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After a long rest I have started working on my tired TR250 after letting it sit for nearly a decade. I have rebuilt the carbs, had the fuel tank cleaned and sealed, replaced ignition components, replaced the battery, adjusted the valves and squirted a bit of oil into the cylinders. I have also been talking to the car very nicely and promised to never neglect her again. After some deep prayer and hope, I turned the key and she fired in seconds! After fussing with timing and carb sync a bit she idled down to the sound we all love. The one thing I didn't realize was my car had become a smoker during her break from the road. I let her run for a good long while thinking the oil in the cylinders just needed time to burn off. To my sadness she kept right on smokin' away for 30 plus minutes when we were paid a visit from our local fire department! No joke! Since then I have started her up a few more times (after alerting my nevous neighbor) and she is at least a three pack a day smoker. The only other thing I have noticed is low, very low vacuum pressure and at the retard unit at idle and I am fairly certain that there are no vacuum leaks. Is it possible to set the timing incorrectly and result in a horribly rich mixture? For example: if the timing is set with the vacuum lines connected (which I know is wrong)will fuel mixture be effected? My carbs are the ones without adjustable needles. Or am I wishfully thinking and my engine is toast. When I last drove the car she was definetly a none smoker. Stuck rings? Fried valve(s)? It is very difficult to desern the smoke colour for additional clues. Besides the smoke, she doesn't run half bad. Can someone clue me in on the timing fuel mixture relationship? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif
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TR5/TR250 smoky 250
- Thread starter dikshutts
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Harry_Ward
Jedi Knight
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Stop running the engine and perform a compression test on each cyliner to determine if you have any gasket, ring, or piston issues. Continuing to run it if any of the above is the problem will cause more problems. Not sure but you may have, or age may have, stressed a ring. Placing any oil in the cylinders and firing it up without first blowing the excess oil out creates alot of pressure in the cylinder with the plugs in. Better to crank it over by hand and force the oil out with the plugs out first. I hope I'm wrong and it is just running rich but you're describing a lot of smoke here. Sorry but other than that I don't know much about the 250.
Good Luck,
Harry
Good Luck,
Harry
jessebogan
Jedi Knight
Offline
PCV diaphragm? It is possible that after a decade sitting, the rings have stuck.Some people have had luck running a quart of ATF in the sump (along with 4 quarts of high detergent oil) and running the car for a while to see if the detergent action will help unstick the rings. Also, check that the brake master cylinder is not being emptied thru the booster and vacuum hose.
vettedog72
Jedi Knight
Offline
Sounds like ring crud.
Get some Marvel Mystery oil or any "upper cylinder" "lube", "cleaner". Remove all the spark plugs and put the cleaner/lub in through the spark plug holes. How much? Enough to puddle on the top of the piston. (Don't put the plugs in and crank the starter!) Put additional applications of the lub/cleaner in the spark plug holes each day for a week. After a week or so, with the plugs OUT, crank the motor over several spins to get any excess residual lub/cleaner out of the cylinders. Drain the oil and replace the filter. Refill the crankcase with 2 quarts of trans mission fluid and bring to operating level with thin, high detergent 10W20 motor oil. Put the spark plugs in and fire it up.
If the rings are stuck, this may loosen them and the smoke, after an initial neighbor annoying burst, should subside. If you are tight on $’s, just use kerosene for the cleaner!
All 18 rings may not initially free up. You can run the motor moderately with the transmission fluid and thin oil in the crankcase for short periods of time. Keep your eye on the oil pressure gauge and if the motor does not obtain minimal oil pressure, switch the motor off, you will have to tear down the motor and replace the rings and bearings.
When you think the rings are free, change the oil and filter using the manufacture’s recommended oil.
Get some Marvel Mystery oil or any "upper cylinder" "lube", "cleaner". Remove all the spark plugs and put the cleaner/lub in through the spark plug holes. How much? Enough to puddle on the top of the piston. (Don't put the plugs in and crank the starter!) Put additional applications of the lub/cleaner in the spark plug holes each day for a week. After a week or so, with the plugs OUT, crank the motor over several spins to get any excess residual lub/cleaner out of the cylinders. Drain the oil and replace the filter. Refill the crankcase with 2 quarts of trans mission fluid and bring to operating level with thin, high detergent 10W20 motor oil. Put the spark plugs in and fire it up.
If the rings are stuck, this may loosen them and the smoke, after an initial neighbor annoying burst, should subside. If you are tight on $’s, just use kerosene for the cleaner!
All 18 rings may not initially free up. You can run the motor moderately with the transmission fluid and thin oil in the crankcase for short periods of time. Keep your eye on the oil pressure gauge and if the motor does not obtain minimal oil pressure, switch the motor off, you will have to tear down the motor and replace the rings and bearings.
When you think the rings are free, change the oil and filter using the manufacture’s recommended oil.
vettedog72
Jedi Knight
Offline
[ QUOTE ]
To my sadness she kept right on smoking' away for 30 plus minutes when we were paid a visit from our local fire department! No joke!
[/ QUOTE ]
Did you find the smoke demon? To answer another one of your questions, the timing generally will not cause smoke in sufficient quantities to make the neighbors call the fire fighters!
To my sadness she kept right on smoking' away for 30 plus minutes when we were paid a visit from our local fire department! No joke!
[/ QUOTE ]
Did you find the smoke demon? To answer another one of your questions, the timing generally will not cause smoke in sufficient quantities to make the neighbors call the fire fighters!
bluemiata90
Jedi Trainee
Offline
Is it blue smoke or white smoke?. Blue smoke is oil burning and I would agree with vettedog, try and free up the oil rings by using some additives. If it's white smoke, that is usually steam and might be the headgasket. If blue smoke, after you try the additives with the plugs out, I'd try seafoam in the oil. I've cleaned up several engines that had stuck rings with seafoam or similiar additives. Good Luck
Hello Dik,
a blown head gasket wouldn't give a smooth idle and you could have overheating also. White smoke is also due to burning brake fluid if there is a problem with your brake booster. Easily checked by removing the brake vacuum line and plugging the port on the manifold.
Alec
a blown head gasket wouldn't give a smooth idle and you could have overheating also. White smoke is also due to burning brake fluid if there is a problem with your brake booster. Easily checked by removing the brake vacuum line and plugging the port on the manifold.
Alec
First of all i would like to thank all of you for the responses I have gotten and am trying a variety of things that have been suggested thus far.
Here is where I stand with things now. I have performed another compression check with the engine cold and the largest differential between cylinders is 19p.s.i., from 184 to 163 p.s.i.. I am not too worried about the compression right now because if stuck rings are to blame a somewhat large pressure differential between cylinders would make sense. I am fairly certain that the smoke colour is a mixture of oil burning and fuel richness combined judging by the smell and instinct (if that is worth anything). At this point I went out and bought some Marvel Mystery Oil and squirted about a half ounce into each cylinder and turned the engine over several times with the plugs removed of course. It has been several days now and I just turned the engine over some more. What I am going to next is reinstall the plugs and start the engine up to temperature and perform another compression check and add a can of fast motor flush stuff made bt CRC and run it some more. Next I will change the oil and filter and see what I get. P.S. the hose to the brake servo has been disconnected and plugged and the PCV diaphram is new, also, what is seafoam?
Here is where I stand with things now. I have performed another compression check with the engine cold and the largest differential between cylinders is 19p.s.i., from 184 to 163 p.s.i.. I am not too worried about the compression right now because if stuck rings are to blame a somewhat large pressure differential between cylinders would make sense. I am fairly certain that the smoke colour is a mixture of oil burning and fuel richness combined judging by the smell and instinct (if that is worth anything). At this point I went out and bought some Marvel Mystery Oil and squirted about a half ounce into each cylinder and turned the engine over several times with the plugs removed of course. It has been several days now and I just turned the engine over some more. What I am going to next is reinstall the plugs and start the engine up to temperature and perform another compression check and add a can of fast motor flush stuff made bt CRC and run it some more. Next I will change the oil and filter and see what I get. P.S. the hose to the brake servo has been disconnected and plugged and the PCV diaphram is new, also, what is seafoam?