost a year since the last post in this thread and 05/16 was the last time he was on the Forum......
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His web page suggests he sold the TR6... https://www.tharkis.com/cars.html