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Off in another tangent!

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Rut

Rut

Obi Wan
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Reading all the front suspension questions I keep thinking there's got to be a better way! I have my old A arms and king pins and wonder if you could machine the threads out, insert bronze/brass bushings, insert the proper sized grade 8 bolt with bushings/washers on either side of the kingpin and secure it with a lock/castle nut? This is just a basic idea, but the way it's done from the factory really sucks! Thoughts?
Rut
 
Rut,
There are lots of people who have tried to improve on this design. Tubular A Arms, Heim Joints, and all sorts of ideas. You can visit
The Mite.com. If I recall correctly he did some work modifying the front end there are some folks on Sprite Spot.com under suspension section who've done some Suspension Mods. It's all in what you want to spend. I'm now on 3rd Front End rebuild I'm working on. Bugsy 1 got a simple used hardware swap out, Rubber Bushings, Tie Rods, and Sway Bar. I didn't change out Metal Bushings or put in new kingpins. I did add new Peter C shocks at that time. 2nd rebuild I replaced Metal Bushings in the Wishbones, Major Suspension Kit, and found a set of NOS Wheel Bearings. The difference in handling and tracking was like night and day. Bugsy II will receive upgrade to Disc Brakes, Major Suspension Kit, Wishbones sent out and are back from Apple Hydraulics to have new Metal Bushings Brazed in, adding a Sway Bar and installing new Tie Rod ends along with a set of Peter C's best.

Yes you can spend lots of time modifying your BE. The question becomes how much money and engineering time do you want to spend or so you really just want to get out and drive. Bugsy I departed for R.I. and Alan Fisher's House in April. I've been without an LBC to drive all Spring and Summer and know it's going to be a long time before Bugsy II will be ready to get back on the road. Think about that, do you want to tinker or drive. The other aspect is safety. Lots and lots of Sprites and MG's have been on the road for lots of years. Yes the front end on these cars needs to be maintained on a regular basis but when kept properly lubed and based on the amount of miles we put on these cars on an annual basis the BE as designed from the factory will work well and last far beyond our times. We've made them survive this long and kept them to be passed on to the next owner. Time and Money, I'd rather be driving that reinventing the wheel. My two Cents. Others I'm sure have different opinions.
 
Rut
I like your thinking. I am surprised it has not been done before. You will need to find a way to grease your new "fulcrum" pins
Paul
 
I think you'll find insufficient room for a top hat bronze bushing and bolt/pin.
 
I'd love to see some really cost effective improvements that would not only enhance the performance but reduce the wear and tear of components. The original engineers probably never dreamed their designs would still be in use after all these years. With 3D printing and CNC machining becoming more cost effective we may see some real advances in our hobby that could bring about the improvements we desire.
 
Racers, on SCCA under 1000cc class (forgot the letter) spent a fortune on there hobby... How exotic?? Ask Hap, the suspension set ups I've seen have a wow factor. The thing about the little BE is their so darn light, 50-50 weight distribution and when running stock class the screamin 977cc engine similar to the Mini beat the pants off of a small group of qualifiers... When modified, I've seen rears with fully independent strut setup's ... fronts with some of the wildest arm set ups you can imagine. The darn little things are still raced...and a river of money spent to getter just a bit faster on a tight track... This is serious money with serious ego's...haha
 
Oh, if your wondering how respected our cars are...Back when.. Shelby Racing used the BE's as trainers!! I have a picture book to prove it!
 
bug_sixty said:
Racers, on SCCA under 1000cc class (forgot the letter) spent a fortune on there hobby... How exotic?? Ask Hap, the suspension set ups I've seen have a wow factor. The thing about the little BE is their so darn light, 50-50 weight distribution and when running stock class the screamin 977cc engine similar to the Mini beat the pants off of a small group of qualifiers... When modified, I've seen rears with fully independent strut setup's ... fronts with some of the wildest arm set ups you can imagine. The darn little things are still raced...and a river of money spent to getter just a bit faster on a tight track... This is serious money with serious ego's...haha
Click to expand...

Racing is one thing, the street crowd is another. There isn't enough "support" for this kind of development and manufacturing. (not to mention liability issues)

There is a company in the UK that makes an improved A-arm, but I think it's just a stringer version of the original with 2 grease Zerks.


https://www.spridgetwishbone.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=5&Itemid=7
 
Last edited:
I LIKE those, Gerard.
Are you a dealer or just an interested party? Seems Winners Circle or someone in the states sell's the double grease zerk but I believe those have more reinforcement as well. I've replaced the threaded sleeve's in a couple of set's and considered adding a zerk at both end's but figured that unless you plug the fulcrum pin the grease is just going to go where it want's anyway. Hope they are running a different fulcrum pin.

Kurt.
 
No, just something I came across several months ago.
 
To see an extreme, racing version you can click on ~This Link~. There are more photos of this race-car on Curtis's website ~HERE~. Honestly, even most vintage racers just run the regular, standard setup but with an offset upper bushing and a spacer under the lever shock to a increase negative camber. It would be nice to add some caster so that the front end would work better with modern tires, but that's crazy hard. If you fully rebuild a Spridget front suspension in the normal fashion and grease it regularly, it will last a long time, especially with typical use of these car today.
 
Thanks for all the responses so far. My goal is a simpler set up using the existing A arm and king pin. As you all know the fulcrum pin rotates in its threads in the A arm and lack of maintenance causes it to wear. I would like to replace the fulcrum pin with a bolt and bushing set up screwed/mounted into the A arm threads. I don't think it would matter if the bolt rotates in the A arm AND in the king pin as long as it rides on a lubed bushing. This would simplify assembly and maintenance as well as repair. I've got a few sets of A arms and will try this out with my local machine shop to see how feasible this is.
Rut
 
The problem with a bronze bushing in that load situation is pounding a thin spot into it.
 
nomad said:
I LIKE those, Gerard.
Are you a dealer or just an interested party? Seems Winners Circle or someone in the states sell's the double grease zerk but I believe those have more reinforcement as well. I've replaced the threaded sleeve's in a couple of set's and considered adding a zerk at both end's but figured that unless you plug the fulcrum pin the grease is just going to go where it want's anyway. Hope they are running a different fulcrum pin.

Kurt.
Click to expand...
Those look just like the ones I bought from VB a little while back.
 
Billy,
what kind of bushings would you recommend?
Rut
 
nomad said:
With the double grease zerk???

Kurt.
Click to expand...


Yep. I just checked, same co (stickers exact) but I don't have the extra bracing at the pin but I do have double zerks. Double zerks don't matter cause it's still gonna squirt outta the biggest gap anyway.

Rut I dunno off the top of my head. I never gave a replacement much thought before. You "could" do "branze", however; I would think the wall thickness would have to be pretty thick to keep it from being pounded out. It's hard to beat a ball joint, no pun intended.

Just off the top, if I were to re invent the front end I would probably look into strut or torsion bar. Why torsion? Cause 20 billion Volkswagens cant be wrong.:wink:
 
Rut,

Wishbones from RB Spridgets are much heavier than non RB Cars. If you've got a cracked / non repairable wishbone try for one from a RB Car. I just had a set of wishbones for Bugsy II get new new bushings brazed in by Apple Hydraulics. They came back with double grease fittings, +$10 per side along with properly aligned bushings. Turnaround normally 5 days, this time took 10. Total cost with shipping $230. The "good wishbones" from MOSS new are running last time I looked $225-$250 each. This new set of bushings, based on the mileage I put on Bugsy, properly lubed, will last longer than me.
 
Jim, I have a complete new front suspension from Peter C for my BE. What I'm investigating is a "better way" to rebuild A arms that would be simple, cost effective, and more durable. The lower fulcrum pin is a pita and from all the threads on the different forums there has to be something better than the pin rotating in the A arm threads.
Billy, I'll check with the machine shop today and see what they have in the way of bushings that will withstand this application.
Rut
 
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