TR2/3/3A oil pan leak

[sp53]

Well I pulled the oil pan off my car to try and understand why the pan leaked so soon. I had the pan off last year. Anyways the oil leaked looks like it is coming on the front bridge piece and the back of the engine rear cap. The oil seems to have traveled through the gasket out the other side and turned the gasket to slush as the oil made its way out between the block and the pan mostly at the ends only.

Actually I am surprised the oil pan leaked so much. I had to rip the pan off the engine.


In addition each bolt hole seems to have leaked oil right at the bolt leaving the gasket stuck to the engine and oil pan in a dry condition???
Not sure what to do?? Perhaps I should replace the bolts, but I cannot see how that could make a difference???
I teased the front aluminum bridge piece out and will reinstall without the cork pieces on the end. This time I will use some silicone sealer on the ends of the aluminum bridge.

There are so many different gasket papers. I am not sure what I used last time, and I do not remember cutting the gasket. Whatever the material the gasket paper was made out of I am going to try something different because the paper or whatever it is made out of seems to be broken down.
This time I am thinking 3/32 gasket material from the corner auto parts store then hand cut and use non-hardening permatex.


please, Anyone with a plan share your view

 

[CJD]

It sounds like maybe you are not getting the end caps sealed fully. You should use strips of felt. Remove and fully clean the caps so there is a good surface for the seals. Then, saturate the strips of felt in a gasket sealer/maker. Then, using a small screwdriver or similar tool, start jamming the felt into the cap grooves. Keep jamming as much felt into the grooves until you cannot possibly get any more in, and leave a little felt above the pan face. Allow this to cure overnight. Once cured, use a new scraper blade to cut the felt that was above the block. You now have well-sealed end caps, and can concentrate on getting the pan back on properly.

 

[KVH]

Maybe you did all this, but this is what I do, and it has helped. I still will drip somewhat, but it’s a TR and I have to accept that fact. Like many folks say, if you don’t leak oil, you don’t have any oil. Anyway, here’s my drill:

A) Use a good gasket, maybe 1/32nd to 1/16th, but not the thin scribbler paper thin ones;
B) Make two small steel pieces about two inches long and 3/4 inch wide that fit the inverted lipped-track of the oil pan, one straight, and one slightly curved. Use these pieces to lay under the bolt holes at the edge of a table so you can hit the holes from the top side with a ball peen hammer and flatter them to match the height of the pan lip. The curved piece is obviously for the holes at the corners;
C) After “fixing” the bolt holes, lay the pan upside down on a sheet of glass and slide paper under the pan, looking for irregular bends or gaps. Use clamps and wood to gently bend the pan lips until the paper gets stuck at all points and won’t slide under the lip. Don’t strive for absolute perfection;
D) I then ascertain that the front block seal and rear seal are flush and not impeding proper sealing. Not a problem for me so far;
E) Pick the right gasket sealer. It’s your choice, but I prefer Permatex High Tack. A friend swears by that gray Ford product “Motor” something, but I don’t like it because it binds hard and makes removal a hassle;
F) Using High Tack, I seal the gasket to the pan and let it dry for several hours upside down on a flat surface, maybe the glass again;
G) I then apply High Tack to both the gasket and pan, let dry for 5 minutes, then attach to the engine with new bolts and washers. I look for washers that won’t cut into the steel on the pan (good luck there);
H) I tighten the pan using my judgment. I can’t find the courage to torque those bolts to the recommended torque, as that seems way too high to me and I don’t want to bend up what I just fixed.

Using the above, I’ve cut my leaks down substantially. When I see oil coming from the front drain hole of the transmission, I figure the rear main seal is leaking, and that gives me complete comfort that everything is normal and there’s nothing further for me to do other than pull the engine, replace the rear main seal, and watch it leak again.

 

[sp53]

cleaned the front and back of the engine and took some more pictures. I know what you mean John with the felt. I put a picture of the rear cap and the felt on this time. The felt is oily, but it should be good; I packed tight a few years ago on the rebuild. I think the early unfinished pictures of the front threw you off John.

My thoughts are that the bridge piece ends are not sealing, but why? I just do not trust those cork seals on the ends.

I guess cleaning the bolt holes out well with brake clean and putting sealer on those is all I can do really them.

I took a picture of the front of the engine with the bridge piece out. The bear plate gasket stopped at the top of the bridge piece. I plan to seal the area with RTV (I believe it is called) on both ends and around the front of the bidge piece then bolting it back in carfully with the correct bolts.

yes i know what you mean about the togure secps in the book. Are some in inch pounds and some it foot pownds or some other confusing dea????l

I like different ideas so please give them up

 

[sp53]

When I look at the flywheel in the last picture of the rear crank and see how clean it is, that to me says the rear main is not leaking??? right. I get so upside down under a car sometimes I am not sure. So please let me know what you think about the rear main condition.

thank Steve

 

[KVH]

I wonder what others say, but I’ve always figured the oil from a RMS leak would run down the back of the engine and show from the transmission bell housing drain hole. I’m not sure you’d see oil fouling the flywheel or ring gear. I’ve reached my hand up in that space with the dust cover off and found oil there. But, honestly, yours looks so clean I’m beginning to question where the leak would manifest itself. I can say this: Two years ago I rebuilt another TR4A engine and was so meticulous with the RMS that the notion of a leak occurring would be absurd. Well, it’s absurd alright. It leaks every single day. But not much if I compare it to the gear lube slipping out of my Type A Laycock overdrive (from that side panel cover with a gasket I’ve replaced TWICE).

 

[sp53]

Oh I totally feel your Pain KVH. The ability for a tr3 to leak oil is beyond me also. On this engine I put on of those Mad Max engine rear main seals because I wanted no leaks and this engine leaks worse than the last tr3 engine I rebuilt. The Guy at the parts store once told me the reason the British do not make toasters is they cannot figure out how to make them leak oil.

Not sure but I am convinced kind of sorta antway the rear main seal is not leaking, so the whole rear cap assembly should be doing its job of making a dam at the back of engine so oil does not get past.

The felt strip I would think would seal on the pan gasket and that would be it for oil leaks there, but on this engine the pan gasket by the rear cap was spongy with oil, like some magic contaminate dissolved the gasket. Perhaps John is correct and i did pack the felt enough.


I did notice that some of the bolt holes and gasket hole did not fit well and perhaps the oil ran between the gasket and hit the bolts and started dripping at the bolt.

Thanks for looking at the leaks. This oil stuff should be easier to fix cannot figure it out.

Steve