Seat Back on BJ8

[Lotuswins]

Hello all,

I'm starting to disassemble the interior bits for reconditioning, and ran across a botched repair on the rear seat panel, the frame and panel that bolts to the body and holds the fold down cushion/tray. Anyways, someone apparently replaced the panel and tried to put 4 speakers in, then removed them. What was the original panel and frame made up of? 1/4 inch plywood and a spruce wood surround? Were the joints glued and screwed? or?? I was thinking of replacing the surround with oak, and put in 1/4 inch, good quality plywood to strengthen things up a bit, especially where the hinge screws went in. And then there are two sheet metal reinforcements on the bottom corners, were they original or has someone attempted to keep the corners square?

Thanks for any help on the subject!! And if anyone has the video for the interior replacement they would like to sell, please contact me off list. Moss wants $70 for the thing now, which is a bit much.

Jerry Rude
BJ8 41423

 

[Patrick67BJ8]

Hello all,

I'm starting to disassemble the interior bits for reconditioning, and ran across a botched repair on the rear seat panel, the frame and panel that bolts to the body and holds the fold down cushion/tray. Anyways, someone apparently replaced the panel and tried to put 4 speakers in, then removed them. What was the original panel and frame made up of? 1/4 inch plywood and a spruce wood surround? Were the joints glued and screwed? or?? I was thinking of replacing the surround with oak, and put in 1/4 inch, good quality plywood to strengthen things up a bit, especially where the hinge screws went in. And then there are two sheet metal reinforcements on the bottom corners, were they original or has someone attempted to keep the corners square?

Thanks for any help on the subject!! And if anyone has the video for the interior replacement they would like to sell, please contact me off list. Moss wants $70 for the thing now, which is a bit much.

Jerry Rude
BJ8 41423

I believe the panel was produced in a marine plywood about 1/8" thick. I recell seeing somewhere that individual panel assemblies, non-fabric covered, are available.

 

[Lotuswins]

Thanks Patrick,

I tore down the rear seat back yesterday, and confirmed your comment that the folding down sections appear to be marine ply, 3/8 thick, about 5 layers of wood. The back panel though is 1/8 in masonite, and the borders that this is screwed to are oak. None of the pieces of oak are glued together, the whole assembly is screwed. Interesting. I will need to find some 1 inch oak to replace the bottom piece, and one side piece and some marine ply and masonite. I know the marine ply is very expensive since I used some on my trailer a few years ago.

Still need the Moss video if anyone wants to part with it....g.rude@q.com

thanks, jerry

 

[Patrick67BJ8]

Thanks Patrick,

I tore down the rear seat back yesterday, and confirmed your comment that the folding down sections appear to be marine ply, 3/8 thick, about 5 layers of wood. The back panel though is 1/8 in masonite, and the borders that this is screwed to are oak. None of the pieces of oak are glued together, the whole assembly is screwed. Interesting. I will need to find some 1 inch oak to replace the bottom piece, and one side piece and some marine ply and masonite. I know the marine ply is very expensive since I used some on my trailer a few years ago.

Still need the Moss video if anyone wants to part with it....g.rude@q.com

thanks, jerry

You can buy the materials you need from the specialty lumber places(not Home ipmrovement types of stores), but you will be probably be buying a full 48"x96" sheet. Birch(similar to Marine plywood, can be obtained in 1/8" thickness, etc. When it's all done, you may find that it might cost you more doing it yourself than buying the premade wood pieces and you may not be thrilled with the quality. I think "Autowood" has the pieces available. The side and bottom pieces would probably be best cut with a router.

 

[Lotuswins]

Thanks again Patrick, you are probably right about the costs of me doing it or just buying the pieces....www.austinhealeywood.com has the parts, and very reasonable from what I see. I'll keep that in mind for sure.... Jerry

 

[RAC68]

I may be a little more frugal than most or just that I enjoy creating my own Healey solutions but paying $600 for a couple pieces of hidden wood is something I would never consider. First, the wood frame is relatively easy to recreate and the backing is not masonite (although a good choice) but leather-grain embossed cardboard. Since the frame is covered with vinyl and the fold-down is upholstered on one side and carpeted on the other, even if you choose the most accurate materials you could find, the wood will be totally hidden and only you would know.

If it were me, I would do it myself and come as close to practical in choosing the hidden components while focusing most of my attention on those elements that are obvious (upholstery, vinyl, and carpet) for accuracy. I believe the hinges are not uncommon and available separately if you need them. Use as much as you can of the original components as patterns or components.

I hope this helped,
Ray (64BJ8P1)

 

[Jerry]

The steel piece that for the support for the open platform (ie; closest to the front seats when the platform is down) is too week and needs to be beefed up if you are planning a total teardown. Plan on thicker material when you cut the ply.

Jerry
all pieces replaced due to rot.

 

[Lotuswins]

Jerry,

Did you mean the thickness of the ply should be increased to 1/2 or better? or the steel corner sheetmetal should be thickened? I assume the pieces flex too much? or screws pull out?

Thanks for the tip!

jerry rude

 

[RAC68]

Jerry R,

I am presuming but I believe Jerry is referring to the metal edging on the leading edge of the platform.

I would not increase the plywood of the platform for concern that it will not fold correctly when upholstered or rest correctly when extended. Also, the platform is supported by a pair of slides supported by thin plywood inside rear panels that could easily be deformed if too much weight was placed on the open platform.

My opinion.

Ray (64BJ8P1)

 

[Patrick67BJ8]

Jerry R,

I am presuming but I believe Jerry is referring to the metal edging on the leading edge of the platform.

I would not increase the plywood of the platform for concern that it will not fold correctly when upholstered or rest correctly when extended. Also, the platform is supported by a pair of slides supported by thin plywood inside rear panels that could easily be deformed if too much weight was placed on the open platform.

My opinion.

Ray (64BJ8P1)

I agree. IMHO, They were built that way for a good reason and keeping them "dry" is the secret to longevity and looking great. I tried different methods of repairs about 30 years ago using thicker and stronger wood but was less than enthusiastic with the results.

 

[Lotuswins]

Patrick/Ray,

I wasn't referring to the perimeter sheet metal...but there are two corner pieces, approximately 3 x 4 inches and maybe .040 thick galvanized that tie the corners together. But upon reviewing the pictures, they are on the back panel, not the fold out panel....so no steel on the fold out other than the perimeter 'package tray' metal. and yes, if the fold out ply was made thicker, the whole fitment of the fold out would be jepordized. I guess one could make the perimeter metal thicker, maybe .060, which would stiffen up the tray. Hmm, or one could inlay a piece of angle iron under that piece...that might be something to consider. You could make it invisible. I know that my furthest forward tray was bowed, and it kind a popped when folded out...and the perimeter metal was wavy due the tray being flexed down many times.

jerry

 

[Legal Bill]

The fixed back panel has a four piece frame that is not made of oak (at leat not on mine) but rather spruce or ash. I had to replace two of the four pieces and I made them myself. I also replaced the flat panel at the same time. I used plywood rather than masonite. No one will see it when covered. If you are making this yourself, be careful to measure everything four or five times af four or five locations. This frame has to fit tight between the interior panels and then the sear back has to fit into it. So borht the inside and outside dimensions are critical.

 

[Lotuswins]

Legal Bill,

Thanks for the suggestions. Well, I bit the bullet and bought some wood and spent yesterday and today reproducing what was in my car.....well I got just about everything done, and assembled but am having a problem. The seat back folds into the back, but stands proud on the top due to the forward piece hitting the bottom, and threatening to pull the rear most hinges out.

Would you, or anyone else, be able to confirm the dimensions of the foldout pieces?? Mine are:

Front: 36 3/8 x 8 5/8
Rear: 36 x 8 5/16

Thanks for any help. Jerry

 

[RAC68]

Jerry,

If I remember correctly, the offset and extra space is provided by the way the hinges are mounted. They are mounted on the package shelf under the upholstery and offset to provide the necessary set-back to place the folded panels into the enclosure. The hinges are also mounted to extend from the panel and provide the necessary space to clear the bottom transverse member of the seat back frame.

I hope this helps,
Ray (64BJ8P1)

 

[Lotuswins]

Hi Ray,

Thanks, yes that helps. I have fiddled with the position of the hinges on the panels, and figure I can gain maybe 1/8 inch by moving one set of hinges out a little. The tee nuts are on the outside, attaching the hinges for the screws nearest the hinge pins. This limits how far out I can move the hinges. I figure I need at least 1/4 inch or better, as I fear when upholstered, it may need more.

I was hoping to remake the rear of the fold out panels, widening it so they are both the same width.

Also, I forgot to mention, the original bits had the screws pulled out of the oak bottom piece of the part that bolts down to the sheetmetal. So this was a problem with the last upholstry install I suspect.

Jerry

 

[Lotuswins]

Okay, I think I finally figured out the problem. The bottom of the vertical piece, that the shelf folds into, and which the hinges screw into and bolts to the body has a angle cut on the rear portion. At least the one that came with my car does. The rear masonite piece screwed to the angle surface, causing the whole vertical assembly to tilt slightly towards the rear of the car. This caused the hinges to sit lower, and at an angle. After much thought, I cut the angle off, making that surface square so the rear masonite now is perpendicular to it, and the side pieces now align with the bottom piece. Also, the hinges now sit higher and the panels fold into the back very nicely. I don't know how the original assembly even worked, or if someone had simply made a botch of replacing it in the past, but I doubt that. I have known the car since about 1977, and no work like this was done by the owner.

Bottom line is it all aligns now, fits in the car nicely and I'm just about done with it. All remaining is to coat all the wood with some polyurathane to seal out the moisture, and sand and paint the perimeter sheet metal for the forward fold out panel.

Thanks for all the help!!

Jerry Rude
BJ8
Lotus Europa TCS 'Gwenhwyvar'

 

[RAC68]

Hi Jerry,

Good observation. You mentioned sealing the wood. Are you going to cover the wood in the vinyl of your car?

I have found that when covering the wood using contact cement, over time, the vinyl will shrink from the edges of the angled top of the frame’s verticals. This should be the only part of the frame to encounter this problem as the main edges of the vinyl are held in place wotj the attachment of the center panel.

In the late ‘60s, to eliminate this issue, I made 2 small caps from thin aluminum to go over the top of just the angled portion of the verticals. I still have them installed and, since I made them in the late ‘60s, I guess they could be considered period add-ons.

All the best,
Ray