General TR Short Wheel Studs for Wire Wheels--Replacing

[KVH]

It seems easy to replace the studs with longer ones in the front hubs, but what about the rear hubs? How do I get those out? Do I recall hearing someone say don't even try? I recall someone saying the hubs had to be pulled off and they started bending. No?

Also, I assume longer wheel studs with wheel spacers for wire wheels is a good way to go assuming the studs come out. Is that right?

 

[TR4nut]

If you have an IRS 4a it should be easy just like the front hubs - just tap out. Straight axle 4As just like TR4s and TR3s have threaded and peened rear studs so take a bit more work.

 

[KVH]

If you have an IRS 4a it should be easy just like the front hubs - just tap out. Straight axle 4As just like TR4s and TR3s have threaded and peened rear studs so take a bit more work.

OK, but in a non-IRS, or a live axle, are they pressed out, hammered out, tapped out, or what? And are the rear hubs left on the car intact? What's the procedure? thx

 

[TR3driver]

The rear studs are threaded into the hub from the face, then peened over on the back (kind of like spreading a rivet) to lock them in place. So the general procedure is to grind away as much of the peened portion as possible (without cutting into the hub too much), then use doubled nuts to unscrew the stud as far as possible. Then you turn it back in, and grind away some more from the back. Lather, rinse and repeat, repeat, repeat.

I've heard people say they were able to do this on the car, but I would undo the 6 bolts and pull the shaft out for better access.

Spacers should be OK if you aren't going racing on wire wheels. Lots of folks use them.

 

[Andrew Mace]

It seems easy to replace the studs with longer ones in the front hubs, but what about the rear hubs? How do I get those out? Do I recall hearing someone say don't even try? I recall someone saying the hubs had to be pulled off and they started bending. No?

Also, I assume longer wheel studs with wheel spacers for wire wheels is a good way to go assuming the studs come out. Is that right?

Do you need to replace the studs for some reason, such as either damage to same or desire to fit something other than wire wheels? If so, fine. Otherwise, yes, it's fine to fit longer studs and then use spacers for the wire wheel adapters IF your desire is to be able to switch back and forth between wires and alloy or original steel wheels.

 

[bobhustead]

Aren't the wire studs shorter in the first place and the adapters attached with those lug nuts that are tapered both sides? Maybe I didn't understand which way orig. poster is going.
Bob

 

[TR3driver]

Right. The studs are normally shorter for use with the wire wheel adapters (which also take special nuts).

I assume from his post that the OP already has wires, but wants to be able to use either wire or solid wheels. So he wants longer studs for the solid wheels (and big nuts). Then the spacers will allow him to switch back to wires when he wants (like maybe for a show) without having to cut the studs.

 

[Geo Hahn]

I have pondered removing the peening (angle grinder perhaps?) and double nutting the studs to extract - but haven't tried it.

If you do find you need to separate the hub we could have a go at it with this bad boy:

I've got plenty of air though borrowing a ¾" drive impact wrench and a 1½" impact socket would be best.

 

[bobhustead]

If you could almost completely grind off the peen, the double nuts might work. I like the puller, but the flex of the wheel flange might defeat your efforts. let us know.
Bob

 

[richie]

With the chatter on the internet I was dreading doing this project a few years ago. I'd like to report that with mine, grinding them was easily done and some even didn't even require 2 nuts they became so easy to thread out (soaked in liquid penetrant of course).

Don't fear this project! I was able to convert my rear studs easily to go from wire wheel adapters to regular length studs! Good luck

 

[KVH]

With the chatter on the internet I was dreading doing this project a few years ago. I'd like to report that with mine, grinding them was easily done and some even didn't even require 2 nuts they became so easy to thread out (soaked in liquid penetrant of course).

Don't fear this project! I was able to convert my rear studs easily to go from wire wheel adapters to regular length studs! Good luck

Did you remove the axles and then put the hubs on a bench to grind off the peen? Assuming that's possible. Or, can you grind away while the hubs are on the car?

 

[richie]

Did you remove the axles and then put the hubs on a bench to grind off the peen? Assuming that's possible. Or, can you grind away while the hubs are on the car?

I did it on the car. There's enough room to sneak under the car and you can see the mushroomed or "peened" stud edges. Get an angle grinder in there and grind until flat, rotate the hub and go to the next stud! Was remarkably simple! The hardest part is finding the right angle to fit your grinder with a line of sight!

 

[KVH]

I did it on the car. There's enough room to sneak under the car and you can see the mushroomed or "peened" stud edges. Get an angle grinder in there and grind until flat, rotate the hub and go to the next stud! Was remarkably simple! The hardest part is finding the right angle to fit your grinder with a line of sight!

Of course I have more questions. a) If the original studs are peened, why aren't you required to re-install a stud with the same peening technique. How is safety assured, or how otherwise is the same goal achieved? and b) do I understand that the studs are then screwed out, front to back. In other words, they're not force fitted, but rather screwed in? Is that why the double nut trick is needed? They screw out toward the back? And how do the new ones go in?

 

[richie]

Of course I have more questions. a) If the original studs are peened, why aren't you required to re-install a stud with the same peening technique. How is safety assured, or how otherwise is the same goal achieved? and b) do I understand that the studs are then screwed out, front to back. In other words, they're not force fitted, but rather screwed in? Is that why the double nut trick is needed? They screw out toward the back? And how do the new ones go in?

I used red ("permanent") loctite / thread locker.

 

[KVH]

With the chatter on the internet I was dreading doing this project a few years ago. I'd like to report that with mine, grinding them was easily done and some even didn't even require 2 nuts they became so easy to thread out (soaked in liquid penetrant of course).

Don't fear this project! I was able to convert my rear studs easily to go from wire wheel adapters to regular length studs! Good luck

I'm thinking of abandoning the issue and just using the hub adapters with Loctite on the nuts. Grinding away the peen seems too certain (for me at least) to result in a sloppy marred up rear side of the hub. I just spent an hour working one stud and really got nowhere. There's so little space to work in there, and the studs really seem welded tight to the space over the 50 years of car life. I might bug Geo for his Canley tool and see if that helps make things easier by pulling the hub off the axle, and then I could replace the seal as well. But I'm wondering about the marginal benefit. I've got a nice set of wire wheels, and I also like the Moss knock off sport wheel (though expensive), so it's not as if only a bolt on wheel will work for me. I'll debate it more. I'm just too chicken to mess with those studs and hubs on the car.

 

[M.Vincent]

I'm thinking of abandoning the issue and just using the hub adapters with Loctite on the nuts. Grinding away the peen seems too certain (for me at least) to result in a sloppy marred up rear side of the hub. I just spent an hour working one stud and really got nowhere. There's so little space to work in there, and the studs really seem welded tight to the space over the 50 years of car life. I might bug Geo for his Canley tool and see if that helps make things easier by pulling the hub off the axle, and then I could replace the seal as well. But I'm wondering about the marginal benefit. I've got a nice set of wire wheels, and I also like the Moss knock off sport wheel (though expensive), so it's not as if only a bolt on wheel will work for me. I'll debate it more. I'm just too chicken to mess with those studs and hubs on the car.

Well...I think it may be worth ressurecting this old thread as I recently had an issue with rear wheel studs and can share my experience.
Early TR4 (62) CT10000s...straight axle. This tale starts with "I was in a hurry"....which, sadly, often prefaces many 'adventures' of mine....
I was tweaking the ride height...trying to deal with drivers side sag...and decided to use the impact gun to tighten the wheel nuts...this would save me so much time!..sigh...well, of course I spun a wheel stud. Doh!!...so me and my guru TR buddy started looking at options...the studs on this year of TR are threaded in and peened over as many here have correctly stated. Something that I haven't heard anyone mention though is that these studs thread into the hub until they hit a 'shoulder'. This shoulder on the stud is accessible from the outside...so being that the stud thread and the thread in the hub are both destroyed from being spun...there's no use in ☼☼☼☼☼ footing around to try and 'save' the stud or the wheel nut. We decided to 'machine' cut the nut into pieces and chisel it off the stud...this worked relatively easily. We then began to 'machine' the shoulder of the stud off (by hand with a 5" angle grinder!)...ever so gently (patience being my strongest suit!...not!) When it appeared we had the OD ground down enough we were able to tap what was left of the stud 'in' towards the axle. It fell down into the brake drum and we easily retrieved it. Now...we were left with the barely discernible remains of the threaded hole. Our initial plan was to source a new threaded stud and just weld it in as there was no way to repair the thread other than a heli-coil. So I started snooping at auto parts stores to find a 62' wheel stud....I can still hear the laughing as if it was yesterday....then I thought...surely TRs can't be the only vehicle to use 7/16"-20 studs! I ended getting a stud off a new stud for a 67' Camaro which was the spline/interference fit style. This is where the TR Gods must have to decided that we could use a break! The Camaros stud was just slightly longer than the original TR one...and...had a OD that was slightly larger than the ID of the hole! So...we began drilling out the hole...one bit at a time...slowly increasing drill size until we felt that there was just enough 'meat' left for splines on the new stud to cut into and provide a reasonable interference fit. I believe the last bit we used was a 29/64" but don't quote me on that if you decide to try this procedure...just slowly increase the drill bit size as mentioned above. Anyway...there was room enough to to feed the new stud in from the back. We spun a wheel nut onto it and began to pull it into the hole...(with a ratchet as the impact gun had been banned from the shop...). The stud pulled in really nicely....it took enough force to give one a feeling that it had really 'seated' and the splines had cut as deeply as they could into the hole. The next thing we knew that job was done! We stood there quietly staring at the thing for awhile until declaring...'well that was strangely easy'!..after earlier budgeting in time to pull the axle etc if necessary. My background being welding/fabriction....I couldn't resist and put a couple of tacks on the backside (could just barely get at it with a wirefeed gun). I know this ended up being a long reply (actually my first post...and I'll commit right now to never being so longwinded in the future!) but I'm certain reading this takes a lot less time than some of the other procedures folks have attempted. I hope this helps someone! It would be gratifying to hear from you if it did! Good luck to all!

 

[DrEntropy]

I couldn't resist and put a couple of tacks on the backside (could just barely get at it with a wirefeed gun).

Probably overkill, broaching the stud in was likely good enough. But, hey, as a guy once told me: "It'll only fall off ONCE!"

And welcome to the BCF!

 

[2002S2000]

Great read M.Vincent! I haven't worked in this area so no feedback per se but a writeup like yours is a terrific resource.

Thank you.