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Satellite Shot Down!

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bugimike said:
The part that I find incredulous NOW is that Secretary Gates is offering some of the technology used to the Ruskies and the Chinese!!!!! Did the riccocheting pieces hit our own foot????? /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wall.gif
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I saw that too and ain't that all that comfy with the notion of giving anything to the Chinese or the Ruskies either.

But in a way this "gesture" on our part doesn’t seem to be the actions of an aggressive nation flexing it’s mussels as those two governments have suggested.
 
And you can rest assured that we are not giving away any technology that is critial or proprietary.
 
I believe that to be true. But the notion of giving them anything seems ridiculous to me.

Heck if’n I was in charge – I wouldn’t even give them the blue prints to the Norton Bombsight off of an old B-17. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif
 
I get nostalgic.

When I was but a teenager, mutually assured destruction kept everyone scared enough not to kill each other. However, it was the much derided and ridiculed Star Wars that nudged us from a cold stalemate to a clear victory.

Nope, that'll never work. All our brightest and best journalists told us so.
 
There's likely to be nothing but a light dusting of aluminum oxide from what's left of that thing after that whacking. I'd be stunned if anything larger than a pea is left. All will be subject to re-entry velocity high enuff to vaporize to dust. I kinda think Skylab was what prompted this latest effort.
 
DrEntropy said:
There's likely to be nothing but a light dusting of aluminum oxide from what's left of that thing after that whacking. I'd be stunned if anything larger than a pea is left. All will be subject to re-entry velocity high enuff to vaporize to dust. I kinda think Skylab was what prompted this latest effort.
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+1!

Yup, the smaller the pieces the better chance nothing will survive re-entry.

Still - it was an amazing shot!
 
Don't take this question the wrong way. I'm just curious; not making a statement. I am devoutly apolitical.

How did the hydrazine burn in outer space where there is no oxygen? Was liquid oxygen carried on board the satellite, and did it's tank rupture also, allowing it to combine with the hydrazine to make the fireball?
 
Twosheds said:
Don't take this question the wrong way. I'm just curious; not making a statement. I am devoutly apolitical.

How did the hydrazine burn in outer space where there is no oxygen? Was liquid oxygen carried on board the satellite, and did it's tank rupture also, allowing it to combine with the hydrazine to make the fireball?
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Good question. While I dan't explain how – I’ll take a stab at it.

In the video there is a clear explosion (fireball) and a vapor cloud that followed. This seemed like a logical result of the missile impacting the Satellite.

If you’ve ever watched the booster separation of multi-staged rockets in space, you can actually see residual flames & glowing embers trailing the separation. So it seems to me that if get something hot enough (say from a high velocity kinetic impact of two objects. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif ) you’re going to have massive amounts of heat generated.

So again it seems logical that a lot of stuff was vaporized on impact in this case and (as Doc said) anything that survived will surely be burnt up during it’s re-entry.
 
Twosheds said:
...How did the hydrazine burn in outer space where there is no oxygen? Was liquid oxygen carried on board the satellite, and did it's tank rupture also, allowing it to combine with the hydrazine to make the fireball?
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Hydrazine does not need oxygen for combustion. It will breakdown by being passed over a catalyst or when combined with an oxidizing agent. If the satellite used the later method, when the tanks were ruptured the two would combine and kaboom, it's over.
 
Thanks, Ray.

I called my friend Mike The Rocket Scientist at an undisclosed location and he said that, for sustained combustion in outer space, hydrazine must be mixed with an oxidizer. The oxydizer must have been present on the satellite. Something perchlorate?

Something jogged my memory. Isn't C-stoff and T-stoff hydrazine hydrate and potassium perchlorate or something? I had a dream last night about an ME-163 taxiing up to the fuel pumps and the pilot asking for a fill-up of C-stoff and T-stoff. Don't remember how he could have taxiied on that skid, though. But it was a dream O.K.?

Looked it up:

C-stoff was hydrazine hydrate/methanol, the fuel.

T-stoff was hydrogen peroxide, the oxydizer.
 
lawguy said:
Nope, that'll never work. All our brightest and best journalists told us so.
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Well, ahhh, ummm, nope, not gonna go there /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif
 
Basil said:
lawguy said:
Nope, that'll never work. All our brightest and best journalists told us so.
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Well, ahhh, ummm, nope, not gonna go there /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif
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<<SNORT!>> You n me both Basil! /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif
 
Bret said:
Basil said:
lawguy said:
Nope, that'll never work. All our brightest and best journalists told us so.
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Well, ahhh, ummm, nope, not gonna go there /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif
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<<SNORT!>> You n me both Basil! /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif
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I was clearly baiting...and i couldn't get a bite...except from myself-

That is what you get when reporters use those politically opposed to the program for their source of scientific knowledge...and they really don't want to know or report differently.

To bring it back to present day...and away from politics, the lack of scientific knowledge surrounding the reporting of the satellite shoot down is astounding. Apparently many reporters never heard of, and never bothered to find out about kinetic energy weapons. They all seem astounded that this "dummy" warhead could bring down the satellite. there's a dummy in the vicinity...but it ain't the warhead.
 
James said:
They all seem astounded that this "dummy" warhead could bring down the satellite. there's a dummy in the vicinity...but it ain't the warhead.
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It's on account of all that pesky "science" stuff... that "velocity" and "mass" relationship business. Writing for a living shouldn't mean having to actually LEARN about the particular subject, should it? After all, they have so many "expert sources" to count on.

:devilgrin:
 
I seem to be doin' that a bit lately. :wink:
 
feh. Old horse, new trick.

Can I use th' word ~FETCH~ now? :smirk:
 
DrEntropy said:
feh. Old horse, new trick.

Can I use th' word ~FETCH~ now? :smirk:
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No..that's ModSecurity - part of the Apachie server, nothing to do with the forum software.
 
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