Old Paint/New Paint

[healeygal]

A while back Basil inquired about pictures of my car's new paint job. Having a web page that escaped and is floating around in cyberspace somewhere, and not knowing exactly how to get in touch with it, I haven't been able to post anything until now. Thanks to John Loftus for putting my Healey's pictures on his webspace so I could link to them. Here goes:

Before - Two Years Ago at Tahoe

Primer - Summer 2004

New Paint - Late Summer 2004

Carmel - October 2004

Wow, I think it worked. Thanks again, John.

Sharon and her
Happy Healey Hundred

 

[Keoke]

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/savewave.gif
HI HG, The car looks great---Keoke /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yesnod.gif

 

[Dave Russell]

Hi Sharon,
I really didn't think that it looked so bad before. It looks really first class now. I guess you found out, whole lot of work & money to do the project, but worth every penny for a good job. Congratulations,
D

 

[tahoe healey]

Wow! I saw your 100 haee in Tahoe last June. I can see the difference. Who did the work I may be in the market soon. Did you strip the chrom from the car or did they? Can I ask what you paid? It looks great. I look forward to see her in person at a gathering next summer.

 

[PC]

Hey Sharon,

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif

 

[healeygal]

Keoke and PC,
Hi and thanks!

Hi Dave,
No, the car didn't look too bad in pictures thanks to all the Meguiars products I've invested in, but in the last year, up close and in person, paint was starting to flake off the bonnet, and the paint covering some bondo (ugh!) on the front shroud was starting to lift and chip. This was in addition to the streaking on the bootlid caused by the can of clearcoat-like glaze I've saved for ten+ years and applied one too many times (I don't think they sell that stuff any more), not to mention the grid pattern in a couple of places left by the reinforced duct tape I'd used to secure a tarp to keep out the rain a couple of winters that I didn't have a garage for her.

What really made me decide to get the paint job was the fact that the rear passenger taillight was slightly tweaked. It had been that way since I got the car, and that always bugged me. There was no obvious dent or damage, but that taillight faced slightly more to the right than it should, giving the car a "cockeyed" look from the rear. I finally decided it was time to get her done up right - that, and the fact the Charlie Hart, who owns my favorite metallic blue Healey, gave me the name of the body shop that did the work on his car.

Which leads me to Tahoe Healey...

Hi Tahoe,
I had the work done by Dagoberto (Dago) Bustos at Gold Star Body Shop, 700 Mountain View Avenue, Unit E in Oxnard, California - (805) 407-3065. Keeping in mind that every job is unique and quoted separately, and to get a proper quote a car would have to be seen in person, and especially keeping in mind that Dago priced it so as to encourage me to go ahead and have the work done (as I recall, he said, "You should have a nice car."), it cost me $4100 total. This was an exterior paint job only. I didn't have, nor did I want the cockpit, undercarriage/frame or engine compartment painted like a lot (many? most?) folks do. I had him put back all the old chrome parts. The only new trim is the fender beading, which, at first, I didn't want, but a couple of people said it would make a big difference over re-installing the old ones. Dago took care of everything - disassembly, bodywork - all the little dings, dogleg repair, tweaked rear taillight, aluminum bootlid repair, installing the splash pan I had kept in my garage for 20+ years - and re-assembly.

There are so many shops to choose from and I had no idea where to start or who has experience and does quality work on aluminum (probably not Earl Scheib), but Dago has worked on a lot of Healeys, about 20 in the last three years. Also, this year and last year, several cars that benefitted from his craftsmanship, including a factory 100M, were auctioned at the Monterey Historics, so I feel pretty fortunate that he worked on my car. And to top it all off, he's a really nice person!

Sharon

 

[JJS]

Hi Sharon,
I have my BN7 at Dagos now. He was highly recommended by Ellery Engel, who had completed all of the major metal work this past summer. Dago is a super guy, he offered to pick up my car (bare chassis and body panels) from Ellery in Piru. Saved me 6 hours and the cost of a rental trailer.

I can also recommend Ellery for any metal work, he took my BN7, which had been hit in the left front before I purchased it, and replaced the left front chassis rail and a bunch of other damaged and tweaked metal. He repaired major damage to the shroud, re-alinged the chassis, replaced outriggers, etc.

Thanks for posting your photos, makes me anxious to start the reassembly of my car!

Joe

 

[John Loftus]

Sharon,

Is it a base/clear coat paint job or single stage (no clear)?

Cheers,
John

 

[Basil]

Ding ding ding! Wow! Looks great! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif

 

[Patton]

Sharon,

Dago did a great job and the car looks wonderful. I have a guy coming to look at mine tommorow, hopefully it will be in the shop for paint in the next 30 days.

Patton

 

[healeygal]

Joe,

I saw your car at Dago's last week when I dropped mine off for it's one-month "checkup" - was wondering who it belonged to! I'm sure it's going to look wonderful when it's done.

John,

I've heard discussions on topics like the old paints, the new paints, clear coat/no clear coat, what's easier to apply, easier to touch up, etc. in the past, but I never paid any attention, because I wasn't planning on having my car painted! Then, this past summer, I got a verbal estimate from Dago (during which time I took no notes). However, realizing this was an opportunity of my Healey's lifetime because Dago had so much experience on Healeys, I took the car in, handed him the keys and told him to paint it. So bottom line, I don't have a clue. Guess I should ask next time I go out there...

Patton,

Way to go! Post pictures when it's done.

By the way, I know you sold your Corvair, but the Fan Belt Toss is next week in Palm Springs. I wrote a letter to Jay Leno inviting him to come since I've seen him at a few car shows in the L.A. area. Last week, he left a message on my answering machine saying he wasn't sure of his schedule yet, but he'd keep me posted. Talk about exciting! He also mentioned he's looking for a Yenko Stinger - don't think there are too many of those around.

Sharon

 

[John Loftus]

[ QUOTE ]
So bottom line, I don't have a clue. Guess I should ask next time I go out there...

[/ QUOTE ]

Sharon,

I'm just curious ... my guess from looking at the pictures is that it is base/clearcoat. Lots of painters like using base/clear systems ... they have been popular for many years, used on modern car finishes and painters like to use the same paint system day after day for reasons of familiarity and economics. Some people say that spot repairing a base/clear paint is more difficult but I'm not so sure. Body shops do it successfully everyday and matching a non-metallic color like yours is easier than metallic. I do think there are some longevity problems with clear coats but mostly due to lack of protection/exposure to years of sun ... things that shouldn't be a problem with the priviliged care that our cars get.

For the record, I did decide to go with a single stage paint system (no clear coat) but that is more in trying to be as original as possible. It's not a concours requirement but just a subtle difference.

At any rate, your car looks great! ... looking forward to seeing it at the next cruise or meet.

Cheers,
John

 

[Keoke]

Hi John, I think unless the owner specifies that they want a two part paint job or you are going to paint the car with a metal flake color a single stage paint will be used. Two stage painting almost amounts to painting the car twice.---Keoke

 

[Patton]

[ QUOTE ]
Patton,

Way to go! Post pictures when it's done.

By the way, I know you sold your Corvair, but the Fan Belt Toss is next week in Palm Springs. I wrote a letter to Jay Leno inviting him to come since I've seen him at a few car shows in the L.A. area. Last week, he left a message on my answering machine saying he wasn't sure of his schedule yet, but he'd keep me posted. Talk about exciting! He also mentioned he's looking for a Yenko Stinger - don't think there are too many of those around.

Sharon

[/ QUOTE ]

Well the paint just about a done deal. Guy is an independent who worked on Healeys while working at another shop. Bugeye friend recommended, and I think we can work out the price, will know tomorrow. This is going to be a better job than I original planned, but still not a 1 ft car.

Melia (my wife) and I finally decided that we do not want the car to go back to the original black, so Pacific Green over Ivory it will be. I have to strip the chrome (except beads), the rest of the interior and the engine out before he picks it up (to save money) and he is going to paint it inside and out along with the body repairs. Anyone want to help me pull my engine? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Rafael Abugattas sent me this picture, and this is what I want it to look like when done,

I hope Leno makes it to the Fan Belt toss. Stingers are neat cars, they are rare and collectible, but can be found. There are still a bunch of guys who race them.

FWIW Tim Allen owns the only original Stinger Convertible, and is a big Corvair fan. They featured Larry Shapiro's gold concourse LM Corvair on Home Improvement. They also featured a A-H 3000 when Tim killed Jill's Nomad!

 

[healeygal]

[ QUOTE ]
Some people say that spot repairing a base/clear paint is more difficult......
I do think there are some longevity problems with clear coats but mostly due to lack of protection/exposure to years of sun....

[/ QUOTE ]

Hi John,

That's it - that's the info I've heard before (when I wasn't paying all that much attention), but as you said, it seems like most shops match colors pretty well these days, and as for fading, even though I like to drive her as much as possible, my car sits at home in the garage a lot!

One observation I've made whenever seeing a lineup of Healeys at a car show is that the paint jobs the cars had when they originally came off the line were probably not as outstandingly gorgeous as the re-paints we see today. Even today's polishes and waxes shined my Healey's old paint job much better than the ones I used when I first got the car. Lot of progress in both areas, I guess. I'm still not used to how the car shines when walking up to her in a parking lot. The old patina is gone. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif But not to worry - same old seats, same old dash, same old bumper...........and on and on.

Patton,

That color combination is beautiful! Good luck with the paint job - hope the time goes by quickly!

Interesting Corvair facts! The next time I see Jay, I'll have to ask him if he's ever ridden in Tim's Yenko Stinger. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif Seriously, sure would be neat if he showed up! Hmm, maybe I should get to work on inviting Tim Allen for next year's Toss...

Sharon

 

[John Loftus]

[ QUOTE ]
Two stage painting almost amounts to painting the car twice.---Keoke

[/ QUOTE ]

Hi Keoke,

That's not what I have heard. With a base coat/clear coat, the color layer can be relatively thin, it actually goes on with a satin finish and the clear brings out the gloss. The clear needs to go on within a short period after the base so it's really more of a material change than 'painting the car twice'(you don't sand or remask between). The overall paint thickness should be about the same with both systems. The clear is expensive so you won't find it being offered on a $1000 paint job but when I went around to talk to painters, almost all of them wanted to paint BC/CC ... even for solid colors.

Cheers,
John

 

[Keoke]

John, All two stage paint jobs I have seen done over the last 15 years at some of the best shops water sand the base coat prior to applying the clear coat, then after curing the clear coat is also water sanded and buffed out.Times and methods can vary I guess but thats my experience. Yes Healey Gal, repairing two part paint damage is quite difficult.---Keoke

 

[John Loftus]

[ QUOTE ]


One observation I've made whenever seeing a lineup of Healeys at a car show is that the paint jobs the cars had when they originally came off the line were probably not as outstandingly gorgeous as the re-paints we see today.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hi Sharon,

I have read that the factory paint jobs were o.k. but nothing spectacular. The exception to this were the cars prepped for the auto shows. The panel gaps were more consistent, much more detailing, etc. (much in the same way that cars are prepped for auto shows today). The paint technology is much higher these days ... everything from the paint materials to the spray equipment. Now that Austin Healeys are classics that are worth quite a bit, it's easy to understand that owners/restorations shops are raising the bar on the finishes to the 'show car' level.

That said, I still love seeing a Healey with a well worn patina, inside and out. I know of one very original, one owner car that is garaged and hasn't been run in 15 years (the owner scared himself one day and just parked it). Not a speck of rust from what I've seen and the paint is dull but otherwise all there. Hopefully, I can convince the owner to sell it to me one of these days. I would just fix the mechanicals and clean it up with ever so much care. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/driving.gif

Cheers,
John

 

[healeygal]

Hi John,

What model Healey is it? Sounds like a very special car, much like the BN2 that local club member George Keens has had (and still drives!) since 1955. His son, Tom, couldn't make the recent Lone Pine Film Festival event, so George recruited an old work buddy, and off they went, with George driving all the way. Hopefully, there'll be an article in the club newsletter.

I really enjoy seeing original, unrestored Healeys at car shows. Mine is so far off from being in original condition (4-speed transmission, later model upholstery pattern, incorrect turn signal lever, Motorola AM radio in the dash, 3 48-spoke wheels/1 60-spoke, etc. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazyeyes.gif), I didn't mind painting her to a shinier-than-original, non-Healey-correct shade of red. Restoring her to original is going to be the next owner's job!

Sharon
BN1 (renewed but not restored)

 

[PC]

John & Keoke,

IIRC you're both right, depending on the particular paint brand, type, formulation, color mix, etc.

OEM factory paints and some (most?) re-spray base coats go on satin and must be topcoated. The satin finish flows out smoothly with no orange-peel. Some, especially metallics, can't be wet-sanded because it will disturb the surface structure and color. The clear coat must be applied for gloss and durability. You are shooting two separate layers but since there is no prep between coats it's the same or less work than shooting multiple coats of a single-stage.

Many re-spay finishes can be used single-stage or topcoated. They can be treated much like traditional paints with wet-sanding between coats.

Paints specifically intended for low-end re-spray work on whole cars are often single-stage because it's faster and you don't have to worry as much about matching. Since two-stage is standard for almost all of today's OEM finishes two-stage is mandatory for panel repairs.

Two-stage systems are good for panel repairs because the original paint is less likely to fade, the clear topcoat helps blend the repair and the clear topcoat will have the same gloss and depth as the original topcoat.

Whether you go single-stage or two-stage on a high-end re-spray will depend on the look you want to achieve and your choice of color and paint type/brand.



Sharon,

You should definitely find out if it's clearcoated. In fact you should find out the exact brand, type, and color code used. This info will be invaluable should you need any repairs in the future.

Clearcoats are less susceptible to Sun fading since the clear layer guards the pigmented layer against UV damage. Unfortunately a clear topcoat is much softer and thinner than a single stage color so they are far more susceptible to mechanical damage like scratches and swirls.

Swirls are especially visible on clearcoated dark non-metallic colors like black and dark blues but are still very obvious on other colors and metallics. I would put red about in the middle.

The way to prevent swirls is by washing and waxing using appropriate techniques, tools and products. Since your paint is new you shouldn't wax it until it's fully cured but you will need to keep it clean.


PC.