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Steel Wheels vs Wire Wheels

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Tinkerman

Tinkerman

Darth Vader
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Since I have owned my '60 TR3A I have planned to put wire wheels on it. I have 5 wire wheels, all have to be tuned and the wobble taken out of them. Really can't afford a set of new ones and I really don't have the budget to buy wires. Over the years I have been reading commentaries on safety issues on wire wheels. I see from the pictures that pop up on the Forum that many of you use the steel wheels.
Any commentary about using one over the other would be appreciated. If I went to the steel my car would be on rubber within a couple of days and that idea has some considerable appeal to me.

Your thoughts deeply appreciated, Tinkerman
 
Really a matter of taste and budget, Dick. Both wheels have issues. You've touched on the wire wheel problem of trueing, and then there are also issues at times with the splines on the hubs.

The steel wheels were pretty thin to start with, and are often warped from improper mounting techniques. If you have the steel ones, and the proper hubcaps, and that's what the car came with, and they're in good shape, I'd go with them.

Mickey
 
Seems to me that there are two critical issues with wire wheels:

1. They need to have all spokes present and tight ("tuned").

2. It is critical to check spline wear on both the wheel and the adaptor.

Some good reading from the VTR online "Maintenance Handbook" and from British Wire Wheel, amongst many sources of information.

spline_wear.gif
<span style="font-size: 8pt"><span style="font-style: italic">-- image from the British Wire Wheel web site </span></span>
 
Dick-

I've had wire wheels on a TR6 before and felt safe, but I never got over the feeling that I couldn't get a tire serviced easily so I rarely traveled very far. For that reason, I definitely stray towards steel wheels or alloys.

I think wires on a TR3 look fantastic, however, and may use a set from my TR4 occasionally - I like the idea of keeping the wheel lugs longer for the steel rims and running a 1/4" spacer if I feel like putting on the wires for a local outing.

Randy
 
I have chrome wires on the 4A.

The Pros:

I always get compliments on how they look and people following me get a kick out of watching the knock-offs spin. I think removing the wheels is easier and fun. Overall, I am glad I have them.

The Cons:

Wires require a lot of upkeep, especially cleaning. When a spoke breaks, it is a major production to fix. The splines do eventually wear out.

Also, 72 spokes is better than 60 spokes, which is better than 48 spokes in terms of strength.

IMHO, I would get on the road by going with the steel wheels and let how you feel over time decide on either refurbishing what you have or getting new wire wheels and hubs (ideal).
 

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I have had no problem since I put the new Daytons on my car, but if I was going to use the car for performance, steel rims would be my choice!

I prefer the look of wires over the steel rims, but then again I dont drive too fast!

tr64-5-912.jpg


and 9 out of 10 praying mantisis agree! ~lol~

DSC01552.jpg
 
I love the look of spoke wheels but like yourself it is always a budget issue. I put on some cheap spoke look hubcaps on one of the cars and people comment on them all the time. From a distance they look ok.

But like others have said the spoke rims are going to be more costly in the long run and I think getting the car on the road is the first priority. You can always put them on later. Get the car on the road and have fun with it.
 
I opted for new chrome wires for the first Stag, as that's what it had originally. Sorry I don't have a good photo to share, but here's a sample:
113_1372cropped.jpg

BTW, that racetrack was some 2500 miles from home.

The wires look great, but are definitely a high maintenance item. And failing to do the annual spline clean and regrease can easily lead to a situation where the wheel must be destroyed to get it off the car. I recall a shop years ago that had the remains of one hanging on the wall, where they had cut the wheel in half with a torch to get it off!

Getting tires mounted hasn't been a problem for me; almost every place now has a machine that grabs the wheel by the inside rim rather than the center ... even my local Wal-Mart! When I pulled off the Interstate somewhere in Iowa on the way to VTR 2005, it only took two tries to find a place that could deal with them (and they even had a set of tires in stock to fit).
 
I will have the same issue once my car is completed.....I have to choose between chrome 60 Spokes, Stock Steel or a set of alloys that came with my car.

Question....is see some negative comments regarding using wire wheels for performance or "spirited" driving.

When I look back at old "vintage" racing/ralley photos of TR2's and 3's in action, it seems that many have been photographed using Wire Wheels. Just curious, why this is? Is it simply because of the easier change out of wheels mounted on splines vs lugs?

One of my favorites....

https://www.fot-racing.com/historic/caption/Kas%20and%20Lew.htm


Cheers,
M. Pied Lourd
 
Wire wheels are durable provided they're maintained. Spoke tension is key to longevity and safety. A tenionmeter is a very worthwhile (but not cheap) investment. I work in the bike industry, so truing wheels is second nature to me. I also have trued many car wire wheels for friends. However, you really need to make a truing stand to do it correctly. There are issues of dish (how far to one side of center or the other the rim sits in relation to the hub), roundness, plus true (side to side). Find a qualified wheel truer if you don't feel comfortable doing it yourself. Overtighten a spoke, and it can begin a chain of events that may quickly lead to catastrpohic failure. As for the splines, again, regular upkeep and vigilance is your friend.
 
Just my opinion, but I think wire wheels get a bad rap for being too flexible for hard driving. There may be some very small difference, but IMO until you get into ultra-sticky, race-only tires, you'll never be able to measure the difference.

I took first in class on those wire wheels; beating out lots of cars with alloys. Absolutely no other special preparation, except for removing everything loose from the car (so it wouldn't slide around). The door handle was off only because it was broken !

That said, I had already broken some spokes in one of those new wheels (and had them replaced under warranty). Frequent inspection, and prompt attention to defects, is a must.
 
Totally agree. If you catch the small problems, you'll avoid the big ones. I agree with the tire statement. If you have ultra grip tires, the wheels will be overstressed. Remember, originally when wire wheels were new, it was more about drifting through turns, which stress wheels less. Right now Mavic (a bicycle wheel manufacturer) is trying to iron out some issues with carbon spoked wheels. Same type of problem, too much lateral force in certain situations.
 
For me, wire wheels are one of the things that really completes the look of a TR3, TR4, TR250 or early Spitfire (Mk1-Mk3). Something about those body styles just looks great with wire wheels and at least for me, makes it a British sports car.

I converted my original TR4A to wire wheels and my wife's 1968 Spitfire as well back when they were our daily drivers in the late 70's and 80's. Never really had any problems with them and we put 70,000+ miles on the cars as drivers.

Scott
 
mikecyc72usa said:
I also have trued many car wire wheels for friends. However, you really need to make a truing stand to do it correctly.
Click to expand...

Mike, is a truing stand something a DIY'er could handle?
 
Truing stands are essentially a way to mount a wheel facing you on a workbench. Also, there are adjustable fingers, like a C-clamp, that can open and close. You close them down to where the fingers just touch the wobble in the wheel. As you keep truing the wheel, you keep tightening the fingers until the wheel is wobble free, or true. If you have access to an old hub, and a machine shop or welder, it shouldn't be too hard to fabricate one. Go onto Park Tools website (bike tools) and look up truing stands. You'll get an idea what they look like. A simple tool for a task this has a bit of art to it.
 
I turned my wood lathe into a truing stand. If you have a wood lathe that has a head which turns for outboard turning you can make a jig to turn it into a truing stand.

I turned a disk with a slight hole in it the exact size of the wire wheel adapter. Then I mounted the adapter to the wood disk by placing it in the hole and screwing it down. Now you just have to mount you wheel and you have a wire wheel on a truing stand. I used a dial indicator on a magnetic base to measure the run out (roundness) and wobble (true). I never thought of measuring the offset (dish).

I wish I had Miles ability to do the work on the wheel, as I was able to improve it but not as much as I would like. I think I still have the values on my white board behind the lathe (speaks to how little I use the lathe).
 
Just got back from the car show in Gettysburg. Before I could get out of the car, folks were coming up and complimenting us on the TR's wheels (among other things I am proud to say).

Yeah, they're worth it. Having said that, there were quite a few spline-drive cars with those Superlight? alloy wheels.
 
CinneaghTR said:
Yeah, they're worth it. Having said that, there were quite a few spline-drive cars with those Superlight? alloy wheels.
Click to expand...

When I bought the second TR4A project car, I was thinking it would be nice to keep my original car with wires and the convertible top and do the second one with knock-off alloys (https://www.mossmotors.com/Shop/ViewProducts.aspx?PlateIndexID=29899) and a Surrey top.

Scott
 
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