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TR4/4A Oil pan removal and replacement

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Chasman3

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I was convinced my rear seal was leaking and it may well be but it was odd that with my car came 2 new oil pan gaskets (higher priced versions). Bolts are not over tightened. Today I discovered why. The pan has a 1” x 10” seam of epoxy in one of the valleys. The defect was painted over. It’s oil moist and the source of my leak. I have a replacement pan coming. What sealer should I use here in USA? Typical I would bond the gasket with Duco or 3M adhesive to the pan but uncertain what to use gasket to block? Lastly worth braising the old pan?

Thanks

Charlie
 
Been a while for me wrenching. But seemed to have heard bad things about silicone base gasket sealer? Also torque 15-16 lbs?
 
I had the same thing happen on an oil pan. Some kids thought they would be funny and lifted my tr3 up by the oil pan with a floor jack to move and hide the car.

It took some time to figure it out why my pan was leaking, and like yours it leak weird at the split in the tin and leaked worse and then better sometimes. Anyways that was some time ago.

I am going to pull my pan on a different tr3 in a few weeks and cannot decide how to approach it. Getting under the car is a big part of the job because for me; I like room. I will lift the car up as high as a dare and use jack-stands and also put the front tires under the car with some blocks on metal wheel center for insurance.

I am actually thinking about non-hardening permatex for a sealer plus I was going to cut my own gasket out of 1/16 think gasket paper. You said you had some gaskets made out of something other than paper? What are they made of?

There should be a lot of old posts about oil pan leaks, and the way people went after them. I will probably use some of their suggestions like put the gasket on the pan and then set the pan down on some glass or was it put the glass on top of the gasket when the gasket is down on the pan with sealer on it and some weight, like 20pounds on the glass.

Steve
 
I keep hoping that Gasket Innovations (Joe Alexander) will make a high-grade TR2/3/4 oil pan gasket as a permanent replacement for the somewhat-weird paper ones that are sold now, and which shrink and distort with time. (Please, please, pretty please....)
 
sp53 said:
I had the same thing happen on an oil pan. Some kids thought they would be funny and lifted my tr3 up by the oil pan with a floor jack to move and hide the car.

It took some time to figure it out why my pan was leaking, and like yours it leak weird at the split in the tin and leaked worse and then better sometimes. Anyways that was some time ago.

I am going to pull my pan on a different tr3 in a few weeks and cannot decide how to approach it. Getting under the car is a big part of the job because for me; I like room. I will lift the car up as high as a dare and use jack-stands and also put the front tires under the car with some blocks on metal wheel center for insurance.

I am actually thinking about non-hardening permatex for a sealer plus I was going to cut my own gasket out of 1/16 think gasket paper. You said you had some gaskets made out of something other than paper? What are they made of?

There should be a lot of old posts about oil pan leaks, and the way people went after them. I will probably use some of their suggestions like put the gasket on the pan and then set the pan down on some glass or was it put the glass on top of the gasket when the gasket is down on the pan with sealer on it and some weight, like 20pounds on the glass.

Steve
Click to expand...
Paper. It came from Moss. I don’t remember the name but higher priced but not necessarily better. But I have 2 new ones. At least on my Tr4, jackstands at 18” gives me plenty of room but I’m not very big at 5’ 11”, 160 pounds. The adhesive quality to me is critical to get a good fast bond of gasket to the pan. Laying on a flat surface like plywood and weighting it is good idea. With Duco or 3M it will bond and dry fast. I bought 3/8” torque wrench which I think is really important. 15-16 lb. And the retaining lip can dimple if someone overtightened. Again flat surface small block and pound the bolt holes if dimples are present. And as “Mad Dog” mentioned check the screening tube while pan is off.

I hope to have new pan by weekend. Will clean, high heat prime and paint first. Install next week.
 
3M is usually the best product. Is the product you are going to use a specific gasket seal for and engine or a seam sealer for body parts? I used some 3M a while back and that stuff was strong, but it hardened too much for me.

Steve
 
sp53 said:
3M is usually the best product. Is the product you are going to use a specific gasket seal for and engine or a seam sealer for body parts? I used some 3M a while back and that stuff was strong, but it hardened too much for me.

Steve
Click to expand...
I’ve used Duco cement when I was out of 3M window and gasket. I use black. I usually prep with wire or brass wheel, steel wool.
 
I am confused by what you refer to as "the valley"? Is that the area over the front and rear bearing caps? There are some areas that are sealed by soaking felt in gasket maker and stuffing it in gaps.
 
So...you have a crack along the sides? If so I would not count on sealer to keep the oil in...the crack will slowly grow with heat cycles. I would weld it. Brazing would be my distant second choice to repair it.
 
CJD said:
So...you have a crack along the sides? If so I would not count on sealer to keep the oil in...the crack will slowly grow with heat cycles. I would weld it. Brazing would be my distant second choice to repair it.
Click to expand...
No I have a crack on the bottom of the pan. It was repaired. It came that way. I’ve owned it since May 29. I discovered the repair yesterday. Thanks.
 
I used flat washers to help keep the pan holes from dimpling.
 

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I finally managed to remove my pan from the car on axle stands; it was black RTV'd on, no gasket. What a nightmare to break loose - that stuff is evil. I'm just going to use a fiber gasket and see that holds up.
 
Dr Evil said:
I finally managed to remove my pan from the car on axle stands; it was black RTV'd on, no gasket. What a nightmare to break loose - that stuff is evil. I'm just going to use a fiber gasket and see that holds up.
Click to expand...
I’m still waiting for my replacement pan. After prep, prime and paint will install. I will use 3m to fix the gasket to the pan. Then some type of gasket sealer between pan and engine block. I haven’t figured out yet what sealer to use?
 
Some advice I picked up from Snowbum for classic BMW motorcycles for the oil pan which I think is worth thinking about (these pans are cast aluminium but still):

"After the pan is known to be flat and without serious nicks (do not nick with your scraping tools!), and all old gasket material is removed from engine and pan surfaces, and the engine surface appears good, and all surfaces cleaned (I use acetone on a rag), I install conventionally, without any sealant.

Do not use any sealant on the gasket surfaces! Gasket writing will usually be upwards. There is a heat activated glue on that surface if the pan gasket was made properly (some are reportedly not). Some reportedly have no such glue on either side. Some have markings on the wrong side. Some have heat-released glue/sealant on both sides. ... Note that if the pan and/or the case is truly in bad-enough condition to warrant a sealant, you may use such as #2 Permatex Form-a-Gasket or some appropriate RTV
Do the tightening in STAGES, in a cross-pattern. That is VERY IMPORTANT! Do one amount of tightening using a cross pattern, then when all 14 bolts are at that tightness, increase the torque slightly and start the criss-cross-pattern tightening again. The idea is to completely avoid 'bunching up' the gasket. Continue until final tightness is reached. "
 
It was never the case that the machining was up to modern standards. The gasket MUST be coated on both sides
with RTV. I prefer super gray permatex(to each pro his own) . Snug first,then tighten,and finally torque to 28 ft lbs.
How was your screen??
Mad dog
 
mctriumph said:
It was never the case that the machining was up to modern standards. The gasket MUST be coated on both sides
with RTV. I prefer super gray permatex(to each pro his own) . Snug first,then tighten,and finally torque to 28 ft lbs.
How was your screen??
Mad dog
Click to expand...
I would agree. Thanks.
 
Doesn’t the workshop manual say 16 of 18ft lbs
This is for the card thin gasket

You can get a cork gasket but you need very little torque for that. Or it crushes and distorts them at workshop manual figures.

You don’t want to strip the threads at either end of the engine where they are into Ali
 
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