T9 or Datsun 210?

[MichiganTed]

I have a lead on a T9 out of a XR4Ti and I'm debating the pros and cons of the T9 conversion or the Datsun conversion.

Datsun Pros: No body shell mods, gain a seal on the rear of the engine, conversion kits readily available, correct gear ratios.

T9: Smoother / better shifts, seems to be preferred (from my racing contacts). But
- rear engine seal?
- kits and overall cost?
- body shell mods?
- haven't checked gear ratios yet.

Thoughts?

 

[Gerard]

Ted,

Do you know you'll also need to modify the remote shift tower for it to fit in the original location?

I've driven both and I can't say I found the shifting noticeably better or smoother. At least not enough to warrant the considerable difference in expense and modifications for it to fit. I think shift feel depends somewhat on condition.

Are you familiar with my kit?

https://gerardsgarage.com/Garage/Tech/5speedKit.htm

 

[MichiganTed]

Yup, great kit. I've only heard good things about it (and you!). Love your datsun clutch addition. But as a Ford guy who grew-up in Southeastern Michigan (I work for Ford in engine engineering) I'm somehow drawn to the T9...and I can find T9's, I can't find datsun's.

 

[nomad]

Not all T9's have the same input and output shafts, do they? The correct size shafts would be something you should check into.
Seems I remember that from somewhere.
The Datsun stuff is getting hard to find!

Kurt.

 

[Hap Waldrop]

The T9 is fine tranny and I sell a fair number of the T9 kits for the MGBs, where it is by far the most well thought out,and engineered kit for the MGB. Ok with that being said, I have the abilty to sell the T9 kits for the Spridgets as well, and several people have called me about them, but the body mods are what turns me off about the T9 in the Spridget, the thought of having to cut the crossmember and and a big part of the tranny tunnel, just would be more mods than I think is needed for the Spridget and I always tell folks to go the Datsun route, which I think is the better engineeried kit for the A sreires Spridget.


AS far as buying a T9 kit less the tranny, I think is sort of risky deal, those trannys were scarse here, when you buy the complete kit you get a guaranteed gearbox, and you're not going to save that much finding a used gearbox, for exxmaple I never sold the T9 kit less the gearbox for my MGB customer, they always opt for the complete kit.


Ted, I think the big question is do you want to peel your 65 apart like a can opener for a 5 speed, because thats what the T9 in the Spridget will cost and you're still going to spend $2000+ to get the rest of the kit, if you find a T9 gearbox. If you still determined on the T9 call me and I get you solid quote on the kit minus the gearbox.You'll find the T9 rare, it only come on Merkurs in the US, but on tons fo cars in Europe, while it is a Borg Warner gearbox, its Eurpoean built BW gearbox, not a US built BW gearbox, so kinda rare here.

 

[Guest]

According to Frontline the US T9 won't work due to a different input shaft. Their kit is designed around a different lenth shaft. I think I have it in my email somewhere.

 

[Guest]

Here:

"If you are getting your own gearbox please be aware of 2 things:
The gear lever position will be approximately 3" further back so you will need to modify your existing tunnel cover & carpet. (This is why we use the "short remote" modification on our gearboxes to avoid this.
The type 9 box we use was fitted to the Sierra in the UK but I have not heard of a vehicle fitted with this box in the USA. The Merkur had a different type 9 box which has a longer 1st motion input shaft and this is not suitable for our kits. I have attached part of a magazine article about these boxes which may help."

Regards

Maggie Patston
Frontline Developments
9 Station Yard
Steventon
Abingdon on Thames

 

[MichiganTed]

I believe there are three input shaft lengths for the T9. The Merkur XR4Ti in the states used the middle of the three if I'm not mistaken. And I have to agree with Hap 100%. I don't like the idea of cutting up the body shell. Perhaps I'll buy the T9 anyway for trade. Thanks for all the input, you've helped me decide,

 

[Westfield_XI]

Is no one going to respond about the whole idea of a seal at the back of an a-series engine? IMHO this is much more controversial than which gearbox.......

 

[MichiganTed]

A seal for the back of the engine is a big plus from my perspective. Nothing worse than oil leaks and these vintage cars all leak,

 

[nomad]

Forget the discussion but I believe some seal kits are better than others. Paul A's method of just closing up the tolerances on the A series worked quite well I believe, along with a working PCV. Should be covered in tech articles somewhere, perhaps someone will chime in. Personally, how do you know its british if it doesn't mark its territory!


Kurt.

 

[Guest]

Easter seals?

 

[Gerard]

Forget the discussion but I believe some seal kits are better than others. Paul A's method of just closing up the tolerances on the A series worked quite well I believe, along with a working PCV. Should be covered in tech articles somewhere, perhaps someone will chime in. Personally, how do you know its british if it doesn't mark its territory!


Kurt.

The Morriservice technique has generally been a successful and cheap solution, however, you will be destroying the main cap and half moon seal in the process. If it doesn't work for you (and is doesn't always work successfully), there's no going back. A new main cap and half moon seal will need to be purchased, and a complete tear down for a trip to the machine shop for a line bore will be the only fix. I have never found it worth the risk. I have had a lot of success with <span style="font-style: italic">my version</span> of the lip seal conversion, as have others.

 

[MichiganTed]

Decision made. I pulled a 210 trans yesterday. I see there's another one in NY:

https://corvallis.craigslist.org/pts/2925379973.html

And know of a T9 out of a XR4Ti on the west side of Michigan if anyone is interested.

 

[Westfield_XI]

Gerard, what does retrofitting your seal to a Rivergate plate entail? How long does it take to do the work and approx. how much does it cost?

 

[Gerard]

Westfield XI,

You've have to machine the plate like mine is in the crank area for it to fit. Installing the seal itself should take you less than an hour. It fits without modification with any other stock gearbox. Contact me off list for other details.