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Can someone please tell me the thread size of the side curtain sockets including the TPI, pitch, diameter, etc, and where I might purchase a die for same?
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Side Curtain Sockets
- Thread starter Michael Oritt
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OP
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My goal has been and continues to take the "wobbliness" out of the side curtains which results from having the unthreaded pins drop-fit into the unthreaded sockets and to give as good a weather seal as possible.
To that end, several years ago I had a machinist make four brackets to replace the stock-style brackets which came with the NICAL side curtains. The new brackets are machined out of a solid billet of AL. They are about 5/16" thick and are much stiffer than what came with the curtains. I attach them to the curtain frames with SS machine screws and nuts so the brackets are firmly mounted to the side curtain frames.
Instead of having fixed pins on the lower leg of the brackets they are drilled to receive chrome plated button-head M10x1.50 screws about 1-3/4" long which pass through the brackets. I picked that size because the OD of the screws is just a bit larger than the smooth interior of the stock sockets. I was able to use the screws as taps, and with a bit of machine oil and gentle hand I threaded the socket interiors and I can screw the curtains down onto the sockets with a T-handle and largely eliminate the wobble that was inherent with the stock system where smooth pins simply dropped into the smooth sockets. The screws are loosely retained in the brackets with rubber washers slid up onto the shank and under the brackets which keeps them from falling out when I store the curtains, and also provide a bit of protection against scratching the top surface of the sockets.
Initially everything was very good but over several years' use two of the four sockets--which are threaded into the wooden blocks--have become loose because of wear in the wooden blocks' thread and I can no longer draw the button head screws tight without the sockets rotating in the blocks, etc.
I have a couple of solutions in mind but all involve getting the sockets firmly attached to the car. The easiest would involve replacing the wood blocks with metal ones fixed to the doors' interiors with holes tapped to screw the sockets into (which would preserve the eccentric adjustment the sockets furnish) but in any case I need to know what is the thread on the sockets. The set of dies I have are not of sufficient diameter to accommodate the exterior of the sockets for sizing and in any case I doubt that the thread is either SAE or Metric.
I hope this long explanation explains my problem and thanks for your interest. BTW I will post pics, hopefully tomorrow, of the brackets and fasteners. I have no pride of authorship and hereby waive all rights and release the concept to any other semi-compulsive owner of any side-curtain-equipped vehicle.
To that end, several years ago I had a machinist make four brackets to replace the stock-style brackets which came with the NICAL side curtains. The new brackets are machined out of a solid billet of AL. They are about 5/16" thick and are much stiffer than what came with the curtains. I attach them to the curtain frames with SS machine screws and nuts so the brackets are firmly mounted to the side curtain frames.
Instead of having fixed pins on the lower leg of the brackets they are drilled to receive chrome plated button-head M10x1.50 screws about 1-3/4" long which pass through the brackets. I picked that size because the OD of the screws is just a bit larger than the smooth interior of the stock sockets. I was able to use the screws as taps, and with a bit of machine oil and gentle hand I threaded the socket interiors and I can screw the curtains down onto the sockets with a T-handle and largely eliminate the wobble that was inherent with the stock system where smooth pins simply dropped into the smooth sockets. The screws are loosely retained in the brackets with rubber washers slid up onto the shank and under the brackets which keeps them from falling out when I store the curtains, and also provide a bit of protection against scratching the top surface of the sockets.
Initially everything was very good but over several years' use two of the four sockets--which are threaded into the wooden blocks--have become loose because of wear in the wooden blocks' thread and I can no longer draw the button head screws tight without the sockets rotating in the blocks, etc.
I have a couple of solutions in mind but all involve getting the sockets firmly attached to the car. The easiest would involve replacing the wood blocks with metal ones fixed to the doors' interiors with holes tapped to screw the sockets into (which would preserve the eccentric adjustment the sockets furnish) but in any case I need to know what is the thread on the sockets. The set of dies I have are not of sufficient diameter to accommodate the exterior of the sockets for sizing and in any case I doubt that the thread is either SAE or Metric.
I hope this long explanation explains my problem and thanks for your interest. BTW I will post pics, hopefully tomorrow, of the brackets and fasteners. I have no pride of authorship and hereby waive all rights and release the concept to any other semi-compulsive owner of any side-curtain-equipped vehicle.
Healey Nut
Luke Skywalker
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So I have a pair of new reproduction side screen sockets that I haven’t yet installed on the little rally car . Haven’t got round to restoring the side screens and have to pluck up courage to drill the painted aluminum doors .
So here’s the measurements .
1/2“OD thread , 20tpi and also 1.25 pitch looks very close . A new 1/2” fine thread nut screwed onto the threaded section no problem but there was a tad of slack/wobble so I’m not convinced it’s actually fine thread .
See pics .
So here’s the measurements .
1/2“OD thread , 20tpi and also 1.25 pitch looks very close . A new 1/2” fine thread nut screwed onto the threaded section no problem but there was a tad of slack/wobble so I’m not convinced it’s actually fine thread .
See pics .
Attachments
OP
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HN--
Great info, thanks so much.
I will pick up a 1/2" ID fine thread nut tomorrow and see how it feels on a brand new side curtain socket. Even if there is a bit of wobble I could possibly eliminate or reduce it with some thread locker or something stronger--or maybe use a nyloc nut. Because there is adjustment in the side curtain mounts I can live without the ability to rotate the socket in the door and simply thread and lock the sockets to the nuts by removing the door interior panel and knocking out the wooden blocks altogether.
More info and pics tomorrow hopefully.
Great info, thanks so much.
I will pick up a 1/2" ID fine thread nut tomorrow and see how it feels on a brand new side curtain socket. Even if there is a bit of wobble I could possibly eliminate or reduce it with some thread locker or something stronger--or maybe use a nyloc nut. Because there is adjustment in the side curtain mounts I can live without the ability to rotate the socket in the door and simply thread and lock the sockets to the nuts by removing the door interior panel and knocking out the wooden blocks altogether.
More info and pics tomorrow hopefully.
Healey Nut
Luke Skywalker
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A nyloc nut would be a good choice or possibly a couple of turns of thread tape to take up any slack in the thread .
I would be wary of using any kind of thread lock in case you want to remove them .
The slack I had in the nut/thread was minor but it’s not a structural piece and doesn’t need to be torqued to xxx lbs .
I would be wary of using any kind of thread lock in case you want to remove them .
The slack I had in the nut/thread was minor but it’s not a structural piece and doesn’t need to be torqued to xxx lbs .
OP
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I did not have much luck today in finding a nut that would thread onto the side curtain socket. Perhaps the sockets have been made in more than one size or the ones that I bought from Moss are not standard, but the nut that gave the best fit was an SAE 5/8"-18 nylock. However, I could only get the nut started onto the socket if I inverted it so that the nyloc portion was engaged first, and once I ran into the metal portion of the nut it would go no further.
Since today's forecast was for rain I decided to mount the side curtains and managed to get enough purchase on the worn blocks on the passenger side to draw down the side curtain sufficiently--See attached photos which the BCF software has inverted for some reason. But it is back to the drawing board and I am thinking about replacing the sockets with some SS oval plates which would fasten to the doors' exterior surface via a couple of small screws and have welded to them 1-2" long threaded tubes into which the button heads would go.
Since today's forecast was for rain I decided to mount the side curtains and managed to get enough purchase on the worn blocks on the passenger side to draw down the side curtain sufficiently--See attached photos which the BCF software has inverted for some reason. But it is back to the drawing board and I am thinking about replacing the sockets with some SS oval plates which would fasten to the doors' exterior surface via a couple of small screws and have welded to them 1-2" long threaded tubes into which the button heads would go.
Attachments
Healey Nut
Luke Skywalker
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OP
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HN--
That explains it as the sockets I bought from Moss were for a 4-cylinder car. In any case there's no problem as I think I have come up with a better and more elegant solution which will better compliment the brackets I have fitted.
I'll post as things develop....
That explains it as the sockets I bought from Moss were for a 4-cylinder car. In any case there's no problem as I think I have come up with a better and more elegant solution which will better compliment the brackets I have fitted.
I'll post as things develop....
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Can you use the 6-cylinder sockets? They have a nut on the inside to hold them tight, and the tops look similar.
OP
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John--
This from the Moss catalogue:
Thanks for the tip--I've ordered one set. If they work I'll probably replace them all around assuming I can eliminate the wood blocks without destroying the doors.
Last edited:
OP
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John--John--
This from the Moss catalogue:
Thanks for the tip--I've ordered one set. If they work I'll probably replace them all around assuming I can eliminate the wood blocks without destroying the doors.
Your suggestion worked perfectly! I ran a 5/16" coarse tap through the new socket to accommodate the thread of the button head screws shown in the earlier pictures, removed the wood block and installed the socket, nutting it from inside the door. I have three more of the sockets on order from Moss.
Thank you so much!
OP
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After getting three more of the 6-cylinder sockets I tapped them as per my last post and removed the rear socket of the same door but was unable to drive out the rear wooden block with a drift and mallet. I cannot see anything that holds it in place beyond the socket nor does the diagram in the Moss catalogue show any fasteners, etc. (> Doors & Fittings 100-4 <).
Any suggestions?
Any suggestions?
OP
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I removed the cockpit rail today and found two slotted wood screws which were concealed by it. Once they came out so did the block.