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Surrey Top Questions...

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SCguy

SCguy

Jedi Warrior
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Hi,

I've got a couple of questions...

First, I've refitted a new rubber seal, but have a gap. I noticed this same gap on the old seal. Has someone else solved this problem and eliminated the gap?

Second, I'm missing one of these small clips. Does anyone know of a source? The US suppliers show it as no longer available and I can't find it on any of the UK sites.

Third question is basically the same as the second. US suppliers show the rubber window seal (which goes in the metal strip) as no longer available.

MV3B5141.jpg

MV3B5144.jpg

MV3B5145.jpg
 
Larry-

Have you found the part number for the clip you are missing, is it illustrated in any manual? Does the clip itself attach to the backlight, or is it for the hardtop? Revington has a couple of clips for the hardtop listed (608307, 613766), but I don't see anything for the backlight.

The window seal, wouldn't you use the normal seal that early TR4s have? The seal runs from the window frame across the outer sill and back up - and the channel looks a lot like the piece you have. The channel I am refering to is on the Moss online catalog, PN 802-060. If that is the case, I think that the appropriate seal is PN 649-070 - I'm not certain about that because it is a bad illustration.

Randy
 
Larry, knowing nothing of what I speak concerning a surrey top, I do notice that Rimmer lists many such "clips" and other such items for said top in their online catalog. Have you tried them?
As far as the rubber seal around the backlight, that appears to be a standard "H"-type rubber seal that is oft used to install windows and such in campers. I installed the rear window deflector on my roll bar using the same seal which I got in bulk form from JCWhitney catalog. They offer a whole variety of these and will send you free small samples. My point is, did you push the rubber seal down into the tight rounded corner first and then install the window. You may have contoured the rubber to fit the window and not the frame, hence creating a gap. Had you pushed the seal into the frame, there might have been just enough grip on the window side of the "H" to grip the window and not leave an opening and appear to close the gap a bit. I.E., did you Mind The Gap ? (I had to throw that in there, sounds very British.) The shiny finishing strip obviously tightens everything down and may well solve the problem. Sure looks like it is just a matter of pushing the rubber into the metal a bit more before applying the finishing strip, and still gripping the glass (plastic?).
 
Hi Larry,

Taking your last question first, I got the special longer door & window seals from TRF a while back. They had them. Dunno if they do right now.

If memory serves, on TR4 it's simply a 100" long seal instead of the 72" normally used when no hard top is fitted.

An alternative would be to buy a third one of the short seals and cut two short lengths out of it to be fitted just to the channel on the backlight frame. This is not "correct", but would probably work.

As to your second question, I think those clips are only used when the surrey panel is fitted in place of the hard top. If you are only using the hard top roof panel, it's not needed. However, if you need one, I think it might be the same as is used on the windshield frame, near the top and partly hidden under the rubber window seal, and a loop on the surrey panel or soft top connects to it. This keeps the side flap of the surrey panel or soft top held taught.

Perhaps the clip is available separately for the windshield frame, where it's welded on. If it is, just drill holes and rivet it ini place.

If neither is available from any source, it would be pretty easy to fabricate one. Just get a flat piece of steel, cut out a flat design and bend it to shape. It might take a couple tries to get to look exactly the same.

Regarding your first question, is there also a gap on the outside? If not, it might not be all that big a deal to just leave a bit of a gap inside. If there is also a gap outside, perhaps you can "fudge it" a little by pushing the rubber into the corner and slightly off the edge of the window, actually not trying to fully "bottom out" the window in the grove in the rubber seal. If that's done, it might be a good idea, once it's fitted, to inject some silicone sealant into the groove, past the window, to fill up the void, to help keep the rubber seal from shrinking away from the backlight frame.
 
The clip Alan mentions for the front is available from Revington - 611895SS, 3.95 GBP with VAT. I think the clip may be slightly different looking than the one you are holding, but if you bought a matched set it would work I bet.

Randy
 
Thanks for everyone's imput. Here are my thoughts... On the rubber seal, Bill is right that I fit the seal to the glass first and then used the 1/8 inch cord trick to pull the rubber seal onto the frame. Should it be fitted to the frame first and would it have made a difference? The picture shows the gap on the outside, but the seal covers on the inside. The old seal fit this way as well.

I ordered the clips from Revington using Randy's part number. Thanks

On my third picture... The 8 to 10 inch strip of metal which had rubber in it appears to have been added by a previous owner and is not stock. My windshield had the same metal strips added. Four metal strips total.
 
Larry-

I don't think the strips are mandatory, but I do think they were stock, weren't they? TR4s had a 2 piece weatherstip setup, the channel was for one of the pieces. TR6s went to a single weatherstrip - you could do the same I think as a TR6 with later style seals and seal fine.

Question though: on your TR4, along the outer sill and B post, don't you have similar channel? I bet the car did originally.

I put in my last windshield like you did, so that is the only way I know. There is a chance you could have achieved a closer fit if you started the window in those corners first and used the rope to complete the remainder. If you do try it again, just bear in mind that those rear windows are very rare now - would be hard to fix a bad mistake.

Randy
 
Randy is correct, those metal channels are original on my TR4. The rubber weather strip goes into the channel, use a dull putty knife. I've owned my car since 69, it has never been restored in a major way, just repaired and maintained.
 
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